Defences have figured out Devin Harris

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purplehaze89

purplehaze89

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When defences shut you down, stop forcing shit and swing the ball around. Thats the problem with having backcourt players as your top 2. They force when they shouldn't. Devin Harris forced. Like Vince did last night.
 
He can still beat anybody to the basket. You can't stop that kind of speed. Lately his basketball IQ is dropping, as well as his shooting percentage. But he is still the blurrrrr.
 
nets1 said:
He can still beat anybody to the basket. You can't stop that kind of speed. Lately his basketball IQ is dropping, as well as his shooting percentage. But he is still the blurrrrr.
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The dude is a point guard. He should realize that shooting your way back into the ballgame leads to fundamental problems.
 
true,,,,, but it was ok when the nets were winning those games and people were calling him all world and mvp and the best pg in the game. Then when he cools off he's Meburry. I think he's fast and a decent shooter. Plus i think he's adjusting to being the number one option on the team. Now if teams do figure how to stop him, he needs to rely more on his passing.

Now that being said with the emergence of Brook Lopez his passing skills will show. Its just a shame Yi can develop at the same pace. If he could you'd see Harris looking more like a point guard than a scorer. I thought he had alot of nice passes in the lane tonight to Lopez though...
 
I personally don't like how the Nets run their offense. It's too slow to set up, and a lot of the time they're just burning shot clock, only to heave a contested 3 pointer before it expires. Great defenses will chew that type of stagnant offense to pieces.

That being said, I think Harris is making a concious effort to get his teammates invovled, but once again, the Nets offense is to slow to set up, and a lot of the time Carter or Harris are caught ball holding at the 3 point line and are forced into trying to make something out of nothing.
 
or maybe teams are figuring out this dribble drive offense. It doesn't look all that complicated. Drive or kick out. If you notice the past 3 games the defense are playing the passing lanes and picking off alot of passes.
 
The Bulls ran the same offense for 4 years, so they have a pretty good idea about how to defend it.

All you have to do is stay on your man and not collapse on the guy driving.
 
purplehaze89 said:
When defences shut you down, stop forcing shit and swing the ball around. Thats the problem with having backcourt players as your top 2. They force when they shouldn't. Devin Harris forced. Like Vince did last night.
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So, I didn't see the game, but...

1) We let the Bulls score 113 points. The issue likely had more to do with defense than offense.

2) Brook Lopez had 17 points, and it sounds like a good game. Aside from him, our players at the 4 and 5 positions had a combined 5 points over 60 minutes.

With that in mind, blaming the game on the point guard seems to be a strange prospect.
 
It was the entire team's fault. Letting Chicago score 113 points is a fking joke.
They must play better defense, so that when nights like this happen, our defense is what wins the game!
 
We couldn't stop Gorden and Rose. Carter can't stop Rose, Rose was playing a good game in the 2nd half, and Ben Gordon's shooting killed the Nets.

Lopez dominated their paint, but their bench were playing better, Tyrus Thomas, Larry Hughes.
 
Carter and Harris scored 61 points last night. The Nets scored 104 points. No one figured out anything. Defense sucked. Bench sucked.

It is now conventional wisdom that teams have figured out Harris. Bullshit.
 
The Bulls had our number last night. I personally would have liked to have seen Dooling hawk Gordon and Sean get some minutes on Tyrus but who knows what kind of difference that would have made. We need Najera and Hayes back quick. Having two hustle guys like that who can stretch the floor makes Devin's job that much easier.
 
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True, they are concentrating their efforts on Devin, keeping him from getting more inside buckets. But, did you see how many fast break points he got admist three or four white shirts? He is still fast, and when teams let off on him, he'll get his. He's not as accurate as he was a couple weeks ago. What Vince meant by pick your poison is that when Devin isn't getting inside, Vince should be. He had some great moments, but he didn't finish the game like he is supposed to. Too sad to see him fade out like that. I still think they scored enough points, Devin scored enough and the problem with the loss is that they allowed too many points, especially in the last minutes of the game.
 
Dooling is playing hurt. He has a hip flexor. Hayes isn't playing.

Carter scored 39 points on 22 shots, Harris scored 22 on 18 shots, so that's 61 points on 40 shots. That's the second time in two weeks that Carter has scored 39 points in a game...this from a guy who a lot of people thought was done last year (and who some suggested was done after his performance Friday night).

There aren't any other reliable scorers on the Nets roster. That is the reality. It's a young team, filled with kids and guys whose offensive consistency has been suspect.

The power forward position produced two field goals on 17 shots. Seventeen shots should be enough at one position, dont ya think? They shoot better and the team wins. The bench in general plays better and they win.
 
ly_yng said:
So, I didn't see the game, but...

1) We let the Bulls score 113 points. The issue likely had more to do with defense than offense.

2) Brook Lopez had 17 points, and it sounds like a good game. Aside from him, our players at the 4 and 5 positions had a combined 5 points over 60 minutes.

With that in mind, blaming the game on the point guard seems to be a strange prospect.
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You missed the game so i'll let your comments slide but Harris turned over the ball in the last minute, missed 3 shots in a row on forced shots and let Derrick Rose abuse him in the 4th.
 
ScoringPG1850 said:
True, they are concentrating their efforts on Devin, keeping him from getting more inside buckets. But, did you see how many fast break points he got admist three or four white shirts? He is still fast, and when teams let off on him, he'll get his. He's not as accurate as he was a couple weeks ago. What Vince meant by pick your poison is that when Devin isn't getting inside, Vince should be. He had some great moments, but he didn't finish the game like he is supposed to. Too sad to see him fade out like that. I still think they scored enough points, Devin scored enough and the problem with the loss is that they allowed too many points, especially in the last minutes of the game.
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So you're saying Vince lost this game?

Devin shot 6 for 18 and had 4 turnovers. Two in the 4th quarter, including terrible sequences where he passedi t right to Tyrus Thomas. another sequence where he argued a call adn got T-ed up. Vince scored 10+ points in the 4th quarter. :crazy:
 
purplehaze89 said:
You missed the game so i'll let your comments slide but Harris turned over the ball in the last minute, missed 3 shots in a row on forced shots and let Derrick Rose abuse him in the 4th.
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Harris was not "abused" by Rose in the fourth. Harris did abuse Rose in the third. I saw the game and the point, once again, is that the bench sucked...let me repeat, the bench sucked. The Nets offense when the starters were on the floor was fine. The defense overall and the bench lost this game, not Devin Harris.

Are there any NETS fans here?
 
purplehaze89 said:
So you're saying Vince lost this game?

Devin shot 6 for 18 and had 4 turnovers. Two in the 4th quarter, including terrible sequences where he passedi t right to Tyrus Thomas. another sequence where he argued a call adn got T-ed up. Vince scored 10+ points in the 4th quarter. :crazy:
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Devin made some crucial mistakes, but Vince waited to long to feel the urgency. We were already down eight with less than a minute to go. As far as who lost the game, you can blame that on the lack of team defense....again.
 
The bench did suck, but I blame Frank for putting out a lineup of Boone-Ryan-Hassell-Dooling-Harris in the 2nd and 3rd quarters. He didn't call any plays to get Ryan open on the perimeter, thus rendering him useless over that span (there was one play where Boone kicked it out to him off a drive, but it clanked). Take Ryan out and the only guys who are offensively capable are Dooling and Harris: 2 on 5. No wonder we let them back in the game.
 
GMJ said:
The bench did suck, but I blame Frank for putting out a lineup of Boone-Ryan-Hassell-Dooling-Harris in the 2nd and 3rd quarters. He didn't call any plays to get Ryan open on the perimeter, thus rendering him useless over that span (there was one play where Boone kicked it out to him off a drive, but it clanked). Take Ryan out and the only guys who are offensively capable are Dooling and Harris: 2 on 5. No wonder we let them back in the game.
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You can't play Brook the whole game - similarly you can't play Simmons the whole game. What you're really pissed at is that Hayes was hurt and that Yi sucked, but that's not Frank's fault.

I suppose it would have been possible to stagger the time that Brook and Simmons were out of the game, but that's an awful lot to balance when you're doing the same thing with Vince and Harris.

http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20081213&game=NJNCHI

It is interesting that in the second half, it was pretty much the starters that couldn't put the game away. Can't really blame the second half on the bench...
 
I kinda figure that after the washington game. You can see that Devin is starting to get frustrated with the T's he's been picking up.

Derrick Rose I have to say was dayum good and impressed me.
 
During this three game period where the league has finally "figured out" Harris, he is averaging 22.7 points and 6.7 assists, shooting 44% from the floor and taking 8.3 free throws a game. Big deal.

Anyone want to lie and say they expected better than those numbers from him this year?
 
He still has stuff he hasn't tried from his bag of trixs. Besides you can't stop blinding speed. The only i figure they can stop him is to figure out a way to get him into foul trouble.
 
ly_yng said:
You can't play Brook the whole game - similarly you can't play Simmons the whole game. What you're really pissed at is that Hayes was hurt and that Yi sucked, but that's not Frank's fault.

I suppose it would have been possible to stagger the time that Brook and Simmons were out of the game, but that's an awful lot to balance when you're doing the same thing with Vince and Harris.

http://popcornmachine.net/cgi-bin/gameflow.cgi?date=20081213&game=NJNCHI

It is interesting that in the second half, it was pretty much the starters that couldn't put the game away. Can't really blame the second half on the bench...
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Jarvis Hayes being out is crucial. However the focus of my point was that no offensive set was called to take advantage of Ryan's strengths. He's not at a point where he can be called on to create his own shot; you've got to call a set play to make him an option (where was that hand-off/screen/option offense we had been running?). If you look at the tape, that span just involved people the passing the ball amongst the perimeter hoping that a shot would pop up, and that's pretty much useless.
 
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