MJ wouldnt have won 6 rings without Pippen. You can say the same thing. The thing is, Kobe will always be known as Shaq's sidekick. He will end up like Pippen in my mind. No one will remember him as a top 10 player because he never led a team to a championship.
That's completely wrong. Especially since because Kobe Bryant is probably the best scorer in the NBA right now and he had scored 81 Points in one game. And don't act as if Kobe's career is over soon, he probably has another 10 years left. If you look as his career as a book, Number 8 was the Prequel, and Number 24th is the second half of his career, the sequel. We don't know what will happen with his team in the next decade.
I doubt he will win another championship. People dont remember individual accomplishments. They remember great players leading their teams to championships. Kobe techinically never did that. Look at David Thompson. I think he had 75+. No one remembers that.
That's because that was done so many times by Wilt. No one but Wilt ever scored 81. Everyone acknowledges Wilt's 100. And how do you know he'll never win another championship? And Kobe and Shaq did it together. Shaq wasn't MJ, like he didnt do most of the work. It was 50/50.
It wasnt 50/50. Shaq was arguably the best and definately the most dominate player in the game. If you threw in another guard like Paul Pierce, I guarentee that you would win some championships as well.Wilt has posted 2 game scoring performances ahead of Thompson. Kobe is sitting where Thompson was. If they didnt show me the leaderboard for that mid season, I wouldnt have even known that Thompson was 3rd.
You know what? There's no point in arguing with you, you're just biased to the 10th degree and so close-minded its not even capable to have a debate with you.
When you score over 35 points a game and are named to the defensive first team in the same season, you're not gonna be forgotten.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ May 20 2006, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Looks like someone lost..</div>You didn't win, you just kept bugging me untill I just didn't feel like debating with you anymore. If you think you've won the debate, you're really ignorant. Basketball is all opinion.
I don't know how kobe bryant will not be remembered.He has broken nearly every franchise record Has a couple of Nba recordsHas a highlight realm which can only be touched by some playersScored 81Add onto the fact that people cannot stop talking about him. I personally know people who watch the lakers just to see him fail.
Not to mention, he has 3 Championship rings. Was part of the 1-2 Combo with Shaquille O'Neal, AND his team possibly had, and still does have lots of controversy.
Hey, when Kobe plays the way he can, I love him. Hell, I made a thread about how good he was when he tried, and about how I was loving his game. The problem is, whther he has to do it or not, he is a selfish player that simply becomes tiresome to watch.On the topic of comparing Kobe to LeBron at 21, LeBron is a better leader, rebuonder, scorer, and comparable clutch player. He is a much better player than Kobe, even though Kobe was a much better defender.
Now that's just being caught up with all the playoff action. No way right now is LeBron MUCH better player. I say Kobe has an edge right now. Like I said if anybody cares to read, LeBron's team is built around him. Kobe's wasn't. Kobe's a better shooter, better defender, better three point shooter, etc. I doubt the Cleveland Cavaliers were better than the Lakers this year, even with the better record. Remember, the Cavs are in a weaker division. And c'mon, they beat the Washington Wizards. Yeah, they've taken the Detroit Pistons to 7 games, but we took the Suns to 7 games also. The Cavs play differently than the Lakers, they play more like the Pistons than the Lakers played like the Suns, and the adjustment from the Lakers style to that new style they played against Phoenix was no easy deal. And also, mind you, the Cavs have only won VERY close games. And dont say it was because LeBron was clutch. It was, but like I said, being clutch is very overrated.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (AirBlaze @ May 20 2006, 10:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And dont say it was because LeBron was clutch. It was, but like I said, being clutch is very overrated.</div>Listen, I know you really like Kobe - Justifiably so. The guy is an incredible player, top 50 ever, and scarily becoming better. However, you really need to see LeBron play.LeBron, while he might not be as good an overall shooter, is a better scorer than Kobe was at that point in his career. 32 PPG to Kobe's 23. That's a ten point difference right there. Yes the offense was built around Shaquille O' Neal, but that doesn't mean Kobe didn't get his touches. At the time, Kobe wasn't as good a finisher as LeBron, and wasn't able to get into the lane like LeBron. You say Kobe was a better three point shooter, but during their respective regular seasons, LeBron shot 2% higher for three point difference. At most, Kobe was an equal three point shooter, and definately not a better one.LeBron is also a much better passer than Kobe was, averaging 7 APG to Kobe's 5, and doing it more willingly. You must also take into account that Kobe had superioir teammates, as LeBron's teammates this year have been inconsistent and mediocreLeBron is a better rebounder, averaging 7 RPG to Kobe's 6. Again, both rebound in the same circumstances, and rebounding is rebounding. If you get rebounds, you get them. LeBron gets more, he's a better rebounder.LeBron is a better clutch player. Not only in these playoffs, the biggest games of his life, has he recorded 2 triple doubles and averaged 30 PPG, but he has shown the ability to hit game winning shots and make the pass at the end of the game. Yes Kobe had a phenomenal game against Indiana, but LeBron has had more consistent games like that these playoffsThere's nothing Kobe could do then that LeBron doesn't do better now, besides defend, but again, Kobe is vastly overrated there. Don't even beign to compare the teams, because you'll only hurt your argument
I never said he wasnt still in the running. I'm saying that LeBron had no one to rely on when he was playing, and his talent is still easily better than ball hog kobe's. I'm sorry but LeBron isn't just known for beating our team in the playoffs, he's done greater things, and he beat the Wizards, we are not a bad team we aren't the trailblazers or something, and saying that that is the stupidest thing you've ever read in a thread makes me laugh cuase i have news for you dude, (your a loser)
Like I said before. Pippen isn't listed as one of the greatest players ever. He had 6 championships being MJ's sidekick. Kobe has 3 being Shaq's sidekick. You are only truly remembered as a great player if you lead your team to championships. Kobe has never done that.He had a spectacular year this season but he got out in the first round of the playoffs, so therefor it wont be mentioned as a great accomplishment. And thirdly, all of the greatest players have won MVP awards. Kobe has yet to win one of those, meaning that he has yet to lead his team to a great record.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ May 21 2006, 11:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Like I said before. Pippen isn't listed as one of the greatest players ever. He had 6 championships being MJ's sidekick. Kobe has 3 being Shaq's sidekick. You are only truly remembered as a great player if you lead your team to championships. Kobe has never done that.</div>You're crazy. THE NBA DOES NOT MANDATE WHO ITS GREAT PLAYERS ARE. Hell Dominique Wilkins was robbed of being a first ballot Hall of Famer. Everyone knows about the greatness of Scottie Pippen, and just because he was robbed of being on the NBA's 50 Greatest list does not take that way from him. He was still one of the best perimeter defenders, and he still played an integral part in those six titles.As for the whole sidekick thing, how many sidekicks can you think of that averaged around 25, 6, and 5 every year while making All-Defense teams and All-NBA teams at the same time.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>He had a spectacular year this season but he got out in the first round of the playoffs, so therefor it wont be mentioned as a great accomplishment. And thirdly, all of the greatest players have won MVP awards. Kobe has yet to win one of those, meaning that he has yet to lead his team to a great record.</div>How many of the greatest players in NBA history came from LA? Who currently holds a lot of the relevant records in Lakers history? As for MVP awards, Jerry West never won an MVP award. And that's just off the top of my head, I'm sure there are MANY great players who never won MVP.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Fouled Out @ May 21 2006, 02:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You're crazy. THE NBA DOES NOT MANDATE WHO ITS GREAT PLAYERS ARE. Hell Dominique Wilkins was robbed of being a first ballot Hall of Famer. Everyone knows about the greatness of Scottie Pippen, and just because he was robbed of being on the NBA's 50 Greatest list does not take that way from him. He was still one of the best perimeter defenders, and he still played an integral part in those six titles.As for the whole sidekick thing, how many sidekicks can you think of that averaged around 25, 6, and 5 every year while making All-Defense teams and All-NBA teams at the same time.How many of the greatest players in NBA history came from LA? Who currently holds a lot of the relevant records in Lakers history? As for MVP awards, Jerry West never won an MVP award. And that's just off the top of my head, I'm sure there are MANY great players who never won MVP.</div>Scottie Pippen is never considered by anyone to be one of the top 10 or 20 players to play basketball because he never led a team to a championship. He is still considered a great player, Kobe will be considered that too, but he will never be one of the greatest players like people think he will become, because he never led a team further than the 7th seed so far. Shaq is the one who will mostly be remembered for that 3 championship run. He was the one that anchored that team, not Kobe. He was the one who won all 3 of the NBA Finals' MVP. Kobe was just the #2 option that team, the sidekick. Look at Jerry West? Jerry West isnt remembered as one of the greatest players ever, are they.
