Guess the starting lineup for Wednesday

Whoa, you're really going on a limb with this one SST! Good thing Noah's been working on that 3 pt. shot so much!

Yeah, I think Taj will start.

It'll be

Noah
Taj
Luol
Bogans
Rose

There's an outside chance that Brewer will start...very outside. He's just not ready.

Even more unlikely that Asik will start, but still possible.

And, they extend James

 

Noah
Taj
Deng
Bogans
Rose

6th : Asik
7th : Brewer
8th : Watson
9th : Korver

Ultimately, Boozer knocks Taj out of the core 9 man rotation and James Johnson knocks Keith Bogans out of the 9 man rotation with Brewer starting at the 2 backed by Korver and JJ backing Deng at the 3.

 

Taj is not getting kicked out the top 9.

I'm with you on Brewer and Bogans, but...there are some tough decisions to make. I'd rather that than all these injuries, that's for sure.

 

He will if we want to win.

Asik is > Taj.

7'1 and 255 beats 6'9 and 225.

I believe that Omer is already as good as positonal defender , he's stronger , a better rebounder and a better shotblocker ( both on man and as a help defender )

He will get minutes while Boozer is out without question and by the end of that time the decision should be absolutely clear that its Omer over Taj.

And ok... he can't shoot free throws but he's got just as good as hands as Taj and is probably more effective than him as a post target or on the finish if he's running the floor .

The only things Taj has on him in free throws , a J from the elbow ( notwithstanding that Taj's ugly spastic fucking action tends to brick em too heavy ) and regularly letting Neil Funk polish his nob.

Taj is a joke.

In fact , Taj is the Kirk Hinrich of power forwards

And if I hear Stacy fucking King make a lunch pail hard hat reference when talking about Taj one more time I'm going to spew my guts up.

 

My dear thunder ,

Taj averaged a very mediocre 6.3 rebounds in 28mpg last season. Omer can do that ( and more ) in 20mpg now. I don't accept that Taj is a better rebounder than Omer as it stands.

Furthermore , Taj racked up 5 fouls per 28mpg last season. I expect Omer to be have a decent foul rate , but , watching some of the stuff he has been called on through the preseason has been rubbish and have been clean plays.

I think with players like Taj and Kirk ....a lot of commentators and fans get caught up in the purist mumbo jumbo of what they romantise in the idea of the player they label them as in what they over exaggerate them to be rather than looking at their true worth / effectiveness.

Watching Omer in the worlds and in the preseason he already is shown me he is a smart and versatile positional player who can get out and cut the penetration but then recover , front his man , as well as body up and disrupt with his length /size. I like his defensive awareness/smarts already and think he is a lot more ready than what a lot of us realise.

Omer playing initially out of necessity is a good thing and a month or so into the season when Boozer is back I reckon Omer will take around 20mpg as the 3rd big and I see him with a 6 and 6 type level of production with a couple of blocks in there and being an inhibitor.

Taj might be a good for 1 or 2 points in the same minutes ( by virtue of his better free throw shooting capacity ) but my money is on Omer being the more effective player by virtue of his greater size and disruptive defensive capabilities.

 

Maybe we can trade Taj for Mike Miller, since Lebron likes him so much.

I'm just not ready to count on Omer yet.

To say that Taj is the Kirk of power forwards is not exactly a slam on the guy. He'd take it, and most coaches would, too.

I'm not sure he's that good, and Omer has the potential to be a decent plus for the team, but if Taj is out of the 9 man rotation, he's traded. He's not going to sit there on the bench. He's worth too much.

 

I think they're all still just surprised that Omer can play at all. They're treating Taj as a lock... But you can see that Thibs really likes Omer, so it's going to come up, maybe sooner than the Beat guys think.

 

Since when does mediocre equal " a lot of value" ?

My point with Taj , as it was with Kirk , is that they are mediocre "system" players

And because they are this we as fans sell our ourselves short with the overt lovefest in how we spoolge for these guys just because they do basic things that are expected of them.

I am convinced they get talked up and romanticised in convenient labelling in the "identity- reputation game" that gets played in the NBA to some degree. Why guys like this in their mediocrity get talked up to ridiculous levels which ensures they'll always have a job and why guys like Ron Mercer were always battling uphill against perception.

Remember , Chauncey Billups was chewed up and nearly spat out until Detroit found him

But ....we have guys like Kirky and Tajy who eat their vegetables , say their prayers and hell.... probably love their Mom and apple pie ..... and we have buffoons like Funk and King continually making lunch pail and hard hat references which is all about them thinking they are providing a mirror to their working to middle class god fearing mid western good folk that makes their love of the Bulls all the more richer if they get provided their vicarous mirrors by these fucking clowns like Funk and King we have to endure.

See if they say it often enough...its like the Jedi mind warrior trick ...most end up believing it

But for the unmedicated ....Taj is still incredibly fucking average. He's nothing special . A dime a dozen . And I don't see what the point in trading him is unless its for an upgrade at the 2 ( and yes I see Rudy as an upgrade in terms of talent ) because all of Boozer, Noah and Asik have had their injury histories

Given all of this , Taj , would end up playing half the season in around 25 to 30 minutes a game if he was the 4th big in reserve behind the 3 in front of him.

And without the hate ....this is all he's good for . This is who he is .

Let's not get indignant and confused about that while we're indulging in Vllage People fantasies of our boy in a hard hat with a lunch pail.

 

I have already conceded that Taj can hit jump shots ....he's just not that great at it

I'd rather have a 7'1 255 energy big who's the better rebounder and shotblocker and who could be on the same level as a team defender 1 month into the season ...and who's going to likely have more of an impact beyond the fact that Taj supposedly has a J (as ugly as sin and heavy brick as it is )

 

Taj shot 48% of his shots from outside the paint last year and had an EFG% of 41.5% ....

Hardly even what you'd call "good' Merely average.

Per 48 Taj had an EFF of 14.5 compared to his "average opponent" at 17.5

Average again.

Maybe even slightly below.

Look ...he's a steady average system player. He's just not going to win you many games

Asik on the other hand is a bit like good Tyson when he first kicked in under Skiles and became a game changer on the defensive end .

And it didn't matter a lick that he couldn't shoot a J.

That's what we had AD for ( Boozer/Kurt )

And it didn't matter a lick he had no post offense.

That's what we had Fatso Curry for ( Boozer )

 

Average or not, the relevant metric is how he compares to Asik in the context of the offense. If we play Asik and Noah, do we have anyone who can step out and hit?

Should we go shoot ourselves because we'd consider playing Taj for offensive reasons, or has Noah improved enough to get us out of that quandry?

 

I'd like to see more Asik, too, but I think you're selling Taj a little short. He played most of the year with a bad foot, that apparently still hasn't healed. And the bulls were one of the top rebounding teams last year, so Taj was getting the rebounds that Noah wasn't.

Seems lik you want to knock guys like Taj and Hinrich for being system players and not being Antonio McDyess or Chris Paul, but somebody has to set picks and play a little defense, too.