Trip to Mars could leave crew 'dangerously weak'

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by Denny Crane, Aug 18, 2010.

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  1. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.2ce66fbf0dc554797b7d4cd3bfecee56.861&show_article=1

     
    Denny Crane, Aug 18, 2010
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  2. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Arthur C. Clarke invented the communications satellite, as well as writing some of the more realistic (feels realistic anyhow) Sci Fi. He has had this figured out for over 40 years:

    [​IMG]

    This part of the ship spun to make artificial gravity:
    [​IMG]

    And even his space stations had artificial gravity:
    [​IMG]
     
    Denny Crane, Aug 18, 2010
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  3. jlprk

    jlprk The ESPN mod is insane.

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    I think the idea preceded Clarke. Heinlein wrote a novel of a giant cylindrical spaceship that rotated. With concentric circles inside being floors for the hundreds of crewmembers, the farther the floor was from the center, the more the centrifugal force pushed people into each floor.
     
    jlprk, Aug 19, 2010
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  4. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    I have a really stupid question, but I'm not a natural scientist. Does centrifugal force exist in a zero gravity environment?
     
    maxiep, Aug 19, 2010
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  5. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Yes, because it's not gravity that powers it. It's the body constantly being launched outward (in straight line inertia) by the spin. That motion then being arrested by the surface between the body and space (the floor of a shuttle/space station in this case) is what "feels" like gravity.

    Edit: Just as a note, "centrifugal force" is only a "virtual force," not a true force. It's an illusion caused by the constant desire for the body to continue in a straight line, but constantly being arrested and thus kept in a circular path.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2010
    Minstrel, Aug 19, 2010
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  6. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    Thanks for the explanation. It's appreciated. Repped.
     
    maxiep, Aug 19, 2010
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  7. chris_in_pdx

    chris_in_pdx OLD MAN

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    Who says you learn nothing reading S2?
     
    chris_in_pdx, Aug 19, 2010
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  8. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    To be fair, the only people who say that are those that read my posts.
     
    maxiep, Aug 19, 2010
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  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    The point is to simulate something close to earth gravity with that centrifugal force so the astronauts' muscles and bones have to work like they do on earth. The weightlessness is what kills the bone mass and muscle strength.
     
    Denny Crane, Aug 19, 2010
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  10. Colonel Ronan

    Colonel Ronan Continue...?

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    So basically they're telling us it's not possible?
     
    Colonel Ronan, Aug 19, 2010
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  11. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I don't see the big problem, myself. Yes, you can't lift weights in space (well, you can, but it doesn't build muscle), but spring-based exercises should work just as well as they do on earth.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Aug 19, 2010
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  12. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Yes, that's why I said it feels like gravity.
     
    Minstrel, Aug 19, 2010
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  13. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Equip each shuttle with a BowFlex?
     
    Minstrel, Aug 19, 2010
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  14. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    The problem is they have to lift weights for several hours just to simulate the kind of natural "excercise" our muscles get from just keeping us balanced (standing upright) under gravity. Wouldn't we want astronauts to be doing interesting things like experiments and using their spare time for whatever leisure activities (aside from a mandatory several hour workout) they might concoct?
     
    Denny Crane, Aug 19, 2010
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  15. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Fuck no. They can sew together Nike shoes if they have spare time, then when the spaceship returns Phil Knight can lay off some Vietnamese.
    I don't know how many experiments they can do between here and Mars, the space between the outer limit of our atmosphere and Mars isn't all that interesting, and the experiments that do need to be done out there can better be done by robots.

    For that matter, manning the ship can better be done by robots, and they probably don't need as much exercise, and can sew shoes faster too.

    barfo
     
    barfo, Aug 19, 2010
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  16. BLAZER PROPHET

    BLAZER PROPHET Well-Known Member

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    I'm sorry, Dave, you can't say that.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukeHdiszZmE
     
    BLAZER PROPHET, Aug 19, 2010
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  17. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    the problem is when they get there. The "space suits" we have right now are great for stopping cosmic and solar radiation, as well as staying pressurized, warm, and oxygenated. The problem is that they weight a ton. In space or on the moon it's not a horrible problem. On Mars it will be. And if the astronauts are weakened by 6 months of doing zilch, it's going to be that much harder.

    Maybe the astronauts could shake-weight?
     
    BrianFromWA, Aug 19, 2010
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  18. BLAZER PROPHET

    BLAZER PROPHET Well-Known Member

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    Or germ free broads.
     
    BLAZER PROPHET, Aug 19, 2010
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  19. jlprk

    jlprk The ESPN mod is insane.

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    Astronauts already exercise heavily at least a couple hours daily, on million-dollar machines like COLBERT. The OP article assumes such exercise, yet still predicts much bone loss on a long trip (as articles before it have, too).

    To make centrifugal force feel vertical and not horizontal through the concentric floors, you need a ship bigger than ISS.
     
    jlprk, Aug 20, 2010
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  20. rocketeer

    rocketeer Active Member

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    obviously you aren't correct or else this wouldn't be considered a problem by anyone.

    either that or the articles claims are incorrect.
     
    rocketeer, Aug 20, 2010
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