I really like the moves Dumars has made

Discussion in 'Chicago Bulls' started by Denny Crane, Aug 20, 2009.

  1. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    The Pistons fell from ECF several years in a row to 8th seed, 1st round and out. Dumars clearly backed his horses way too long and they grew old together. Sounds like a story with a bad ending.

    Yet it is remarkable that the Pistons did make the playoffs while he is rapidly rebuilding the roster. He traded Billups for a huge expiring contract. They weren't championship contenders with Billups, and he's a year younger than the 34 year old AI.

    Dumars let one of his best players over the last decade go as a free agent: Sheed. Sheed's 34 years old, too.

    Look at the roster without those two:

    Stuckey, Hamilton, Prince, Maxiel, and Kwame Brown would be the best 5 players they could put on the court. Maxiel is really short at PF - 6'5", and has never played starter's minutes. Brown is an outright bust of a 1st/1st draft pick. Hamilton is the guy you'd expect to be leading scorer, and with only a little help from Prince, they're quite offensively challenged.

    Use the cap space cleared by AI and Sheed departing on 26 year old Ben Gordon and 27 year old CV and the team is set at two positions for the next 4-5 years. For a team that _was_ hurting for offense, Ben Gordon gives them a go-to scorer, and CV is no slouch either.

    After those signings, the lineup looks like:
    Gordon
    Hamilton
    Prince
    CV
    Kwame

    Rather solid at 4 positions with a pair of young guards (Stuckey, Bynum) and Maxiel forming the core of a decent 2nd unit.

    The C position looks like a disaster, and the roster has small-ball written all over it. Stuckey, Gordon, Hamilton, Prince (at PF), and CV (at C).

    So Dumars goes out and signs a couple of veteran bigs: Chris Wilcox and Ben Wallace and the C position looks old but deep. Wallace might have enough gas in the tank to give the Pistons 24 minutes - most of Q1 and Q4, start of Q3. He still can play some D and board and block shots, but is even more injury prone these days than Luol Deng.

    After these moves:
    Gordon/Stuckey
    Hamilton/Bynum
    Prince/Hamilton
    CV/Maxiel
    Wallace/Wilcox/Kwame

    I have Hamilton playing some SF since they'll want to play some small ball to get their wings out there as a unit. They might get pushed around some, but 6'9" Prince and 6'11" CV bring decent height and agility.

    I haven't even factored in the three draft picks Detroit added over the summer. All listed as SFs, but they actually bring some height. The big question is whether any can contribute. A lesser question is how much does it take to contribute more than Kwame Brown?

    SF Austin Daye is 6'11". SF Jonas Jerebko is 6'9". SF DuJuan Summers is 6'8" and 236 lbs.

    That's 3 guys 6'11" and another 6'10" and 3 more at 6'9". They're not going to be a small small ball team at all.

    Those three rookies may or may not contribute, right? How about bringing in one of the best big man coaches the league has seen in the past decade or more: Brian Hill. Smart move, and all the insurance one can expect for the rooks.

    It's not a championship team, it is a team rebuilding on the fly. That is one hell of a quick rebuild so far. I don't see any reason they won't make the playoffs again, and they could be a lot better than anyone expected at the time of the Gordon/CV signings.

    Dumars may not even be done yet.
     
  2. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

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    I have no idea why you would give Wilcox a multi-year deal but I like the rest of the summer moves.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2009
  3. bullshooter

    bullshooter Active Member

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    I'll give credit to Dumars when they finish above .500 and make the playoffs. Those three SF's get to split 8 minutes a night unless Prince is moved, and if Prince is moved, that team doesn't win 30 games. I'll be surprised if they win more than 40. Cleveland, Chicago, and even Milwaukee still have better talent. They are a Motown version of the Pacers.

    And while I think Dumars ultimately did the right thing in breaking the team up, they were a shoe-in last year for the second round before they traded Billups, even with Curry as the coach. And they probably don't fall apart like the did if Billups was still there. In the playoffs they could have at least competed with Cleveland and Orlando and if they figured out how to get motivated, maybe even advance to get pummeled by the lakers.

    I still don't see a point guard or a leader on that team, and their defense is extremely suspect as Prince is the only good defender they have. I also see their big men getting tired of running up and down the court just to chase rebounds. The Pistons front line is tissue paper soft. If you don't like the Pargo signing, how can like Wilcox as a journeyman who might start? Ben Wallace is still dead.

    They are going to end up playing small ball with BG the same way the bulls inevitably did every game because "you have to have your best players on the court end..." BG will hit a few shots, but he's going to have a lot more competition for the ball with Stuckey, Hamilton and Prince being a lot more established in Detroit. And why exactly are they going to listen to a rookie head coach?

    Either Hamilton or Prince is benched by January and in the doghouse, most likely Hamilton. They struggle to get to 35 wins if things go well and they don't tune out the coach. Prince is probably moved at the deadline. That's my prediction.

    But I am certain they beat the bulls at least twice.
     
  4. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Last season was year 1 of their rebuilding. Playoffs.

    This season will be year 2. They'll know at the end of the season if they need a pure PG, and they'll be able to address the C position in the draft or through trades.

    Maybe we're too used to the plan for rebuilding of a team that takes decades to recognize what Dumars is doing. But it's there for all to see.
     
  5. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

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    Dumars built a team piece by piece for one championship. He is clearly looking to do it that way again rather than going for a big home run. It would be amazing if he can do it again. But will be interesting to watch.

    I think Pistons have the possibility to be sleepers. They have lots of guys that can put it in the hole and there small-ball lineups could be deadly.
     
  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    They have some pieces to trade, too. I made an err in my post. CV was 24 last season. They added youth in two guys (BG, CV) that gives Dumars the luxury of looking for the additional pieces to build a championship contender, while still making Detroit an attractive destination for guys to want to play.

    Dumars has made some big mistakes along the way. Darko over Melo is the obvious biggie. Yet I wonder if they'd be in better shape right now with Melo in the mix. They might win more in the short term, but you'd basically be looking at Denver (if they kept Billups) minus some key filler pieces.

    Letting Flip Saunders go may have been a really bad move, too. The guy won 50+ games 6 times, 3 with Minny, 3 with Detroit.
     
  7. MikeDC

    MikeDC Member

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    Dumars has a consistent plan, which is a huge head start.
     
  8. bullshooter

    bullshooter Active Member

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    Last year was year one of the dismantling. They need to actually do something like improve on the previous season before you can actually call it a rebuilding. And more importantly I think we can all agree, just going to the playoffs isn't the goal.
     
  9. BullsKY

    BullsKY Member

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    I don't understand what Dumars is doing....maybe in 2011 he'll try to make a move at Melo but I see this team winning 35 games....tops. It's like he paniced and picked up everyone's role player and signed them to a deal. Yeah, Gordon was a steal but players like Wilcox, Charlie V and Wallace were all questionable signings.

    I do however think that Will Bynum is a decent back up guy but I'd stop overvaluing Stuckey and trade his ass. If the Pistons ship completely sinks this season, they might be able to pick up John Wall or something. Then I would pay attention.
     
  10. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

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    I think you are confusing rebuilding with successful rebuilding. :pimp:
     

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