regulation

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by Eastoff, Jan 19, 2010.

  1. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
    What are your thoughts on government regulation (such as on businesses)
     
  2. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    Every business requires some regulation. Monopolies and oligopolies are not only bad for the consumer, but in the long run, bad for business itself. What needs to stop is this crony capitalism, where the government picks winners (Fannie, Freddie, Goldman, GM) and losers (Bear Stearns, Lehman, Chrysler).

    What government needs to do is curb excesses that lead to "Too Big To Fail" or monopolies/oligopies. Anything else is just interference.
     
  3. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
    anything else, does that include minimum wage? and keeping rats out of hotdogs?
     
  4. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    Sure. My intent wasn't to give a complete answer. I assumed that pretty much everyone would agree that OSHA and the minimum wage (as long as it's low enough to continue to encourage employment) are good ideas. The government taking over those roles from unions is the primary reason I think unions have outlived their usefulness.
     
  5. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
    So would you say these things are done by "useless bureaucrats"?
     
  6. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    Many bureaucrats are useless. I never said all of them. Stop operating from the false premise that I want no government whatsoever. It's a cheap debating tactic of which you should try to rise above.
     
  7. MARIS61

    MARIS61 Real American

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,007
    Likes Received:
    5,012
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    retired Yankee
    Location:
    Beautiful Central Oregon
    Yes, government should be regulated.
     
  8. MARIS61

    MARIS61 Real American

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,007
    Likes Received:
    5,012
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    retired Yankee
    Location:
    Beautiful Central Oregon
    And business should be governed.
     
  9. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    This is why tonight is so great. The people of Massachusetts sent the message that the government is regulated. That regulation is called an election.

    God Bless America.
     
  10. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
    I guess I mistunderstood this
     
  11. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Great Sea Urchin Cerviche

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Messages:
    2,914
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Los Angeles, California
    I believe in regulating business, as long as its not stupid bullshit. :cheers:
     
  12. THE HCP

    THE HCP NorthEastPortland'sFinest

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    71,470
    Likes Received:
    60,176
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    N.E.P.
    [video=youtube;SDoVl-g4UMs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDoVl-g4UMs&feature=related[/video]
     
  13. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
  14. Blazer_Hippie

    Blazer_Hippie Batum getting ballsy!

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2008
    Messages:
    1,857
    Likes Received:
    202
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Portland, Oregon
    Ah-Ha! Caught ya red handed! :devilwink:
     
  15. Eastoff

    Eastoff But it was a beginning.

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    16,058
    Likes Received:
    4,034
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tualatin
    damn you got'cha liberal news media! :shakefist: (i wish that was an emote)
     
  16. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    :clap::lol::cheers:
     
  17. number 10

    number 10 Our Savior

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    1,196
    Likes Received:
    19
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    Portland
    wow, I really didn't expect to be agreeing with you in this thread. Just curious, what are your thoughts on the whole "invisible hand" thing? By which I mean, would you agree that with the current corporate structure, managers are more interested in increasing their company's value on the stock market rather than actually increasing efficiency or the quality of their product?

    One thing I've never understood is why some conservatives (not directed at anyone in particular) seem to be automatically pro-business, anti-government. Personally, I think that both are highly prone to waste and excess, it's just that with a semi-functioning democracy, people have the chance to change who's in charge. As we've recently seen, incompetent CEOs aren't always removed by the board of directors. Whereas a democracy gives the majority of the population a slightly larger say in decisions that greatly effect them.
     
  18. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,303
    Likes Received:
    5,884
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    Stock prices are merely the market perception of the net present value of future revenues. Therefore, efficiency, quality and stock price go hand-in-hand. That's the beauty of Adam Smith's insight on the self-regulation of the market: Producers of goods and services search for profits; as more people try to achieve profit with the same product, the price goes down and quality goes up; the best products at the best price beat out the inferior products at too high a price. You get an optimal outcome without having to do a thing.

    The problem with government is that it tends to do the opposite. Since there's no profit motive, there's no desire for efficiency. However, I would argue that efficiency shouldn't be the first priority of a bureaucracy; fairness and access should be. That's why the role of government needs to be limited to only the things that demand fairness and access. I'm not saying that government shouldn't strive to be as efficient as possible, because the public's money should be treated as a sacred trust, but that occasionally you need to make sacrifices to ensure that everyone is treated equally. Rural post offices and schools are an example.

    Corporations don't waste money and don't make negative NPV investments if they know it will cost them the company. What gives rise to risky behavior by the corporations is when they know they're going to be saved by the government. The greatest danger to our democracy is crony capitalism, where business and government meet and pick winners and losers. Leave it to the market, and millions of people making small decisions will almost always arrive at the optimal outcome vs. one player making one large decision.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2010

Share This Page