Yep I just think that the wizards ar finally figuring out that its' not going to work with that crew, and they need a change. Either one of those guys would be killer to get, and IMO Jamison could even play SF. He is very versatile. He is very old though. Caron still has some gas in his tank I think. He just needs a change of scenery, and is getting sick of losing. He used to carry that team nightly, but now they have Arenas back, and he looks lost out there. The way their offense runs he just isn't a good fit.
Hollinger had an article today at ESPN.com (insider only) that talked a little about the Wizards and Warriors needing to blow it up. His sense is that the Wiz will probably let it ride for a while longer because he keeps hearing things out of their front office about just needing to get healthy, he said the biggest obstacle to moving Butler is that he's been so unproductive this season which makes teams less likely to offer expiring contracts, which is what the Wiz really covet if they are going to move somebody. On the flipside he thinks everybody on the Warriors could be available and probably will be available.
i dont get excited anymore... kp couldnt pull off a trade this big to save his life but yes jamison would be perfect or butler
The first thing the Warriors need to blow up is Don Nelson. There is no use getting players as long as that guy is there. On NBATV they literally just laugh at him now, and make jokes about his lineup with 4 guards and Magette at center.
Butler would take this team to the next level. My only thought is what about Batum? Can Butler fill the role of guarding LBJ, Kobe etc.? I have given up hope that Roy will ever want to play that kind of defense. I would be ecstatic if KP got Butler without giving up any of the core. I also feel like Batum/Bayless are keepers.
so i went to compare Butlers and Wallace's stats.. HOLY COW I didnt realize Crash was getting 12 rebounds a game!
Butler has had a rocky 2009 so far, but I love his game. And his age doesn't suggest he should be falling off a cliff, in terms of production. I'd love to acquire him, if he could be had largely for expiring deals (Blake/Outlaw) and maybe one other piece.
I've wanted Butler for a long, long time. I saw them play last week and noticed the same as you. But considering all the Roy/Miller compatibility problems, seeing the Arenas/Butler compatibility problems made me wonder if Butler would fit in here. Then I came to my senses. Butler would be an awesome addition to the Blazers.
Perfect. KP said at last year's M&G, to paraphrase, that he likes to acquire stocks with strong fundamentals that are out of favor. Sounds like Butler. Go get him.
That would be sweet trading an Injured Outlaw. He can't play now so he is no good to us this year. And at the end of the year Travis and the Blazers would be in the same situation as if they still owned his rights: The mid level exception or less.
unless it's as a way to dump miller for chemistry reasons i don't see the point to bringing in butler. we're not winning it all this year, and he's not likely to add anything long-term over webster and a healthy batum. if we could get him for miller + filler that would be perfect, but i wouldn't want to give up rudy (or bayless obviously).
To me it is as simple as this. Remember when Butler was with Miami and D-Wade was a rookie, and Llamar Odom was on that team? He worked awesome with D-wade, and Roy plays a lot like D-wade. If I remember right that team shocked some folks, made the playoffs in the east and won a round. Anyhow, I think because Roy and Dwade have such similar playing styles, I think it is a no brainer.
To get you have to give. To get Butler, you're going to have to give up Rudy AND Batum, IMO, as well as Travis and salary filler. Is that a price we're willing to pay?
I would not give up on Batum. It is easy to forget about him since he is hurt, but that would be short sighted IMO. Especially if if Bayless pans out. One ball for Bayless, Roy, LMA and Greg........is not enough as it is. Batum is the perfect guy to add to that mix. But if Bayless does not pan out then a guy like Butler is needed more IMO Besides as Mixum says "This team stinks". Adding one player won't make the difference this year.
As much as many people overvalue our players, you're going to the extreme in the other direction. Butler and Outlaw are probably roughly equal in value, in my opinion. I think this is a case of familiarity breeding discontent because we watch Travis on a daily basis and see every little mistake. But look at what they actually do and it's a lot closer than you think. All numbers per 36 minutes. Scoring Outlaw 15.9 Butler 16.3 Rebounding Outlaw 5.6 Butler 5.9 Assists Outlaw 1.4 Butler 2.9 Blocks plus steals Outlaw 2.3 Butler 1.9 FG% Outlaw 44.3 Butler 44.1 3pt% Outlaw 36.1 Butler 31.5 Turnovers Outlaw 1.6 Butler 2.3 Outlaw is better at shooting the three, defensive stats and taking care of the ball. Butler is better at passing. The other categories are roughly equal. Consider that Outlaw is 4 years younger and his best 2 seasons have been his most recent 2 seasons. These guys are very close in value. I don't see how anybody could ask Portland to throw in 2 excellent young prospects just for a slightly better (if better at all) player.
The way I try to think about it is, would the player I am sending out ever turn out better than the player I am getting back. Because if the best we could expect out of the guy being traded was the level of talent of the guy were getting back, then we win by getting a player of that talent now rather than later. In Portland, I would probably expect Caron to be at about 16 points and 6 rebounds. He has been known to be able to play defense. He is a two time all star. His long ball shooting is spotty. .350 at best. The question is, how will Batum stack up to that when he matures? I don't know the answer to that.
Travis is a fine volume scorer, but Butler is a borderline All Star. We're going to have to agree to disagree.
