If we can snag a first round pick (unprotected - increase our chance at Rose), and expiring contracts I'm for it. But I'd rather deal VC off though. And I want us to continue losing and losing. I could care less for the playoffs. I want Derrick Rose on this club more than anything. He is the future #1 PG in this league, surpassing Paul and Deron. I might be overhyping him, but he is the real deal. I don't like the idea of Harris as our PG anyways. He is a combo guard. And while I'm at it, I would trade RJ for picks, expiring deals and maybe a young player. I would then package VC with Krstic for expiring contracts and picks as well. Only way we deal VC is by including a guy like Krstic. Plus with SWAT and Boone; Krstic is now expendable. And after the Kidd deal, I'd see if Miami would bite on a Marcus/Hassell for JWilliams salary dump deal. Blow it up!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jizzy @ Feb 17 2008, 06:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>rj has plateued, he will only regress from hear on out especially without kidd, thorn would be wise to understand this and move him as well because without kidd, RJ will be exposed as a highly priced role player and his value will drop and make it worse with his crappy contract</div> RJ's contract ends the same year Lebron becomes a free agent, so does Mike Miller's and Jermaine O'neals two players we are apparently attempting to get...it doesnt take a rocket scientist to see that Management is trying to aquire young talent like Boone, Sean, Devin and Marcus and contracts that expire the same season Lebron and Dwade and many more become Free Agents. Which is also the year we are moving to Brooklyn...a major market where players get paid much more in advertisements, like 100 million more... I'm just saying.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Feb 17 2008, 06:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Feb 14 2008, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Feb 14 2008, 12:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't get it. Is there an age limit on how old players should be in the rebuilding process? 27 is too old? We should trade a 27 year old known proven scorer for parts we hope turn into that in 3 or 4 years? He's only 3 years older than Harris and Nenad. Carter I could see being mentioned but not RJ.</div> You move the pieces you can move. RJ's salary isn't conducive to rebuilding the Nets but he should be able to bring back some real value. </div> To what end? who? Elton Brand? or some other flawed All-Star? Thorn does not APPEAR to planning a complete rebuilding job. How can he? What's the marketing message next year: "Watch us rebuild for a better place!" There are economic realities at stake here. When your team is losing $20 million plus (you can find the number in the filings with the SEC) and has the heavist debt load in professional sports...as a percentage of team value...you're not going to clear out. It's easy to move JKidd and spin it: he was dogging it, faking injuries, to get out. After that, it gets a lot more difficult. </div> As I said, this is a pipe dream. The Ratner Nets are not about making the best basketball decisions. Marketing is the #1 concern. Additionally, Thorn isn't one to trade a player at their peak value.
What about Carter and Swift for Larry Hughes, Ira Newble, Devin/Shannon Brown, Boobie Gibson and a pick or two? Blow. It. Up.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Feb 17 2008, 10:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Feb 17 2008, 06:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Feb 14 2008, 12:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Feb 14 2008, 12:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't get it. Is there an age limit on how old players should be in the rebuilding process? 27 is too old? We should trade a 27 year old known proven scorer for parts we hope turn into that in 3 or 4 years? He's only 3 years older than Harris and Nenad. Carter I could see being mentioned but not RJ.</div> You move the pieces you can move. RJ's salary isn't conducive to rebuilding the Nets but he should be able to bring back some real value. </div> To what end? who? Elton Brand? or some other flawed All-Star? Thorn does not APPEAR to planning a complete rebuilding job. How can he? What's the marketing message next year: "Watch us rebuild for a better place!" There are economic realities at stake here. When your team is losing $20 million plus (you can find the number in the filings with the SEC) and has the heavist debt load in professional sports...as a percentage of team value...you're not going to clear out. It's easy to move JKidd and spin it: he was dogging it, faking injuries, to get out. After that, it gets a lot more difficult. </div> As I said, this is a pipe dream. The Ratner Nets are not about making the best basketball decisions. Marketing is the #1 concern. Additionally, Thorn isn't one to trade a player at their peak value. </div> Realistically, most fans require some continuity to continue to root for a team. Not everyone roots solely for the laundry. Trading RJ and/or Carter would present a problem with retaining those fans. The players with the longest service would be free-agent-to-be Boki (who may be gone by the end of the week), followed by Boone and Marcus! To a GM, that has to be a consideration. edit: I guess the Net with the most service time would be KVH, definitionally.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Feb 14 2008, 01:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Feb 14 2008, 12:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GM3 @ Feb 14 2008, 12:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Feb 14 2008, 12:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't get it. Is there an age limit on how old players should be in the rebuilding process? 27 is too old? We should trade a 27 year old known proven scorer for parts we hope turn into that in 3 or 4 years? He's only 3 years older than Harris and Nenad. Carter I could see being mentioned but not RJ.</div> I rather trade Carter too but RJ would get the most back, plus hes overpaid too. </div> Get back what? young pieces you hope develop into 23ppg scorers? You have that and he's only 27. I think it will frustrate the hell out of the players like Nenad and Harris if they have to hand hold youngsters. They aren't developed enough themselves to do that. Players like Lebron, Roy, Paul and Wade that are advanced beyond their years don't fall into every teams lap. Orlando is young and near the end of their rebuilding and they have Lewis and Turkoglu who are 1 year older than Jefferson. If it's because you think he's overpaid... I get that argument, but you need some player to help players like Sean, Nenad and the others. I kind of hope the one thing that helps this team is RJ instilling the intensity and will to win that Kidd brought to this franchise. It's a torch I think needs to be passed. </div> I'm certainly not convinced that RJ will remain a 23 PPG scorer over the next few seasons nor am I convinced that he'll remain healthy. That is why I am suggesting trading him now. I realize this is a pipe dream as Thorn has demonstrated no interest in trading players at their peak value and then there are the marketing considerations. </div> Why is RJ more likely to be injured than other guys? While I agree he's overpaid, I'm not sure it matters that much with respect to rebuilding. 1. Even without Kidd, from what I understand I don't think the Nets would be much below the cap anyway, so trading RJeff doesn't really help get them anything additional. 2. Even if they did, would what they get back be better in the long run than him? I tend to think having some stability moving forward would be more beneficial than a complete clearing of the decks (which won't happen anyway). I'd certainly move him if the offer was good enough, but I wouldn't count on a great offer either. On the other hand, I'd take even moderate savings to be rid of Carter were I the Nets. Or perhaps they take a chance on swapping him for a guy like Randolph, who, while a total clown, isn't a completely washed up total clown.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Feb 18 2008, 11:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>RJ and DA to Golden State for Monta Ellis, Al Harrington and Brandan Wright.</div> Why on earth would Golden State do that? They ship out the best player in the trade and the two players much better than DA
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MikeDC @ Feb 18 2008, 10:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Why is RJ more likely to be injured than other guys? While I agree he's overpaid, I'm not sure it matters that much with respect to rebuilding. 1. Even without Kidd, from what I understand I don't think the Nets would be much below the cap anyway, so trading RJeff doesn't really help get them anything additional. 2. Even if they did, would what they get back be better in the long run than him? I tend to think having some stability moving forward would be more beneficial than a complete clearing of the decks (which won't happen anyway). I'd certainly move him if the offer was good enough, but I wouldn't count on a great offer either. On the other hand, I'd take even moderate savings to be rid of Carter were I the Nets. Or perhaps they take a chance on swapping him for a guy like Randolph, who, while a total clown, isn't a completely washed up total clown.</div> I can't take anyone seriously that suggests swapping Vince for Zach
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/trad...p;te=&cash= The Nets would also get back, Sacramento's 1st rounder.
I think we should be looking to trade RJ not VC. I never thought I would say that, but I am. RJ probably has plateued (sp?) while VC's value is at a low right now. It's the simple idea of buy low, sell high. RJ will only get worse with no Kidd. We could get some decent pieces from some teams such as Portland who can offer Raef, Outlaw, Jack, 1st, Koepenan, a few of their billion 2nds for RJ and Hassel or something to that effect. What's your guys opinions?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Boki3 @ Feb 20 2008, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think we should be looking to trade RJ not VC. I never thought I would say that, but I am. RJ probably has plateued (sp?) while VC's value is at a low right now. It's the simple idea of buy low, sell high. RJ will only get worse with no Kidd. We could get some decent pieces from some teams such as Portland who can offer Raef, Outlaw, Jack, 1st, Koepenan, a few of their billion 2nds for RJ and Hassel or something to that effect. What's your guys opinions?</div> You make a valid point as far as value. However, I'm not sure that Vince's value will ever increase. So the Nets should cut their losses now. I also think that RJ will still get better. In the past, yes, a lot of his success has been based on Jason Kidd. However, in the past 3 years, as the Nets have become less and less of a running team and less and less of a Princeton offense team, the RJ Kidd connection has weakend. RJ has been able to create more and more of his own offense, especially this year, with Kidd's head not as into it and Carter settling and being unaggressive.
How many times have we talked about this here? This would be awesome, and that Portland trade would be ideal. I would definitely be an extremely happy Nets fan if this happened (I'm feeling deja vu typing all of this). Trading RJ now would be ideal. Unfortunately, I'm not sure Thorn is that smart. Then again, we do have Kiki now. Think Kiki will figure it out, and get something done?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 20 2008, 04:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>How many times have we talked about this here? This would be awesome, and that Portland trade would be ideal. I would definitely be an extremely happy Nets fan if this happened (I'm feeling deja vu typing all of this). Trading RJ now would be ideal. Unfortunately, I'm not sure Thorn is that smart. Then again, we do have Kiki now. Think Kiki will figure it out, and get something done?</div> Nothing gets done til the offseason with RJ...Vince maybe... probably nothing happening though.
I think it's time, otherwise in maybe by next year, as a lot of you have put it, he's putting up 15-3-3, market value is lower. I mean if you look at the Kings, KMart-Udrih-Miller-Moore, Hawes, Salmons, Garcia, they have a combo of young and old quality players, Maloofs are the types to gamble, I'd do it, get that lotto pick from them. Then when VC's blowing up the league, you can move him next year from something decent.
