East Coach Bias makes some interesting points...about Lopez and CDR not having the requisite quickness for the NBA and how the Bucks fleeced the Nets. http://theeastcoastbias.wordpress.com/2008...nba-draft-2008/ I find this both refreshing (players don't drop because they're really good) and depressing (it confirms my worst fears).
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jun 29 2008, 01:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Some random blogger confirms your worst fears?</div> Tell me, do you think CDR dropped because people forgot he was still on the board? And how does the best center in the Draft drop from #3 or #4 to #10? There are flaws in their games. (Boston Herald reporting tomorrow that Celts passed on him because of his horrible defense.) He ain't random, either. He has a good reputation. Here's what will happen...again. The Nets will pump the shit out of these guys at the presser. Then, Frank wont play them initially because they are all bad on defense. Lopez is okay, but he ain't NBA-ready. Frank will then take the brunt of the criticism. Same ol, same ol. Nets got great draft grades in 2005 for a draft that was a total disaster. Wright dropped from a consensus #12 to #15, in part because big men were surprisingly picked early, but also because he isnt that athletic. I actually think Thursday was not a good night for the franchise. I think they are going cheap (they have to) but selling it as something else: a way to conserve cap space for Lebron. Acquiring Yi was a way to make money for Brooklyn, not a way to improve the team, at least in the short run.
Wasnt Monta Ellis taken at 40 as well? GM's are wrong all the time Even TONY ROMO himself went undrafted, doesnt mean anything Although Ill always wonder what could of been w/ Bayless. He reminds me of Monta. And hes already said hes got a chip on his shoulder.....
I've pretty much agreed with a lot of that blog. Bucks did fleece us (I still hate that RJ trade). While I love getting Yi, I hate that we had to lose RJ for it. About the draft, I think we did decent. If we couldn't get Danilo, I was hoping we could deal the #10. Lopez isn't better then Boone or Krstic. Will we regret passing on Bayless for him? Possibly. I love the CDR pick because at least it's a cheap risk if he doesn't pan out. Ryan Anderson, meh. I'm not happy we passed on Arthur for him. That is for sure, going to bite us in the ass. Mostly, I am not sure we will ever get LBJ and I hate the idea we're pissing away the next 2 seasons in the hopes of winning the Free Agent lottery that summer of 2010. It didn't work for Chicago and we don't have the weather Orlando (2000) boasts
Lopez is better than them. He has an offensive game, Boone does not. And he plays solid-ish defense, Krstic does not. We didnt get a stud, hes not Dwight Howard. But he should be a solid center for years. Ive said about on the level of Ilguaskas. Im still not sure about Anderson, if we wanted a shooter, why not Lee, a shooter at an actual position of need. Unless we trade Sean for Bellineli, which would then make some sense of things.
I think CDR dropped because what he is good at doesn't translate to the format of the workouts and his measurables were weak across the board. The guy is a great basketball player. Lopez was taken because he fills a need for the Nets. I'm no fan of his, but they really need someone who can score down low and Lopez can do that on day one. Just that one skill will have a big effect on the team, and Frank knows how to use him to full advantage. The other parts of his game will take time to develop. He is physically ready for the NBA at 20, though, so it might not be that long until things come around. The media and the casual fan thinks Milwaukee "fleeced" the Nets, but people who had to endure watching RJ play every minute of last season are wondering how the Nets got a #6 overall pick and the requisite cap relief they sought for him. His attitude was hurting the team and it was time for him to move on. I also happen to think Yi is a good prospect, and do not understand what he did last year to dispel that. He played very well for 25 games, then got tired and eventually injured. He was a skinny 19-year-old. It's not going to be instant superstardom for him. To tell you the truth, what I saw, I thought was terrific. He was much, much better than I expected. And that's just his benefit on the court, which is obviously not all he brings to the table.
http://www.sportingnews.com/yourturn/viewtopic.php?t=428492 Draft Grades: D New Jersey Nets. Is it a requirement for the Nets to have twins on their team? After finally moving the limited Jason Collins they draft Stanford twin Brook Lopez. After trading away Richard Jefferson, that's not good news. They're giving up for now with Lopez and Ryan Anderson, taken later in the first, and Yi Jianlian, acquired in the Jefferson trade. So much for the Nenad Krstic era. The contest becomes them against the Knicks to build the team that most will appeal to LeBron James in the summer of 2010. You had to laugh at "analyst" Mark Jackson, who happens to work for the Nets, applauding their draft. What a mess they've become. -Sam Smith
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jun 29 2008, 03:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think CDR dropped because what he is good at doesn't translate to the format of the workouts and his measurables were weak across the board. The guy is a great basketball player. Lopez was taken because he fills a need for the Nets. I'm no fan of his, but they really need someone who can score down low and Lopez can do that on day one. Just that one skill will have a big effect on the team, and Frank knows how to use him to full advantage. The other parts of his game will take time to develop. He is physically ready for the NBA at 20, though, so it might not be that long until things come around.</div> The issue with a lack of athleticism tends to come at the defensive end of the floor. Both these guys should be smart, efficient scorers, but both of them might not be quick enough to guard players on the other end. We acquired four major prospects the other night: Yi, Lopez, Anderson and CDR. Are any of them going to be even average defenders on an NBA level?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Jun 29 2008, 03:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jun 29 2008, 03:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think CDR dropped because what he is good at doesn't translate to the format of the workouts and his measurables were weak across the board. The guy is a great basketball player. Lopez was taken because he fills a need for the Nets. I'm no fan of his, but they really need someone who can score down low and Lopez can do that on day one. Just that one skill will have a big effect on the team, and Frank knows how to use him to full advantage. The other parts of his game will take time to develop. He is physically ready for the NBA at 20, though, so it might not be that long until things come around.</div> The issue with a lack of athleticism tends to come at the defensive end of the floor. Both these guys should be smart, efficient scorers, but both of them might not be quick enough to guard players on the other end. We acquired four major prospects the other night: Yi, Lopez, Anderson and CDR. Are any of them going to be even average defenders on an NBA level? </div> The lack of defense is an issue. Also, FYI, so is Yi's age. His passport says he is 20 but logic dictates he is more likely 23. Chinese have a verified history of faking kids ages so they can win international youth competitions. To accept that Yi is only 20 means you also have to accept that he was the Chinese Basketball Association ROY at age 15.
Better news if hes 22-25, like I believe he is We have enough kids One thing I will miss about Kidd was getting the best out of people. I wonder what he could of done for Yi, since hes such a unique prospect
we'll see. I thought the Nets could get a package like OUtlaw plus the #13 plus crap from Portland for RJ. Even if it was a pick a few years down the road, instead of this year. Is last year's #6 pick worth a late lottery plus a former 20-something pick who is a decent rotation player? Was the RJ deal comparable to the Ray Allen deal last year, or did they do a little better? I guess THAT depends on Simmons, who I don't know much about. As far as the draft goes . . . we're going to have to trust the Nets' scouting on Ryan Anderson. As for CDR, typically only one or at most two second-round picks EVER become solid rotation players--forget about the Michael Redd and Gil Arenas stardom for a minute--and he has as good a chance as anyone taken in that round this year. THe only second-round pick the Nets have drafted this decade who has done anything has been Scalabrine, and I don't consider him a "solid rotational player." If he doesn't work out, whatever. I'm MUCH happier with CDR than some Eurostash, who we'll never see again. I don't care WHY he fell, so long as he isn't a cross-dressing crack-smoking class failing horse thief. Then there's Lopez. Well, we knew that there was a consensus top-ten in the draft, and the Nets were selecting tenth. As expected, they had a choice of two because Charlotte did something unexpected (I thought it would be Darrell Arthur, to tell the truth). So, the choice was Lopez vs. Bayless. Nothing else matters. Did they choose right? We'll find out. Few of us really like Lopez--and I hope he isn't as much of an idiot as he sounds. Defense . . . we'll see. They rid themselves of RJ; Boki will be gone; the remaining defensive "holes" on the team will be Krstic (who may also be gone), Marcus, and Swift. Will Ryan Anderson, Lopez, and CDR be as bad as those guys? Yes, the Nets are in full let's-be-thrifty-and-trick-the fans mode. Everyone thought they'd be bad seven years ago, also, with a bevy of rookies and role players. Let's see. There will be another deal or two, possibly a sign and trade for a wing. They're beter than they were when they tore apart their core four or so years ago.
honestly, i didnt like our draft either. i was sure we'd pick up bayless and was shocked when we took lopez. right now, i wish we had known arthur was going to be there at 21 so we could have drafted bayless at 10. i have no idea about ryan anderson, part of me thinks he can be good but sometimes i fear he'll become scott padget or steve novak. lopez, i just dont kno. im torn between him. cdr was excellent value as a second rounder
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Jun 29 2008, 01:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>East Coach Bias makes some interesting points...about Lopez and CDR not having the requisite quickness for the NBA and how the Bucks fleeced the Nets. http://theeastcoastbias.wordpress.com/2008...nba-draft-2008/ I find this both refreshing (players don't drop because they're really good) and depressing (it confirms my worst fears).</div> Ok...where to start without trying to sound like a complete homer..... This guy obviously didn't watch the Nets for any of the last 2 seasons. Krstic? are you kidding me? When was the last time he was healthy? Your willing to put all your chips on a guy whos barely played in two seasons and hasn't been able to hit a shot since Kidd left? Yea, i know Kidd's on the decline but the reality is that Kidd makes big men. Plus he's got to be one of the softest centers i've ever seen, just bad def. all around. Listen i'm not saying Brook Lopez is gonna be the come all end all for us but i don't think he's going to bust either. But to say that our big men had a better game last year is completely rediculous. Krstic hasn't been close to old form, he's slow, and soft. Josh Boone (who i do like) is a good big to have coming in off the bench, he'll get you a double double by cleaning up but you cant actually dump the ball to him down low, and Swat needs to develope and put on weight before he can even be in this conversation. (Swat is my fav. player on the Nets by the way lol) Time will only tell how Lopez does. As for the RJ trade, yea, no shit RJ is the better player by far. But we'r mediocre at best and change is needed. I think THorn and Kiki are doing it right. If your going to rebuild, you completely blow it up, you dont only go halfway. Again i can't say if Yi is going to be good or not but at least we have room to make moves now.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Jun 29 2008, 07:40 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Jun 29 2008, 03:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jun 29 2008, 03:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think CDR dropped because what he is good at doesn't translate to the format of the workouts and his measurables were weak across the board. The guy is a great basketball player. Lopez was taken because he fills a need for the Nets. I'm no fan of his, but they really need someone who can score down low and Lopez can do that on day one. Just that one skill will have a big effect on the team, and Frank knows how to use him to full advantage. The other parts of his game will take time to develop. He is physically ready for the NBA at 20, though, so it might not be that long until things come around.</div> The issue with a lack of athleticism tends to come at the defensive end of the floor. Both these guys should be smart, efficient scorers, but both of them might not be quick enough to guard players on the other end. We acquired four major prospects the other night: Yi, Lopez, Anderson and CDR. Are any of them going to be even average defenders on an NBA level? </div> The lack of defense is an issue. Also, FYI, so is Yi's age. His passport says he is 20 but logic dictates he is more likely 23. Chinese have a verified history of faking kids ages so they can win international youth competitions. To accept that Yi is only 20 means you also have to accept that he was the Chinese Basketball Association ROY at age 15. </div> His body looks 20. The defense is an issue, but all four players have a chance to be decent to good defenders. CDR was an above average defender in college. He has good height and he will fill out eventually. He's not a stopper, but I'm not too concerned with him because of his superior anticipation and work ethic. He won't let himself be a bad defender. Anderson was a good defender in college. He seems like he would struggle in the pros because he isn't particularly quick or nimble. He will have to guard PF to start, which could be tough for him. Yi just needs more upper body strength. He is very quick, coordinated and athletic and is a matchup nightmare. He's got the most potential on the defensive end. Lopez is a bit of a stiff defensively, one more reason not to draft him. His twin is a good shot blocker, so maybe there's hope for him. He was taken to score inside and the Nets are crossing their fingers about the rest. Remember one thing about CDR and Anderson, these guys are tough competitors and play hard all the time. They will learn how to be effective and overcome some of their physical limitations. Is Jason Collins physically equipped to be a good NBA defender? Competive players find a way to get stops. At the very least the team defense will improve simply because they will listen to the coach and communicate with each other.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Jun 29 2008, 01:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>East Coach Bias makes some interesting points...about Lopez and CDR not having the requisite quickness for the NBA and how the Bucks fleeced the Nets. http://theeastcoastbias.wordpress.com/2008...nba-draft-2008/ I find this both refreshing (players don't drop because they're really good) and depressing (it confirms my worst fears).</div> This has been the best offseason for the Nets in years. Not necessarily for who they are bringing in, but rather for the fact the organization has finally came to terms with that they were no better than mediocre. Could the Nets have gotten more for RJ? It possible, but a cap space and a year old lottery pick isn't bad. This years draft was pretty much Lopez or Bayless, so we will have to watch the career of those two. I do not understand any complaints about CDR. He was the 40th pick, so the pick...regardless of player...was a crap shoot.
Winning in the NBA is about 1 thing - superstars (top 10 players in the league). 99% of NBA transactions are simply re-arranging the pawns on a chess board - and this trade, and draft, definitely falls into that category. With the trade it is not hard to tell that on the basketball court we gave up the best player involved. That much is obvious. The thing is that doesn't matter. That "best player" couldn't even help keep us at .500 last year. His play and attitude have been getting worse each year, not better, and he was expensive. Since he isn't a superstar, and we have no way of getting another superstar, keeping RJ is like paying $15 million dollars to rent a studio apartment in mediocreville. The reason we made this trade is the same reason we HAD to trade Jason Kidd. To me this whole argument is really simple. Knowing that without trading RJ we had almost no chance of securing another star player, is there anyway you could see the Nets winning a championship with him? How about a playoff series? I asked myself those same questions at the deadline with the Kidd trade and for the first time I conceded to myself that the window had simply closed on the run and gun Nets. Richard "I should have made the all star team" Jefferson is certainly not going to make me re-think that opinion. Now I would think most people would agree about the answers to those questions. This team is simply not good enough to compete for a championship, therefore it is ok for this team to make moves that might not make the team better today. Did we hit a homerun with the RJ trade? No. But just like the Kidd trade, it was a move that had to be made, and we got SOMETHING out of it. Something is always better then nothing, just ask the Grizzlies. As for the draft, arguments about it are pretty futile. Most years there aren't more then 5 really good players out of any draft. Maybe 1 or 2 of them go after the 5th pick. Obviously some years there are more and some years are less (KMarts year). To me this draft wasn't especially good or bad so I have no problem "gambling" on the guys available with the most potential, even if there are some concerns. Some people want to get negative about our picks but for my money the more I learn about them the more I like them. I think its also important to remember that we picked 10th overall, not first. Its not like we wasted some great asset. One last thing about anyone who needs some re-assurance about our picks. All 3 guys we got were highly productive players in major conferences. 2 of the 3 were among the best players in the NCAA tournament who are among the toughest players in the draft. All 3 of them are hardworking, high character people. We could have done a lot worse.
I don't really see Lopez as bust material. He doesn't have great upside, but I think at the very least he will be a solid contributor. He could be a 3rd option. And getting that at 10, particularly a center who can score, is well worth it. How many centers can actually score in this league?
