In a tradition started by his father, Hank Steinbrenner has managed to undermine his manager and his general manager while turning the leagues most dominate set up guy(maybe Marmol withstanding) into a poor starting pitcher....after 2 starts, Joba Chaimberlin hasnt even come close to a quality start and even if he eventually does, the Yankees lost thier bridge to 9th inning in the process....why cant the Steinbrenners just hire good baseball people(which they have) and then let them steer the ship? an MLB season is a marathon, not a sprint and changing things up every bad mile will lead to disaster....
I think it was a stupid move, too, but I think you're jumping the gun. With the pitch count limit it was pretty much already assured that he wouldn't be having quality starts from the get go.
80 pitches is enough to get through 6 innings for most starters if they are pitching well and 6 or more innings with 3 or few runs surrendered is a quality start....he pitched much better when he was coming in for an important inning....we will see as his pitch count increases I guess, but at best, the decision fixes one area at the expense of another and that makes no sense when you consider there is a risk to moving him and changing his role in the middle of a season....
If you tell the other team he only has 75 pitches, it's not hard for them to take a bunch and wait him out. No pitcher can be successful in that situation. Of course the Yankees should have converted him in the off-season. What they are doing now is just idiotic.
I don't know what to think about this move so far. It's certainly a work in progress, though I think it's something that should have been done. He's got to be a starter in my opinion. Our rotation isn't good enough to keep him in the pen, especially with injuries to Hughes and Kennedy, neither of which were pitching worth a damn anyways. Also doesn't help that Wang has been trash his last three starts as well. In the end, as much as I liked him a our set up guy, this move had to be done. Our rotation has been hurt and inconsistent. Plus, what's the point of keeping him a set up guy when, on far too frequent of occasions, we weren't even able to use him, and he's one of our best arms. Plus, the move seems to be working out team-wise. We're 4-1 in our last five since he was bumped to a starter.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Moo2K4 @ Jun 9 2008, 01:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't know what to think about this move so far. It's certainly a work in progress, though I think it's something that should have been done. He's got to be a starter in my opinion. Our rotation isn't good enough to keep him in the pen, especially with injuries to Hughes and Kennedy, neither of which were pitching worth a damn anyways. Also doesn't help that Wang has been trash his last three starts as well. In the end, as much as I liked him a our set up guy, this move had to be done. Our rotation has been hurt and inconsistent. Plus, what's the point of keeping him a set up guy when, on far too frequent of occasions, we weren't even able to use him, and he's one of our best arms. Plus, the move seems to be working out team-wise. We're 4-1 in our last five since he was bumped to a starter.</div> I don't know how you can use your record to justify the transition for Joba. A starting pitchers takes the mound once every 5 games? That means Joba didn't touch a ball for 4 of your victories?
I'm not using it to justify the transtion, cause I'm against it. If they were going to do it, do it in the offseason, not in midseason. I'm just saying that maybe it injected a little more life in the Yankees. Maybe it's coincidence, but they have played better since he went to the starting rotation.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TheBeef @ Jun 9 2008, 01:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>and didnt the loss occur because of a lead blown in the 8th inning?</div> You could very well be right, because I do recall losing a game because Edwar Ramirez blew a lead in the 8th. But hey it happens. And again, I'm against this move, I just don't find the point in being critical. It's not going to get him back in the pen, so I might as well be optimistic since things are going pretty well since the transition. Again, could very well be coincidence, but as long as we keep winning, I won't care.
I think he should definitely be a starter, but this is the most amateurish, ridiculous way of going about that I can imagine.
People keep saying how great it is that Joba can have a bigger impact, and all I can think is this- You're taking Ian Kennedy completely off the team, and giving Kyle Farnsworth and Latroy Hawkins a VERY important role on a team expected to compete for the World Series. The entire offseason we kept hearing how great it was to see these young kids taking over. Now the Yankees understand what every other team goes through when they lose a pitcher (often times to the Yankees) b/c they can't afford him.
Horrible move. Should have been done in the offseason, this one or next. That being said, he is a starter and has been his whole career. Putting him in as the 8th inning man was fine last year. And then that should have been the end of it. The Yankees stopped treating him like a born-and-bred starter. They treated him differently from other young pitchers, so none would turn out to be the next Francisco Liriano (main reason he started in the BP. To limit his season IP). There was a simple way to limit pitch count. 6 man rotation. That's it, that's all. Wang-Moose-Andy-Hughes-Joba-Kennedy. Sure, Moose and Andy would bitch, but they'd get used to it. As for the BP, I believe we have a great foundation. We have some sick kids coming up, and through the draft and international signings, and some slick trades, we keep getting stronger. I firmly believe, if he ever gets healthy (TJ), Humberto Sanchez (who reminds me of Joba), could be a fantastic closer. Jose Veras and Edwar both have monster stuff just need to gain consistency, and they can be solid setup men. Who knows, when Betances comes up and if he figures it out, we could have a homegrown Rotation of Wang, Hughes, Joba, Betances, Kennedy (in that order. That leaves a rotation with no lefties, however). The Yankees could use their funds to sign relievers. We still have more young pitchers in Alan Horne, Andrew Brackman, and the kid we drafted in the first round, Gerrit Cole. Some of those could be moved to the BP, or traded for relievers. This is a rebuilding year. No two ways about it. I want to win, but we can't, this year. Just like the Sox in '06. Where did that get them? 2007 World Series. Posada may not want to admit it. Stein may not want to admit it. Derek Jeter may not want to admit it. But if Cashman gets extended (god, please let him get extended), we're in it for the long haul. Our future is bright, especially the pitching aspect. Joba is a starter. They shouldn't have fucked around with him by keeping him in the BP another season. 6 man rotation. Andy and/or Moose are gone next year. Expecting quality from Joba in his first two starts is ridiculous. Hitters were obviously trying to make him throw many pitches (which is why I wish Girardi and Cashman never said anything about pitch count. I'd rather be in the mist than letting the other team be in the know). He should have been sent down, to get full games. But what's done is done. Joba is a starter, and will be a very good one at that.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Charles @ Jun 9 2008, 05:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>People keep saying how great it is that Joba can have a bigger impact, and all I can think is this- You're taking Ian Kennedy completely off the team, and giving Kyle Farnsworth and Latroy Hawkins a VERY important role on a team expected to compete for the World Series. The entire offseason we kept hearing how great it was to see these young kids taking over. Now the Yankees understand what every other team goes through when they lose a pitcher (often times to the Yankees) b/c they can't afford him.</div> They hardly took Kennedy off the team. He's hurt as it is, and even before than, he'd been pitching horrible. He had one good outing so far this season. Also keep in mind that Hughes is also hurt. I think with those two going down, Joba had to be a starter. One other guy that no one seems to be mentioning though is Darrell Rasner. The kid has been dynamite since being put in the rotation this year. If we could get him some run support now...
Joba Chamberlain 6inn 6h 1er 4bb 2k 88pitches - Finally a quality start, may have been able to get through 7 without artificial pitch count limits....he still has to get those walks down though, or it will lead to trouble....
If you look at his minor league numbers, and his relief numbers, you'll see that walks really won't be a problem. Keep in mind, he's getting a rookie strike zone. Great job by the pen yesterday. Veras and Farnsworth looked terrific.
