OT: LeBron vs. Jordan (first 6 years)

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by VanillaGorilla, Aug 3, 2009.

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Is LeBron better than Jordan (FIRST SIX YEARS)?

  1. Yes

    9 vote(s)
    18.8%
  2. No

    39 vote(s)
    81.3%
  1. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    No, but they are two different eras. Jordan faced hand-checking but also less physical, compacted interior defenses in his early career. James doesn't deal with hand-checking, but does face the tougher interior defenses. Overall, I don't think James has it easier.
     
  2. TheFreshPrince

    TheFreshPrince JBB JustBBall Member

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    James has it easier simply because of his size and strength. If guys can't hand check and body him up on the perimeter he can get enough momentum to easily get into the lane to draw a foul that the refs will call no matter what. Add to that that post defenders can't use their forearms anymore. Lebron would not be as good of a scorer in jordan's era. If you put a big strong guy on the perimeter on him, he isn't gonna be flying in for dunks and ft's like he is today. He just isn't quick enough.
     
  3. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    Can't say I agree. He's not as quick as Jordan, but he's bigger and stronger. His combination of quickness, strength and size would be an absolute match-up nightmare in any era. No "big, strong guy" could stay with James on the perimeter, with or without hand-checking.
     
  4. TheFreshPrince

    TheFreshPrince JBB JustBBall Member

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    but it'd be easier for them to stick with him then than now, so he wouldn't be as good.... right?
     
  5. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    As I said previously, hand-checking would work against him...the less-congested and less-physical interior defenses of that time would work in his favour. I don't think James faces easier defenses to exploit than Jordan did in the second half of the 1980s.
     
  6. Денг Гордон

    Денг Гордон Member

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    Jordan was a much more efficient scorer than Lebron. Jordan shot 59.2 TS%, while Lebron shot 55.5 TS%. Jordan has the best TS% of the 11 players that averaged over 27 points a game in their first 6 seasons in the NBA, and the 2nd highest PPG.
     
  7. KingSpeed

    KingSpeed Veteran

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    I voted LeBron because he took his team (a very weak team) to the Finals in his 4th season. Take a moment to think about that. The Cavs were the worst team in the basketball (dead last) during his senior year of high school. He joined the team the following year and got them to the NBA FINALS by what would've been his senior year of college. That is UNBELIEVABLE. I remember how great Jordan was but I am also a witness to how great LeBron is.
     
  8. KingSpeed

    KingSpeed Veteran

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    Jordan was a prick.
     
  9. KingSpeed

    KingSpeed Veteran

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    Proof is in the pudding.

    NBA Finals appearances:

    LeBron 1
    Jordan 0
     
  10. Da_O

    Da_O Abe Vigoda lives!

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    Lebron also led them to a sweep in his 4th season. Hmm Jordan never let that happen to his team. I also don't think Jordan lost a series where his team was heavily favored. To be fair, the Cavs probably had the easiest road to the finals of any team. A broken down Nets and Wizards team, and the only truly good opponent the Pistons. They really didn't belong there.

    Minstrel, people use the age argument, but I always go by games played. And by the games played in both their first six seasons, Jordan was the better player. Just wanted to note that Jordan too had an MVP award during his first six years but he also was a 3-tim All-NBA defensive 1st team and had a DPOY award under his belt. So if were taking into account both sides of the ball Jordan was the superior player.

    Lebron's is okay too though, :devilwink:
     
  11. Da_O

    Da_O Abe Vigoda lives!

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    The difference is zone defense. Zone was called an illegal defense before the handchecking rule. Plus scouting nowadays is much more advanced than it was back then. So defenses now are better prepared to stop you and can throw different types of zones and traps to stop you.

    Minstrel though, I still believed Jordan faced tougher interior defenses. You have to remember with the handchecking rule also came the defensive 3 second rule, which clears the lane up quite a bit.

    But to be fair to Michael, zone defense was illegal, but that didn't stop teams from trying.

    [video=youtube;du-C-TvHqzA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=du-C-TvHqzA&feature=channel_page[/video]
     
  12. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    Since the question, as phrased in the thread title, is "first 6 years", then (in my opinion) the question should be answered on that level--eg, the age discrepancy should not be factored.

    The fact that the rules for each era are so different does significantly discount the value of statistical comparison. So for me, the most compelling argument is the level of superiority of each player over his peers within his era.

    Scoring titles--Jordan 5, Lebron 1. All NBA 1st team--Jordan 4, Lebron 3. All Defensive team--Jordan 3, Lebron 1. DPoY--Jordan 1, Lebron 0. Finals appearances--Jordan 0, Lebron 1.

    To me, it's a pretty clear-cut case for Jordan.
     
  13. BalancedMan

    BalancedMan That's out of context....

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    Because Craig Ehlo could stop LeBron...right. How many "big strong perimeter defenders" were there that you can name out of your head without looking it up. That you think could stop LeBron particularly better than people can (can't*) do now.
     
  14. BalancedMan

    BalancedMan That's out of context....

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    I feel that a scoring title by itself is overrated, especially when you consider the other metrics like assists, rebounds, pace, and usage rates.
     
  15. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    It's really sad to watch how easy it is for LeBron to get wide open lobs.
     
  16. hasoos

    hasoos Well-Known Member

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    At the same time, back then you could put your hands on somebody when defending them. Now you can't. If Jordan played now he would have averaged 6 more points a game, easily.
     
  17. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    Not to mention, the star treatment now is absolutely fucking ridiculous.
     
  18. hasoos

    hasoos Well-Known Member

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    Oh comon it was ridiculous then too. Crazy ridiculous.
     
  19. TheFreshPrince

    TheFreshPrince JBB JustBBall Member

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    Okay, we'll go with pippen, g hill, rodman, barkley, and kemp off the top of my head (not many of those guys from jordan's first 6 years, but still same era). Funny how you think me not looking it up makes your argument good or something. The guys i can't think of still existed lol.

    Plus look at post defense, guys can't even use their forearm anymore. Lebron would get frustrated beyond belief in jordan's era imo. He would get pushed around, not get the calls he gets now, and his play would suffer. We have all seen many instances of Lebrons immaturity. I really don't think he could handle himself in Jordan's era, people were more physical, and less scared of superstars. The league didn't protect their guys back then like they do now.
     
  20. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    I know it was, but I feel like it's worse now because Stern is trying disparately to keep the NBA on the level it was when Jordan/Magic/Bird were playing.
     

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