So KP is planning on picking Blake and Outlaw back up.

Kobe Bryant!

 

Exactly what free agent are we going to throw $14 million at? And if they are good enough to deserve it, they better be a UFA, or their current team will match our offer.

It's extremely rare for an "impact" player to change teams by signing outright as a free agent. There is almost always a sign and trade involved - otherwise the team losing the impact player gets absolutely nothing in return.

Even when the Magic offered Rashard Lewis an outrageous contract, they ended up getting him in a sign-and-trade with Seattle.

Having cheap, proven, expendable players under contract greatly increases the Blazers chances of obtaining an impact player through a sign-and-trade. Our two biggest needs are upgrades at starting PG and starting SF. Having cheap, proven surplus NBA talent at those two positions, increases the odds of filling those vacancies as we can give something of value back to the team that would be sending us a "impact" player in a sign and trade.

BNM

 

What star player putting us over the top are we going to get from NOH? Indiana? Milwaukee?

Also, there's no doubt that KP is shopping righ tnow. We don't have to do anything with Blake and Outlaw until June 30th. So if one of those teams said yeah, we'll give you Caron Butler for pure cap space, or Gerald Wallace, or Danny granger, etc., then you go ahead and you waive Outlaw and Blake. As is, a more likely situation is they shave roughly 8 million in pure cap space, and take on an additional 3 or so million from Blake or Outlaw's deal, which is still palatable for all of those clubs.

OR, if you find a situation like that, you look to shop. Memphis has liked Outlaw for a while. Outlaw for next year's second rounder. There, an additional 3.6 million in cap space. Find a SF you like, with Batum as our backup? Trade Webster to, say, Cleveland for Sasha Pavlovic. Then cut Sasha, which makes his salary go from the 4.3 of Webster's to the 1.5 of Sasha's guaranteed part, so another 2.8 in savings. That's an additional 6.4 in those two moves. Added to the 7 we already had. Trade Sergio to NY for TPE. Now I'm up to 14 million in cap space. And could still include Blake in a deal, who could be a cheap backup for whatever team we traded him to, an expiring contract, and we could pay 75% of his contract if need be by including 3 million dollars in the trade. Justoutright waiving two players before you know how anything is going to play outis an absolutely terrible idea.

 

But if we cut them now, that doesn't do us any good on a draft day trade, because we don't have cap space on draft day. We will not have cap space until July 1st. So we are not taking on a 14 million dollar contract on draft day. Or an 8 million, or a 4 million.

 

Sorry, I slightly misread your statement. We can not take on additional salary with Blake and Outlaw before July 1st. We have no cap space. I agree trading them before then is probably optimal. because then the other team can cut them. And I am sure that is still a possibility. However, if nothing is found prior to the deadline, there's no way you waive them when as I just showed, it woudl be fairly simpe to get to roughly 14 million in space.

 

Ok, so then maybe I am misunderstanding. I don't really see where anything that currently has happened is affected by what you are saying. The discussion i was referring to was in regards to outright waiving Blake and Outlaw before the deadline to maximize cap space. To give us 14 million. Trading for Jamison and Blatche with our TPE, Blake, and Outlaw is doable. And that would happen before July 1st. So none of this has to do with waiving those players. Same with the other two deals you mentioned. The issue seemed to lie with not being able to make similar deals AFTER July 1st.

 

Yep. Those 25 year-olds are WAAAYYY over the hill.

 

This isn't meant to make anyone feel stupid, but can we get this "picking up their options" thing straight please? There are no team options on Blake and Travis; they are both under contract, but the last year of their deal is un-guaranteed. I know it seems like a minor point, but it really does make a world of difference when it comes to trading either player between now and July 1st.

If KP sends them out in a trade the receiving team still has the option of letting them walk (important for teams more interested in the cap room they would free up) and typically if you have a player with a team option on them they can't be traded until that option is picked up after July 1st. Don't be shocked to see one or the other moved at draft day if KP gets a veteran wing and/or point guard in his sights (Kirk Hinrich seems to be the nom de jour).

 

Who are you going to sign for $15 million that will "put us over the top"? And why would you weaken the bench (or trade assets in Outlaw/Blake) prior to the draft?

Dumping them makes absolutely no sense.

 

I didn't read any of the thread but all I'll say is I don't have any problem keeping both players as long as they're used in the right role. They're both valuable players to have but they need to be used right.

Blake needs to be the backup PG or at least split half the minutes with Jerryd. I guess I could envision a scenario where Blake starts the game but Jerryd finishes it.

As far as Outlaw goes, he can't be relied upon to be the 3rd scorer on this team. He's one of the best options off the bench in the league but sometimes has to try and do too much because of a lack of other options. Get him in the right role(or get the right players around him) and he'll fit like a glove. And he is only $4M, which is a pretty good value.

I don't have any problems with the players themselves, just their roles. That can be fixed.

 

I agree... but, they will more than likely not DUMP them at all

but their is an opportuinity to trade them and get back a player of need

ALSO remember Stacey Augmen.. we traded him, he was waived and he came back and resigned with us

That is possible with Blake and maybe even TO. We get a trade that helps us and we resign one of them... kind of a bonus!

 

I agree... their contracts are active and will be active and on the books after July 1 unless we terminate them before July 1 or trade them.

 

yeah, Kobe is potentially one of them. For less than the full 14 million- Shawn Marion, Ramon Sessions, Carlos Boozer, Lamar Odom, Ron Artest and Milsap.

I'd take anyone on this list over Outlaw and Blake- heck, we could probably get two on the list- Andre Miller/Ron Artest, for example.

We don't have cheap, proven talent at the 1 and 3- just cheap potential.

It ruins our offseason to keep both Outlaw and Blake.

 

Mediocrity is not worth more in bulk. We won't get an impact player for Blake and Outlaw unless it's a cap dumping move on the part of the other team. The argument that they are a "great value" for the price doesn't make sense, in light of the fact that cutting them could bring us a high impact player.

 

Like who?

I would think adding them in a trade would be more value than the 3 million they're taking up in our cap space. Any team who trades away a $10 million PG will want at least a solid backup under a good contract in return (Blake). Any teams giving up a $10 million+ SF will probably want a young talented backup in return (Outlaw). Letting them go and having them sign with some random team, means we think there is a PG or SF out there that is worth major money, and I don't see that. Or, that a team will let a top notch player go for next to nothing in return. I can't imagine a team out there, if given the choice, that would rather get only cap space for this year when there is no top notch free agents vs Blake or Outlaws very affordable contract.

Letting Outlaw and Blake go for nothing would be foolish. We have such a good thing going, there is no reason to take a major risk like this.

 

Who's minutes are you going to drastically cut if we bring in Odom, Milsap, or Boozer? Realistically, you'll have to trade at least one of: Oden, LMA, or Joel for it to make any sense to take on one of those three players.

You would let two major role players under a great contract walk, on the chance we could sign Shawn Marion? The guy who hasn't proven he can fit in outside of Phoenix, who's shot has left him, and who would take away a large chunk of minutes from Batum?

I still don't get what everyone sees in Sessions. I'll be shocked if the guy gets more than 6-7 million a year, and even that seems to be too much.

 

As has been already pointed out, "high impact" players are more likely to change teams through a S&T, or a lopsided deal (where we use the extra $7 mil in cap space to give another team a chance to dump salary)

One more point to consider - the locker-room impact. Why is Hedo leaving Orlando? Because they grossly over-paid for Lewis. If we turn around and over-pay for Hedo, what will it cost us down the road?