Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again The reason everybody blamed Nellie was because he took more responsibility than the players. He always took blame instead of Nowitzki taking blame on defense back in the day.You guys just don't understand. Avery personally doesn't care about his players, maybe besides the Josh Howard-like ones (I'm serious, I know he hates Dirk).Look at Larry Brown and look at Avery and looked at Nellie. Which one cared about his team the most?Oh yeah, and HOW did Nellie and his son ever come up with the idea that a point guard booed at his own homecourt (STEVE NASH) and a player who struggled on the court all the time in his rookie season (DIRK NOWITZKI), one would become an EVENTUAL MVP and the OTHER a 26 PPG, 9 RPG KIND OF GUY!? Yeah, AVERY ALREADY HAS A TEAM ASSEMBLED FOR HIM.YOU GUYS TAKE THE MAN SO HARD. HE WAS THE PERSON WHO ACTUALLY MADE DALLAS ANYTHING AT ALL.WHY DON'T YOU GO BLAST AT MIKE D'ANTONI INSTEAD!?
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again don nelson did help dallas get into that top tier of teams, but i think that mark cuban should also get alot of the credit for making dallas a great team. bottom line, don nelson should and will get into the hall, not just from his dallas days, but the guy has been everywhere. i believe he is 2nd all time wins, and was also a great role player back in his celtic days.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Nelson doesn't deserve to be a hall of fame coach. So what if he coached a ton of years. His record as a coach isn't that great.</div>1190-880, only three coaches have reached 1000 wins in history of the NBA. Over .500 record is pretty damn good for a coach with over 1000 wins. Not only that for a Mavs fan he was a huge reason why Mavs made their turnaround from a joke of a franchise to one of the elites. He's had much success in the league and is deserving of being in the Hall of Fame. All Avery has done with the Mavs is inherit a already elite team, and made them play more defense. And for that he's greater then Nellie? No way in hell, and spare me the Nellie doesn't coach defense if you plan to use, look at the Bucks team he coached. Top in league in defense. Don't spit out crap like Avery >>>>> Nelson.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Whatever. I just didn't think he cared that much in the last couple years with Dallas. He doesn't care about defense enough and that is why Avery is coaching.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again YEAH, BUT DIRK IS GOING TO GET TRADED WITHIN 2 SEASONS IF AVERY ACTS LIKE THE @$$HOLE HE IS.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>don nelson did help dallas get into that top tier of teams, but i think that mark cuban should also get alot of the credit for making dallas a great team. bottom line, don nelson should and will get into the hall, not just from his dallas days, but the guy has been everywhere. i believe he is 2nd all time wins, and was also a great role player back in his celtic days.</div>Cubes was a guy when Nellie came in, he let him recruit the players he wanted and Cubes just spent his money on them. Now Cubes has become more concious of cap and is limiting on his free spending ways. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The reason everybody blamed Nellie was because he took more responsibility than the players. He always took blame instead of Nowitzki taking blame on defense back in the day.You guys just don't understand. Avery personally doesn't care about his players, maybe besides the Josh Howard-like ones (I'm serious, I know he hates Dirk).Look at Larry Brown and look at Avery and looked at Nellie. Which one cared about his team the most?Oh yeah, and HOW did Nellie and his son ever come up with the idea that a point guard booed at his own homecourt (STEVE NASH) and a player who struggled on the court all the time in his rookie season (DIRK NOWITZKI), one would become an EVENTUAL MVP and the OTHER a 26 PPG, 9 RPG KIND OF GUY!? Yeah, AVERY ALREADY HAS A TEAM ASSEMBLED FOR HIM.YOU GUYS TAKE THE MAN SO HARD. HE WAS THE PERSON WHO ACTUALLY MADE DALLAS ANYTHING AT ALL.WHY DON'T YOU GO BLAST AT MIKE D'ANTONI INSTEAD!?</div>I disagree on Avery doesn't care about his players. He obviously does, but he's definately not where Nellie is in terms of coaching. It's a joke to say a guy who has a 1000 wins, coached some great teams be lesser then a guy who just recently started coaching and has accomplished nothing as a coach yet. Having the best record for a rookie coach doesn't surprize me with the team he had to begin with. Give me a 5 year 50 win team and what do you expect?
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Waqas @ Apr 6 2006, 05:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>YEAH, BUT DIRK IS GOING TO GET TRADED WITHIN 2 SEASONS IF AVERY ACTS LIKE THE @$$HOLE HE IS.</div>honestly i have no idea what you are talking about. avery just is trying to make dirk better, and i might add, he is. plus cuban would NEVER trade dirk. there would be a riot in dallas.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again I think you are mixing up being a tough coach and considering that being an <Censored>. Greg Popovich is the same way. It is tough love Avery gives to his teammates.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Whatever. I just didn't think he cared that much in the last couple years with Dallas. He doesn't care about defense enough and that is why Avery is coaching.</div>Did you not read, I knew you would bring that defense crap up, look at Nellie's years with the Bucks. It takes more then coaching for a team to play defense. The players have to be able to play defense. And looking at those Mavs, they were bad defenders but great offensive players, so Nellie played to their strengths. Mavs now have better defenders and makes the transistion easier. And please, Nellie left because his time had come, he and Cubes weren't on great terms either with Nash leaving, that was the final straw, as Cubes was beginning to want more input in the team's decisions. Fact is Nellie broke grounds with his offensive schemes and introduced the concept of point forward and that alone is achievement for the Hall of Fame. To be a innovator of offense is something. And his recruiting of players throughout his career has been outstanding. Hardaway, Spree, Webber, Nash, Finley, Dirk. A little known fact is he wanted to Knicks to trade Ewing to able to sign guess who, Shaquille O'Neal. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>YEAH, BUT DIRK IS GOING TO GET TRADED WITHIN 2 SEASONS IF AVERY ACTS LIKE THE @$$HOLE HE IS.</div>Dude shut up, Avery is not acting like a <Censored>.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Antoine Walker, Antoine Jamison, Van Horn, and Jerry Stackhouse. Who wanted those players? Don Nelson. That playing to your strengths idea is a bad idea since it also makes you very weak in other areas. The mavs couldn't stop anybody and Avery brought in the right players. Adrian Griffin, Diop, and Dampier. Players that play defense. Don Nelson maybe stressed defense but his choices of players was bad.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Antoine Walker, Antoine Jamison, Van Horn, and Jerry Stackhouse. Who wanted those players? Don Nelson. That playing to your strengths idea is a bad idea since it also makes you very weak in other areas. The mavs couldn't stop anybody and Avery brought in the right players. Adrian Griffin, Diop, and Dampier. Players that play defense. Don Nelson maybe stressed defense but his choices of players was bad.</div>We got Van Horn when Nellie had stepped down. Stackhouse was involved in a deal with Devin Harris, so wouldn't Harris be a Nellie player? Also, Avery is playing Stackhouse quite a bit, so what's that say about Avery? Jamison was great off the bench for us, despite his defensive tendencies he was a great player to have and had a great attitude to go with it. I would not mind him back here. Walker is the only person I see as a guy that didn't fit. And as far as I'm concerned, Nellie has recruited better players then bad players. The Big 3 alone. So spare me the choices of players was bad. It's not like Nellie didn't pick defensive players either, when we had Griff before, Buckner, Najera, Strickland, Bell.Hell if it weren't for Nellie, would Avery even be coaching the Mavs?
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Griffin didn't get much playing time along with Shawn Bradley. Pretty much Nelson played all the scorers and tended to favorite centers that could hit 3 pointers but not realizing how much of a liability it is on defense to have a soft center.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Apr 6 2006, 05:46 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Griffin didn't get much playing time along with Shawn Bradley. Pretty Nelson played all the scorers and tended to favorite centers that could hit 3 pointers but not realizing how much of a liability it is on defense to have a soft center.</div>Griffin played a fair share of time under nelson.SEA GP GS MIN FG% 3PT FT%REB AST STL BLK TO PTS 01-02 DAL 58 34 23.8 .499 .296 .837 3.9 1.8 1.29 .21 .72 7.2 02-03 DAL 74 48 18.6 .433 .250 .844 3.6 1.4 1.04 .08 .64 4.4 i'd also add that raja bell played a lot tooSEA GP GS MIN FG% 3PT FT% REB AST STL BLK TO PTS 02-03 DAL 75 32 15.6 .441 .412 .676 1.9 .8 .69 .11 .57 3.1
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Griffin didn't get much playing time along with Shawn Bradley. Pretty much Nelson played all the scorers and tended to favorite centers that could hit 3 pointers but not realizing how much of a liability it is on defense to have a soft center.</div>Griff started at sf. Just like his playing time with us now. Starts, and minutes fade as the game goes on.And who cares about Bradley. That guy was a stiff. He practically started the first few years under Nellie when we played Dirk at sf and Howard at pf. He may be a leading shotblocker but at his size it's expected. But the guy was not a defensive force.Considering our options at centers, who did you expect to play there.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Well one good thing he did is get rid of Juwan Howard. That was a big liability on defense right there. Playing Dirk and Lafrentz at center showed how little value Nelson had on centers. Small ball might be fun to watch but in the playoffs it doesn't work unless you have Amare Stoudemire and Steve Nash.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Well one good thing he did is get rid of Juwan Howard. That was a big liability on defense right there. Playing Dirk and Lafrentz at center showed how little value Nelson had on centers. Small ball might be fun to watch but in the playoffs it doesn't work unless you have Amare Stoudemire and Steve Nash.</div>We had Nash. And yes it worked so well for the Suns last year. They achieved the same feat the Mavs did, WCF. I'm done with this conversation, as you basically turned this into Nellie bashing and think for some reason he shouldn't be in the Hall. This is why the Mavs board is a joke. As a matter of fact, since you post on other Mavs boards. Make a thread saying Avery >>>> Nellie and see what reactions you get.Be sure to link them.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again The mavs board is the most active on this forum. We all can agree that Avery is more of a defensive minded coach right? Even if he hasn't proven anything yet that he focuses more on it. Don Nelson likes the run and gun style with Nash and Dirk. The suns had to beat the mavs to get to the WCF and the year the mavs did get there is because of Webber going down. Kings in 6 if that didn't happen.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The mavs board is the most active on this forum. We all can agree that Avery is more of a defensive minded coach right? Even if he hasn't proven anything yet that he focuses more on it. Don Nelson likes the run and gun style with Nash and Dirk. The suns had to beat the mavs to get to the WCF and the year the mavs did get there is because of Webber going down. Kings in 6 if that didn't happen.</div>No I don't agree with Avery is more defensive minded, because Nellie has coached defensive teams before. Just get over it, Avery is not better then Nellie.Who cares if Webber went down, it's a part of the game. Injuries happen, you take advantage of them. Even with Webber down, they still took us to 7 games, so it wasn't a walk in the park. And the fact we took the Spurs to 6 games is pretty damn good.Bottom line, they both reached the WCF. You can't take that away from either team.So spare the what if's.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Nellie was once a good defensive but he could tell you himself that he became more of an offensive coach with the mavs and the focus changed. Avery though will not let people slip on defense and even takes players out of the game because of it. Like he yanked out Terry and put Armstrong because of it. The mavs still have some weak defenders that were leftovers from the Nellie days.
Re: Mavs' Howard may fill in again Yeah, but you ALL have to agree that he HAD a championship-caliber team to work with since last April.
