I am not a fan of Jackson. No interest in having him on the Blazers - at all. Turiaf is ok as a backup 4, but that is not the Blazers pressing issue right now.
I don't see KP bring SJ to Portland. Not after the fiasco in Detroit. SJ was one of the guys that actually went into the stands to punch it out with Piston fans. He was also busted for firing shots outside of a strip club in Indianapolis. I just don't think he meets the character qualifications of the Blazers.
Really? With Nellie's history with big men? Fine, then they can throw us Randolph instead of Turiaf! Here's why I WOULD do it. I used to hate Jackson, even when he was starting for your world championship Spurs: he seemed like a black hole and a turnover waiting to happen. I couldn't understand why Pop could stand him. Turns out that Popovich knows a bit more than I do about basketball. Now, of course he knew enough not to re-sign Jackson (although, as I understand it, they did make an offer) and Jackson goes off and gets involved in the Basketbrawl. You know what? So what. I come from a country that lionized [video=youtube;ovYWY4Pf9_M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovYWY4Pf9_M&feature=related[/video] so it takes more than that to put me off a player. But look at the effect he had on Golden State. Look at how he steps up in big games. Look how much he cares about the game. We need someone like that - he's like the best features of Ron Artest and Rasheed Wallace. He's still a black hole and a turnover waiting to happen, but so was Sam Cassell, and so is Travis, and Jackson appears to have an amazing lockerroom presence (and can seriously play defense). And a championship ring. But hey, it's not going to happen, so...
Why would any good team want Monta? He's the epitome of volume scorer on a losing team. He's a poor man's Allen Iverson. He's a too-small, non-defending shooting guard. And he can't even shoot three pointers! He's a poor man's Tony Parker with every ounce of his point guard abilities surgically removed. Let the Warriors keep his scooter-crashing ass.
I'd def. take Monta Ellis. Not SJ though. His off-court problems and this off-season where he demanded his salary be restructured because Monta and Biedrins were getting more than him turned me off to him. On the court, he does seem like a black hole and I strongly dislike a lot of his shot selection, but the guy can play some good D, which I like. We could definitely do worse.
So a part of your argument is: We have Travis Outlaw, and he turns the ball over a lot and he is a black hole, so all those stupid turnovers that Jackson gets and all those times he turns into a black hole and all those times he takes bad shots - it's OK, because Jackson brings........ wait for it - intangibles. Here is the problem: We are trying to UPGRADE. So trading for the same thing doesn't help us. As for the lockerroom presence, I don't really know what you mean. And thusly, will ignore it. Taking Brandon Roy's best friend off the team and trading for a "lockerroom presence", let's call that a wash. Also, what is Stephen Jackson's shooting percentage in game winning shots situations? Outlaw is 6 out of 7 the last two seasons. As for the defense. I haven't seen Jackson play consistent defense since - ever. He was pretty good with the Spurs (duh, plus playing for a contract), but drove Pop crazy with his many lapses. In Golden State he is a bad defender imo. Gambling for steals and playing tough D for a couple of possessions per game does not a good defender make.
I think we have conclusively established that for you, if you can't put a number to it, it doesn't exist. Otherwise there is no way in hell you could say that Stephen Jackson is "the same thing" as Travis Outlaw. How much in life gets ignored by you? A lot, I imagine. Okay, how about I tell you there's a stat called "cohesionality" that can be computed by a complicated equation and Jackson's score is 200% of Travis's? I agree that Travis is well-liked. I'd rather trade Bayless myself, but I know half the board would crap its pants at that suggestion. Fair point (not surprising that it deals with something quantifiable). But of course you don't know what Jackson's % is. Funny how Travis bails us out, but half the time he's on the court when the boat's taking on the most water. Here's another #: what's Travis's +/-? Maybe - I'm not sure. However, I don't think much of Kobe Bryant's defense for the same reason, yet he gets voted all-defense perennially. My guess is that both take it easy because they're needed on 'O'. Maybe if Jackson was part of a better team, his D could improve. Call it the "Paul Pierce Effect". He certainly played LeBron James pretty even last time they faced up, and what Blazer player could say that?
Dude - Whatever. You are the one that brought up Travis Outlaw. Let's simplify this for you. No confusing stats involved. I don't want Jackson on this team regardless of who we would trade to get him. Forget his stats. When I watch him play, I usually say, "Thank god that guy is not on our team, he is an inefficient, annoyingly streaker scorer who has too high an opinion of his abilities, and he is an overrated defender, who seldom tries hard. What good does it do to play hard on defense once in a blue moon?" The Warriors can have him for all I care. Trading Bayless for him would be a return to Nash era GM'ing. DON'T WANT HIM! GOT IT!
