http://www.scribd.com/doc/33557136/Dallas-Org-El-Reno-Police-Report-on-Lona-Varner It seems they were invited in, and also asked for. Then when approached she just took out a knife and said she was suicidal.
Yeah, I think there's some threshold at which the police have a duty to not stand there while someone offs themself. That being said, I think the threshold has to be extremely high. If you've invited into someone's home, they should be able to uninvite you and tell you to get the hell out, even if you're a police officer.
I see no mention of the lady threatening to commit suicide, only threats to injure her attackers in self defense. Wanting to die is nowhere near the same as wanting to commit suicide.
Fair enough but what if the other habitant wanted them to stay there? Wouldn't that be reasonable cause to just check things out? Also if she looked unstable I don't blame them. The Police will investigate all kinds of suicidal people.
You guys are really saying that tasing her can prevent her from killing herself with a knife she is already holding? Can you explain how that would work? Just because you are suddenly in great pain, you now can't slice your own throat? Wouldn't tasing increase the misery and probability of suicide, not decrease it? As for your knee-jerk defense of tasers, I repeat: How did police deal with problems before tasers? Why are those methods no longer applicable? Have you ever thought of just grabbing her and not worrying about getting a little cut from a little old lady? Like police did before tasers? What happened to police being men, not self-protective sissies? Earn your pay, this isn't a bug you spray!
Dude, even a small knife can kill you in one strike. This isn't about an innocent old lady trying to rush them with just brute force. Tasers are dangerous as well so this is a complicated subject. Whether you believe in Euthanasia or not is another topic. An officer will attempt to prevent suicides and they were wanted there as well. How did people deal with criminals with other inferior technology? Who cares? Tasers are not to be played with, but if your life is being put in danger by a knife (possibly a large one not sure what model it was) then that is their purpose.
Who cares?!?! It doesn't matter that there may be better methods of dealing with people in this situation??? There were 10 cops there. She is 86 years old and disabled. It's not like she could leap out of her bed and mortally wound them. They could have grabbed her arm with a blanket or towel to get the knife away from her. They could have let her give the knife to her grandson. They could have used a broom or long stick to block her arm while the 9 other officers pried the knife from her gorilla-like grip. That's just off the top of my head.
Were her arms and hands disabled? A few months ago there was someone that died around here from a relatively short knife. So to me this is an important subject and I don't care how many people there were, if one of them dies in the process of trying to be cute with her that is a failure. If they leave she could kill herself, if they stay they could get stabbed. Saying "this is how it was back then" is valuable how? People had fewer options back then, not being able to ever use a taser is not a positive. There are various things to consider. I don't support ignorantly using a taser either, or stepping on someone's oxygen hose.
"Back then" before the advent of tasers she probably would've been shot and killed. Tasers either a) saved her life, or b) prolonged her agony, depending on what your belief is on an issue I won't bring up here. And shame on all of you age-ist, disabled-people-bashing, chauvinists that think a knife in the hand of an old woman isn't deadly.
Who would you bet on in a fight? The bed ridden old woman with a knife or the glass wielding 6 year old? The winner takes on the pregnant woman with an unsigned speeding ticket.
If you're too chicken to fight a woman sitting on a bed with a knife (and get this--she is threatening herself, not the cops), then you don't deserve a policeman's pay. You're supposed to be a hero, not a big sissy. Let a civilian come in if you can't do your job. Any man can handle it except one trained in police work. I'd have no problem taking over if I found myself in the situation. And in the past they would not have killed her over this. Duh. That "killing whenever you see something shiny" stuff is new, from the 70s. Before that obviously, they would have stood there like men and demanded the knife. If you're too chicken to grab her arm by yourself, then one cop goes behind, another in front, distract her, the one behind grabs it. The other 8 cops stand there talking about the weather while the two cops get the job done. That's how it would have been done before instruments of torture were legalized. Except that the useless 8 would never have been hired in the past and our taxes would be lower. Maybe "only children" shouldn't be allowed to be cops. Anyone who grew up with siblings, especially brothers, knows how to fight.
[video]http://vp.mgnetwork.net/viewer.swf?u=7b042e54e04a102da6fd001ec92a4a0d&z=RBL[/video] This is a little old but it's relevant to this thread. http://www2.wrbl.com/news/2010/jul/13/stun-gun-video-two-officers-out-after-woman-tased--ar-578842/
They'll never be prosecuted in the police state, but at least they were canned, which would never happen here (and especially in California). The police union would protect them. The best that might rarely happen here is that the Chief says they will get a penalty, but refuse to say what it is (because it's a 2 day unpaid vacation). And how did those posts get centered? They were aligned normally last I looked.
