this guy is just another nachbar. where does he fit on this team??? i would draft him and package him along with some other peices and try and make a serious move. that video showed me nothing special at all!!!!! terrible defense being played and his play wasnt that great or aggressive. he actually reminded me of kvh early years. i am wary of kiki's draft choices though. he loves euros! remember he wanted darko instead of carmelo!!!
I love how people always rag on the competition that European prospects play against ("Oh that's just against Italian defenders, he'll never be able to do that in the NBA!"). Where does that criticism go when we evaluate college prospects? The fact is that, this is a risk you take with every single player you draft: can they translate their skills to the NBA level? If anything, most of these European prospects have a better chance because they play against much tougher competition.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chutney @ Jun 18 2008, 08:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I love how people always rag on the competition that European prospects play against ("Oh that's just against Italian defenders, he'll never be able to do that in the NBA!"). Where does that criticism go when we evaluate college prospects? The fact is that, this is a risk you take with every single player you draft: can they translate their skills to the NBA level? If anything, most of these European prospects have a better chance because they play against much tougher competition.</div> Some college teams rely heavily on defense because they all don't have the star athletes. A lot of college coaches know defense wins games so I wouldn't necessarily say the Europeans play against better competition just because they get paid as "professioinals". Not knocking all Euro players or teams, just stating that because they are paid it doesn't meant they must face better competition.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobimel @ Jun 18 2008, 06:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 02:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 02:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What's with people popping boners over athleticism? The most athletic player in the draft 2006, James White....remember him? The guy who can jump from the free throw line, and do windmills and through the legs. Remember what happened to him? Got drafted at 31, got a couple chances with teams...but is now out of the league. So what the hell is so great about that athleticism?</div> Kobe Bryant is also athletic -- the truth lies somewhere in between. </div> Athleticism doesn't make you a star player. It's a good trait to have in basketball, that's all. Non-athleticism doesn't make you a bust. It's a disadvantage but not a major one by any means, if you have the skills to make up for it. </div>Athleticism is a tool like anything else. Not having it limits your upside. I think Gallinari can play in this league but not as a top player, so I’d rather go elsewhere at 10.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 11:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobimel @ Jun 18 2008, 06:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 02:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 02:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What's with people popping boners over athleticism? The most athletic player in the draft 2006, James White....remember him? The guy who can jump from the free throw line, and do windmills and through the legs. Remember what happened to him? Got drafted at 31, got a couple chances with teams...but is now out of the league. So what the hell is so great about that athleticism?</div> Kobe Bryant is also athletic -- the truth lies somewhere in between. </div> Athleticism doesn't make you a star player. It's a good trait to have in basketball, that's all. Non-athleticism doesn't make you a bust. It's a disadvantage but not a major one by any means, if you have the skills to make up for it. </div>Athleticism is a tool like anything else. Not having it limits your upside. I think Gallinari can play in this league but not as a top player, so I’d rather go elsewhere at 10. </div> Maybe that's where a lot of our opinions differ. You're looking for that next star. In my opinion getting a star has a lot more to do with luck than skill. I would be perfectly content if Gallinari turned into a solid career backup SF who can play well for 20 mins. My expectations are lower. I just don't want to get a bust.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jun 18 2008, 09:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chutney @ Jun 18 2008, 08:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I love how people always rag on the competition that European prospects play against ("Oh that's just against Italian defenders, he'll never be able to do that in the NBA!"). Where does that criticism go when we evaluate college prospects? The fact is that, this is a risk you take with every single player you draft: can they translate their skills to the NBA level? If anything, most of these European prospects have a better chance because they play against much tougher competition.</div> Some college teams rely heavily on defense because they all don't have the star athletes. A lot of college coaches know defense wins games so I wouldn't necessarily say the Europeans play against better competition just because they get paid as "professioinals". Not knocking all Euro players or teams, just stating that because they are paid it doesn't meant they must face better competition. </div> Well the talent level is usually much better in the Euroleagues than in the NCAA. When prospects are able to play well in that setting, I find it to be more impressive than some player racking up stats against players that mostly have no basketball future. I mean, aside from the true stars that'll be in the NBA, the rest of the really good college players will find themselves playing in Europe anyways. That's basically what I was referring to. There seems to be this notion that the accomplishments of European prospects are less significant because they play against shitty Europeans.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Jun 18 2008, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I guess no one wants to draft Deandre Jordan because he's black.</div> I love black people! Especially your mom, she's so cool. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chutney @ Jun 18 2008, 03:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Well the talent level is usually much better in the Euroleagues than in the NCAA. When prospects are able to play well in that setting, I find it to be more impressive than some player racking up stats against players that mostly have no basketball future. I mean, aside from the true stars that'll be in the NBA, the rest of the really good college players will find themselves playing in Europe anyways. That's basically what I was referring to. There seems to be this notion that the accomplishments of European prospects are less significant because they play against shitty Europeans.</div> I agree. Young Euros usually have to face older, smarter, better, and pretty much more experienced competition than in the NCAA. You find a young Euro who can thrive with those conditions....he's at least got a chance in the NBA of making some noise.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 05:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kid Chocolate @ Jun 18 2008, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I guess no one wants to draft Deandre Jordan because he's black.</div> I love black people! Especially your mom, she's so cool. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chutney @ Jun 18 2008, 03:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Well the talent level is usually much better in the Euroleagues than in the NCAA. When prospects are able to play well in that setting, I find it to be more impressive than some player racking up stats against players that mostly have no basketball future. I mean, aside from the true stars that'll be in the NBA, the rest of the really good college players will find themselves playing in Europe anyways. That's basically what I was referring to. There seems to be this notion that the accomplishments of European prospects are less significant because they play against shitty Europeans.</div> I agree. Young Euros usually have to face older, smarter, better, and pretty much more experienced competition than in the NCAA. You find a young Euro who can thrive with those conditions....he's at least got a chance in the NBA of making some noise. </div>but not better defenders.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 06:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I agree. Young Euros usually have to face older, smarter, better, and pretty much more experienced competition than in the NCAA. You find a young Euro who can thrive with those conditions....he's at least got a chance in the NBA of making some noise.</div> Have you ever watched any euroleague games? Even highlights? I haven't watched a ton of games, but i've seen some. There's a lot of bad defense being played over there. It's just not something that the coaches emphasize. Look at D'Antoni as an example.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jun 18 2008, 07:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 06:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I agree. Young Euros usually have to face older, smarter, better, and pretty much more experienced competition than in the NCAA. You find a young Euro who can thrive with those conditions....he's at least got a chance in the NBA of making some noise.</div> Have you ever watched any euroleague games? Even highlights? I haven't watched a ton of games, but i've seen some. There's a lot of bad defense being played over there. It's just not something that the coaches emphasize. Look at D'Antoni as an example. </div> Yep, by the same token, if someone is lauded as a good defender in Europe, I would be more likely to believe their defensive skills would translate to the NBA.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jun 18 2008, 08:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Jun 18 2008, 06:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I agree. Young Euros usually have to face older, smarter, better, and pretty much more experienced competition than in the NCAA. You find a young Euro who can thrive with those conditions....he's at least got a chance in the NBA of making some noise.</div> Have you ever watched any euroleague games? Even highlights? I haven't watched a ton of games, but i've seen some. There's a lot of bad defense being played over there. It's just not something that the coaches emphasize. Look at D'Antoni as an example. </div> There's a lot of bad defense being played in the US, too. You're underrating European teams. They play very good team defense. Just because everyone on the team doesn't play top-notch Bruce Bowen defense, doesn't mean they don't know how to stop a team from scoring.
I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...</div> No one said that. Italian defense is inferior, though. And he will not be able to pull of those weak moves in the league.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...</div> No one said that. Italian defense is inferior, though. And he will not be able to pull of those weak moves in the league. </div> Neither one is comparable to the NBA, so personally I think it's a moot point.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...</div> No one said that. Italian defense is inferior, though. And he will not be able to pull of those weak moves in the league. </div> Neither one is comparable to the NBA, so personally I think it's a moot point. </div> NCAA > Italian by far
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...</div> No one said that. Italian defense is inferior, though. And he will not be able to pull of those weak moves in the league. </div> Neither one is comparable to the NBA, so personally I think it's a moot point. </div> NCAA > Italian by far </div> o rly?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (meltz1 @ Jun 18 2008, 09:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrooklynBound @ Jun 18 2008, 09:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Jun 18 2008, 08:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think eventually you have to realize that not every player in the NCAA plays NBA-caliber defense...</div> No one said that. Italian defense is inferior, though. And he will not be able to pull of those weak moves in the league. </div> Neither one is comparable to the NBA, so personally I think it's a moot point. </div> NCAA > Italian by far </div> o rly? </div> Ok, you're right. Italian defense is superior. Sure.
Italian leagues aren't all Italian players. There's probably quite a few names that you'd recognize as college stars a couple years back.
