Kobe Bryant is the reason the Lakers won 40+ games this season. Had it not been for them, they'd be in the mix for the top pick in the 2006 draft<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KMart @ Apr 22 2006, 06:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>When comparing TMac and Kobe, you gotta love looking at TMac against Dallas last year. Kobe has never had a series like that, ever. 30 PPG, 6 RPG, 6 APG, all well D-ing up Dirk Nowitzki 90% of the time and holding him to 33% shooting. That's clutch if I've ever seen it</div>You mean the series they lost in 7 games, including a 40+ point massacre game 7? Yeah, that's clutch
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ Apr 22 2006, 08:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>They lost to a very tough Mavericks team, so what? TMac played very well that series.</div>Yes he did play well. But when it really mattered, he didn't show up. That's just the fact. He was clutch during game 2 that's for sure. But, as for the series, the numbers don't tell the full story.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ace_o_spades @ Apr 22 2006, 08:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kobe Bryant is the reason the Lakers won 40+ games this season. Had it not been for them, they'd be in the mix for the top pick in the 2006 draftYou mean the series they lost in 7 games, including a 40+ point massacre game 7? Yeah, that's clutch </div>If you think the team that T-Mac led that brought Pistons to 7 games few years back wouldn't have been lottery bound without him, you're crazy.Yao lost the series last year. In either game 4 or game 5, with like a minute left, T-Mac drive to basket and handed it off to Yao. Yao semi-caught it, then lsot it when he went up for dunk. Next possesion for Rockets, same thing, except Yao fumbled pass and it went out of bounds. T-Mac was not at total fault for game 7, either. He got his points, no one else showed up.
Lamar Odom and Kobe Bryant are the reasons the Lakers got to the playoffs. Take out Lamar Odom and the Lakers don't have a chance to make the playoffs. It is not a one man team. Odom does a lot of the dirty work like rebounding and defense. He just struggles on fitting well with Kobe and who doesn't with someone who has the ball so much and yet doesn't get a lot of assists.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ace_o_spades @ Apr 23 2006, 12:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yes he did play well. But when it really mattered, he didn't show up. That's just the fact. He was clutch during game 2 that's for sure. But, as for the series, the numbers don't tell the full story.</div>So if Kobe's team loses to the Suns is Kobe not clutch than?
It really depends on who you talk to.There's guys like You who hate him to the fact where you say Dirk is a better passerThere's laker fans who say he is in jordan's league.Kobe did iniate an offense, a 3 peat team. He basically had the ball in his hand majority of the times.Lamar Odom and Kobe Bryant are the reasons the Lakers got to the playoffs. Take out Lamar Odom and the Lakers don't have a chance to make the playoffs. It is not a one man team. Odom does a lot of the dirty work like rebounding and defense. He just struggles on fitting well with Kobe and who doesn't with someone who has the ball so much and yet doesn't get a lot of assists.True, lakers wouldn't make the playoffs without the odom They would be a 30 team win agan because teams would just triple kobe and no-one on the lakers could hit the shots. And it happened.Mavsfan, explain to me where the lakers would be without kobe? 10 win team?Explain to me any other 21 year old who could go 4/4 in overtime and basically guarentee the championship.I see mavsfan said earlier on LBJ is the best swingman in the league. He's not even the 2nd best, that goes to TMAC.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Explain to me any other 21 year old who could go 4/4 in overtime and basically guarentee the championship.</div>What other 21 year old has ever gotten the oppertunity? Name another 21 year old who could average 32/7/7 on 48% shooting in a season, win all star MVP, and have a triple double in his 1st playoff game? <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>I see mavsfan said earlier on LBJ is the best swingman in the league. He's not even the 2nd best, that goes to TMAC.</div>Agreed. If Bron can do what he has done for another year, I'd say bron is best in league, though.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Apr 22 2006, 06:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What other 21 year old has ever gotten the oppertunity? Name another 21 year old who could average 32/7/7 on 48% shooting in a season, win all star MVP, and have a triple double in his 1st playoff game? Agreed. If Bron can do what he has done for another year, I'd say bron is best in league, though.</div>Kobe averaged 30/7/6 on 45% shooting at 24, he won all star MVP at 23, and the scoring might have been impressive for Lebron today, but I watched the first 3 quarters. He got those assists on 3's from his teammates, he just kicked it to them and they made the shots.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 09:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kobe averaged 30/7/6 on 45% shooting at 24, he won all star MVP at 23, and the scoring might have been impressive for Lebron today, but I watched the first 3 quarters. He got those assists on 3's from his teammates, he just kicked it to them and they made the shots.</div>Bron is only 21, and in Kobe's best season at 24 Bron's numbers were better. Bron's 32/7/7 is more impressive than Kobe's 30/6/7. Bron got all star game MVP at 21. And so what if Bron's assists were on kicks to his teammates for 3's? All of Nash's assists come from that and on the fastbreak.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Apr 22 2006, 06:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Bron is only 21, and in Kobe's best season at 24 Bron's numbers were better. Bron's 32/7/7 is more impressive than Kobe's 30/6/7. Bron got all star game MVP at 21. And so what if Bron's assists were on kicks to his teammates for 3's? All of Nash's assists come from that and on the fastbreak.</div>Lebron has been the main guy on Cleveland for 3 years, that was the first year Kobe was the main guy on the Lakers (Shaq got hurt at the beginning of the season and didn't work himself back until the playoffs).
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 09:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Lebron has been the main guy on Cleveland for 3 years, that was the first year Kobe was the main guy on the Lakers (Shaq got hurt at the beginning of the season and didn't work himself back until the playoffs).</div>And Bron has never had a team like those Laker squads, so it is not fair to say how much better than Kobe is for getting to Finals when Kobe has never had a season in his 10 seasons as good as Bron's 3rd season has been.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Apr 22 2006, 06:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And Bron has never had a team like those Laker squads, so it is not fair to say how much better than Kobe is for getting to Finals when Kobe has never had a season in his 10 seasons as good as Bron's 3rd season has been.</div>This season was more impressive than Lebron's. 35/5/5 (on a team with one spot up shooter). 2001, 2002, and 2003 were all more impressive, he had 29/5/6, 25/6/6 and 30/6/7 while being a top 3 perimeter defender. He was BY FAR the best two way player in the league.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 10:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>This season was more impressive than Lebron's. 35/5/5 (on a team with one spot up shooter). 2001, 2002, and 2003 were all more impressive, he had 29/5/6, 25/6/6 and 30/6/7 while being a top 3 perimeter defender. He was BY FAR the best two way player in the league.</div>Umm, no it wasn't. 32/7/7 on 48% shooting is better than 35/5/5 on 45% shooting. Bron brought a team almost as crappy as the Lakers to 50 win season and homecourt advantage. That 5 game difference is same as what seperated Lakers from getting 5th seed in playoffs. None of Kobe's seasons in from '01-'03 were as impressive as Bron's, and IMO only 2002-2003 was better than Kobe's year this year. He was a top 3 defender back then, but his impact wasn't as large as Bron's. Need proof? Lakers of 2002-2003 were far better than Cavs of this year, yet they won same amount of games. Kobe was also 1st option only 1/3 of that season (Shaq missed 15 games that season, give or take another 10 games for him to get into swing, and that leaves 30 games or so where Kobe was 1st option).
You don't think being a top 3 offensive player in the league AND a top 3 defensive player in the league is more impressive than Lebron's season this year? The only other swingman to ever do that was Michael.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 10:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You don't think being a top 3 offensive player in the league AND a top 3 defensive player in the league is more impressive than Lebron's season this year? The only other swingman to ever do that was Michael.</div>He was a top 5 perimeter defender, MAYBE top 10 league defender. Nontheless, Bron's stats are better this year than Kobe's has ever been, and IMO that cancels out Kobe doing what he did in Finals at 21.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Apr 22 2006, 07:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>He was a top 5 perimeter defender, MAYBE top 10 league defender. Nontheless, Bron's stats are better this year than Kobe's has ever been, and IMO that cancels out Kobe doing what he did in Finals at 21.</div>Man, I had respect for you. I lost it with that comment. Stats are better than one of the all time great finals performances? Sure, Lebron is better at 21 than Kobe was, but Lebron has never had a performance like that.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 10:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Man, I had respect for you. I lost it with that comment. Stats are better than one of the all time great finals performances? Sure, Lebron is better at 21 than Kobe was, but Lebron has never had a performance like that.</div>And LeBron never had that kind of team, so he will never get that chance at 21. And yes, LeBron is better at 21, which is my point.
Lebron>Kobe and Cavs>Lakers. If you switched Lebron and Kobe than the Lakers would be around 50 wins. Lebron is that dominating.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Apr 22 2006, 07:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And LeBron never had that kind of team, so he will never get that chance at 21. And yes, LeBron is better at 21, which is my point.</div>I said Lebron at 21 is better than Kobe at 21.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (mavsfan1000 @ Apr 22 2006, 07:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Lebron>Kobe and Cavs>Lakers. If you switched Lebron and Kobe than the Lakers would be around 50 wins. Lebron is that dominating.</div>The Lakers had 10 games where they were up by 2 or more with a minute or less remaining that they lost. They should've been above 50 wins with Kobe. If you put Kobe on that team (and in the east), they're winning 55+ games EASILY. Kobe's also averaging 30+/7+/6 at least.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Apr 22 2006, 10:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I said Lebron at 21 is better than Kobe at 21.</div>I know. I also feel Kobe is better than Bron at this moment, but people saying Kobe had that amazing performance at 21 is such an advatange is unfair as Bron at 21 has accomplished so much more than Kobe did at 21 and will never have the chance to play with a top 5 center all time and a top 15 team all time.
