<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Why does everybody always call one player a winner? it's bullsh**. The only individual winner in NBA history was Bill Russell. Everybody else needs a halfway decent team to even start winning.Anyway, LBJ is a better player. He's just better. Wade was cool before he became the second most overrated sportsman on the planet. Give LBJ those teammates and he'll have a ring too. Some players have it better than others, that doesn't make them better.</div>Agree 100% but some people don't see it that way...........they go with the hype the media started.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Sep 26 2006, 03:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Why does everybody always call one player a winner? it's bullsh**. The only individual winner in NBA history was Bill Russell. Everybody else needs a halfway decent team to even start winning.Anyway, LBJ is a better player. He's just better. Wade was cool before he became the second most overrated sportsman on the planet. Give LBJ those teammates and he'll have a ring too. Some players have it better than others, that doesn't make them better.</div> :shok: We agree on something?
^Oh, you mean like how Kobe had the benefit of a prime Shaq, right?Wade was the leader of his team, scoring 40PPG in their 4 straight wins vs the Mavs while O'Neal was at 14PPG. He had 2 of the most memorable 4th quarters you will ever see. Aside from the Finals, he had the last 17pts including GW against Detroit in season, he did it last year vs Wizards without Shaq, if it wasn't for HIS injury they would have beat Pistons in 2005 ECF, he was amazing against NO and Indiana in his first playoff run, and he did a great job of leading Marquette to the final 4. He is a born leader and winner, he carries his team and wills them to victory, no matter who he faces or who his teammates are. LeBron doesn't have that "it" factor.His hype is deserved, and he is a natural winner. He can lead his team, play 2nd fiddle, 1st fiddle, can totally carry his team, can hit the GW, can pass so other player can get GW, can make defensive stop to win game (see game 3 of Finals)....he just is a great leader and winner, he gets job done no matter what.
I got this from media section, the one melo posted...........LinkWith this kind of referee's he should avg more imo.
Do I seriously need to post the LeBron travelling video again, where if they called that the series might have gone to 7 games? Or how about all the calls Bron gets?Wade gets a ton of calls, but nearly all of them are correct. Some he gets benefit of doubt because he is always staying agressive and going to basket, and if he sells it as if he got hit, they will give him it sometimes.
I still don't see how you can call one player out of a whole team a winner. Put Dwyane Wade on the worst team in the league and they will still suck. That doesn't mean Wade is a bad player or a bad leader, it just means that one guy can't do it alone therefore one guy shouldn't get all the credit. He had a good team around him, and those good teammates made his job a lot easier. Look at Kobe, he's the best ball player in the world and yet the Lakers aren't champions. Why is that? Because it's a team game and every great player, no matter how great they are, needs help to win. If Wilt couldn't do it alone, nobody can.You have to admit, Wade has a good place in Miami. Shaq still draws the double team, that makes it easier for Wade to do his thing. LBJ doesn't always get that, and Kobe for damn sure doesn't get that. Get my point?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Sep 27 2006, 05:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I still don't see how you can call one player out of a whole team a winner. Put Dwyane Wade on the worst team in the league and they will still suck. That doesn't mean Wade is a bad player or a bad leader, it just means that one guy can't do it alone therefore one guy shouldn't get all the credit. He had a good team around him, and those good teammates made his job a lot easier. Look at Kobe, he's the best ball player in the world and yet the Lakers aren't champions. Why is that? Because it's a team game and every great player, no matter how great they are, needs help to win. If Wilt couldn't do it alone, nobody can.You have to admit, Wade has a good place in Miami. Shaq still draws the double team, that makes it easier for Wade to do his thing. LBJ doesn't always get that, and Kobe for damn sure doesn't get that. Get my point?</div>Winning as a team takes a bit of everyone, but when I call an idividual a winner it has to do with the intangibles....leadership, coming up big in big games, clutch performances, carrying team on back when they look down and out, playing 2nd fiddle if need be, etc... Wade has shown me all of these throughout his career, and has risen to the occasion with and without Shaq when it counted. To me he is a ntural born winner, while Bron's team in 2004-2005 collpased from being in 4th place in East to 9th at season's end, and somewhat similar year before. This year he had more help and they finally got into playoffs, but he still showed signs of choking and signs of not being a cold blooded killer yet.I never said I didn't get your point, but Wade doesn't have it as good as Kobe had it for his 3 peat. Kobe played 2nd fiddle to Shaq in the 3 peat, when he tried to step up and be the man, they didn't win another one. Wade should have 2 'chips right now if not for his injury in game 5 of the ECF in 2005. He had one of the greatest Finals of all time, despite Shaq only at 14PPG and role players down in prodcution. Kobe had Shaq at around 30PPG in each finals appearence, and while he had a great series vs Sixers, the Sixers were severe underdogs and only won 1 game. Mavs had a 10pt lead with only 5min to go before being up 3-0 in the 4th in game 3, and Wade turned it on and averaged 40PPG the next few games, along with a few passing for GW, hitting game tiers/GW, and carrying his team. Kobe never got a chance to show that in his run.
LeBron James is definitely the all-around better player of the two.. he does everything. No denying Wade's skills either though.I don't know why, I'd just take Wade. Theres something about him that makes me want him on my team playing 48 minutes a game. So resiliant, so good, so clutch.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Sep 27 2006, 06:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Winning as a team takes a bit of everyone, but when I call an idividual a winner it has to do with the intangibles....leadership, coming up big in big games, clutch performances, carrying team on back when they look down and out, playing 2nd fiddle if need be, etc... Wade has shown me all of these throughout his career, and has risen to the occasion with and without Shaq when it counted. To me he is a ntural born winner, while Bron's team in 2004-2005 collpased from being in 4th place in East to 9th at season's end, and somewhat similar year before. This year he had more help and they finally got into playoffs, but he still showed signs of choking and signs of not being a cold blooded killer yet.I never said I didn't get your point, but Wade doesn't have it as good as Kobe had it for his 3 peat. Kobe played 2nd fiddle to Shaq in the 3 peat, when he tried to step up and be the man, they didn't win another one. Wade should have 2 'chips right now if not for his injury in game 5 of the ECF in 2005. He had one of the greatest Finals of all time, despite Shaq only at 14PPG and role players down in prodcution. Kobe had Shaq at around 30PPG in each finals appearence, and while he had a great series vs Sixers, the Sixers were severe underdogs and only won 1 game. Mavs had a 10pt lead with only 5min to go before being up 3-0 in the 4th in game 3, and Wade turned it on and averaged 40PPG the next few games, along with a few passing for GW, hitting game tiers/GW, and carrying his team. Kobe never got a chance to show that in his run.</div>Fair enough. And you're right that Kobe never got the chance to show his stuff. He was BIG during the 3-peat, but Shaq was the focus of everybody so KB8 just got over shadowed. Oh well.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Sep 27 2006, 12:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Do I seriously need to post the LeBron travelling video again, where if they called that the series might have gone to 7 games? Or how about all the calls Bron gets?Wade gets a ton of calls, but nearly all of them are correct. Some he gets benefit of doubt because he is always staying agressive and going to basket, and if he sells it as if he got hit, they will give him it sometimes.</div>Yeah go get that vidoe u will also see a foul.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yankshater213 @ Sep 27 2006, 08:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>LeBron James is definitely the all-around better player of the two.. he does everything. No denying Wade's skills either though.I don't know why, I'd just take Wade. Theres something about him that makes me want him on my team playing 48 minutes a game. So resiliant, so good, so clutch.</div>Part of him being good is his teammates you see Wade does not get doubled as much as James because Wade has teammates he can pass to that can drain a shot, and the other teams knwo that so they got to give him room so if a pass comes there ready.LeBron on the other hand has Hughes but he was out last season and Z was lil help Marshell was good but he didn't play as much as wanted he and DJ were having off seasons. Gooden can hit some shots but not as much as we need a PG snow can't hit a lay up!It's James hands down th eguy plays 2-3 more min and avg more points, ast, baords, ect.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Larry Hughes @ Sep 28 2006, 08:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah go get that vidoe u will also see a foul.</div>http://youtube.com/watch?v=EGiBXYJiTF8You see a foul before the travel?
He does get bumbed a lil bit there yeah but still everone gets away with a call once in a while and as u can see at the end of the vidoe d.wade get the travel sign..LMAO
LoL yeah, but what bothers me is people always complaining about the calls Wade got in the Finals (which Bron also gets in playoffs/regular season too, so that's beside the point), yet if they called that travel the series could have went to 7 games, and in a game 7 anything can happen. Then you have people calling him clutch because of it, and it just bothers me considering all Wade has done, while Bron was widely considered a choker. A travel and easy GW in game 6=clutch? I don't think so.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Sep 26 2006, 09:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'> Has a reliable 2nd option to his driving, Bron doesn't. Shoots ball at higher percentage, and doesn't take some of those fadeaway 30ftr's Bron sometimes takes. He is a bit more disciplined shooting the ball and knowing when to attack and when to cut loose a bit. And I don't expect you to agree since you have a TOTALLY different perception of what makes a better scorer.</div>Um..just for future references, Bron is a better shooter than Wade..I have all the statistics to prove it. And still..he scores more. I guess Dirk is a better scorer than Kobe because he takes those fades, too..right? I mean, who cares that Kobe averages nearly 10 more points...Nowitzki can drive it in and he doesn't take 30 ft Fades and he has a better shot! Wait let me outline the logic you're going by:Had Dwyane Wade shot more, he'd score more, but from what we've seen, we can hypothesize that he's a better scorer.Right?
The fact Wade scores as much as he does with the loaded team he has speaks alot. LeBron doesn't have many great players to pass too, therefore he takes more shots and scores more.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Heatfan32 @ Sep 28 2006, 03:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>The fact Wade scores as much as he does with the loaded team he has speaks alot. LeBron doesn't have many great players to pass too, therefore he takes more shots and scores more.</div>it still doesn't prove anything until you enter the 'What If' zone
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (His Greatness @ Sep 28 2006, 04:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Um..just for future references, Bron is a better shooter than Wade..I have all the statistics to prove it. And still..he scores more. I guess Dirk is a better scorer than Kobe because he takes those fades, too..right? I mean, who cares that Kobe averages nearly 10 more points...Nowitzki can drive it in and he doesn't take 30 ft Fades and he has a better shot! Wait let me outline the logic you're going by:Had Dwyane Wade shot more, he'd score more, but from what we've seen, we can hypothesize that he's a better scorer.Right?</div>He is a better shooter, but he doesn't consistently take the midrange when his driving ability is taken away. This could be seen in the Detroit series when he was being guarded straight up by Tayshaun Prince, he had a lot of difficulty finding a consistent jumpshot, and took some bad fadeaways from far away, whereas the majority of Wade's shots in the Conf. finals were makeable midrange jumpshots....and he shot it at a very high %. It could also be seen against the Mavericks.Kobe and Dirk play 2 very different positions and are on 2 totally different teams. Kobe is better scorer, he has proven on teams as stacked as Dirk's Mavs he can put up his numbers, and has broken countless scoring records with and without Shaq. He is also the much better all around scorer due to his athletic ability and ability to get in such a groove that Nobody on in the league can stop him. LeBron isn't a much better overall scorer than Wade, Wade shoots ball at higher %, and both have shown the ability to get red hot and take over (although Wade has done it in much more important, clutch situations). With scoring, only advantage Bron has on Wade IMO is his 3pt shooting, which is clearly better.If Wade shot more, he'd have more points, yes. He has shown with a healthy Shaq, without a healthy Shaq, and without Shaq at all that he can put up around 30PPG or more, so yes he can get the 31PPG Bron gets. I find him a better scorer only because he has a consistent 2nd option to his driving ability despite LeBron being better long range shooter.
Wade to me, is a much smarter scorer. In other words, he knows when to take what shot. That helps him keep a high FG% because he isn't always taking terrible shots.
^Agreed, that is sort of the point I am trying to make. He knows his range, doesn't take many stupid shots, and knows when to take that midrange shot and hit it. Bron is a better shooter, but not as consistent because of this. Same can be said for a player like T-Mac, whose FG % would be higher if he didn't take some of the stupid shots he does.
