It's been 13 years, and O'Neal still dominates the landscape. He is going to the NBA Finals for the sixth time in his career. He is four victories away from his fourth NBA championship. He has won more postseason games and postseason series than Bill Russell. He has scored more postseason points than anyone in history except for Michael Jordan and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.When O'Neal's 28 points, 16 rebounds, and five blocked shots eliminated the Detroit Pistons, it was the 30th playoff series that O'Neal's teams have won. How about this for an eye-opening number: Shaquille's teams are 30-9 in postseason series. His teams are 119-71 in the playoffs. That's a winning percentage of .626. Take away O'Neal's first entry in the postseason — the 1994 Orlando team that got swept — and his team's winning percentage in the playoffs is .636. Bill Russell is considered the greatest winner in American team sports history. Russell's teams were 108-59 in the postseason, for a winning percentage of .647. Russell led his teams to 27 playoff series.O'Neal has played in 188 postseason games, which means that this year he has already passed Michael Jordan, Dennis Johnson, John Stockton, Byron Scott and Robert Parish for postseason games played. If these Finals go six games, he'll pass Magic Johnson and Karl Malone and Danny Ainge. Only three players will have played more playoff games than O'Neal when we speak in two weeks. Those players are Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Scotty Pippen, and Robert Horry.Jordan, by the way, played in 124 playoff victories, not many more than O'Neal's 117. While Kareem Abdul-Jabbar won six NBA championships, his last two came in his 40s when he rode the back of Magic Johnson and James Worthy.http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/5663940Shaquille is carrying people, still, in his 14th season. He can't do what he did on a nightly basis, but he is scoring 20 points per game on a team that needs just 90 to win most nights. He's capable of eliminating the Bulls with a 30 points/20 rebound game, or eliminating the Pistons with his 28/16/5.O'Neal has scored 4,888 points in the playoffs. Only Jordan and Abdul-Jabbar have scored more. If Shaquille averages just 18 points per game and the 2006 Finals goes to six games, then O'Neal will be the third player to score as many as 5,000 playoff points.
During the 3 peat, he was playing Weak centers in Tod Mcwhatever, Aaron williams and all the other losers he faced [only good centers he faced in the finals were Hakeem and Dikembe]. I had to point that our Besides that, Shaq is one of the greatest players of all time.
It's good to point this out, whenever he comes into the picture, you're sure to go far in the playoffs. Everywhere he goes he brings success, and other factors contribute but it's definitely no coincidence.It's no surprise he's in the finals... for me it's like I see him every year just dominating, and that's what he does.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo_061 @ Jun 8 2006, 06:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>During the 3 peat, he was playing Weak centers in Tod Mcwhatever, Aaron williams and all the other losers he faced [only good centers he faced in the finals were Hakeem and Dikembe]. I had to point that our Besides that, Shaq is one of the greatest players of all time.</div>So you rip Shaq... Then call him one of the greatest. It's like you throw out stuff to make it look like you are knowledgable, but it makes no sense. You don't point out a major negative about a players career, then point out something like - "He's one of the greatest"
Shaq is the man half of the time. The other times, he is lazy, slow and gets into foul trouble. The point i'm making is that Shaq is below average alot of the time because of his size, age and weight and height combined together.
Shaq is above average still, but he's not ''the man'' anymore. The reason he makes teams better is not neccesarily what he does, but what he makes coaches do to gameplan to stop a man that huge, which in turn opens up plays for others on the offense, which is a huge part of why his teams have done so well, espically in the modern era.
And Shaq is also lucky to have another star player with him all the time, i'm not saying he isn't great or anything but he's always had another great swingman with him to help him.
I had to point it out, he did face weak competition in the final series. His stats in the finals are skewed.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ Jun 8 2006, 04:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Shaq is the man half of the time. The other times, he is lazy, slow and gets into foul trouble. The point i'm making is that Shaq is below average alot of the time because of his size, age and weight and height combined together.</div>I disagree. His statistics show him to be one of the most consistent players in NBA History. He shot around 60% from the field. Also, unlike all these players who have 7-28 shooting nights, he very rarely has a bad game. He's about as dependable as they come.He has, however, been out of shape a few times and took a less than aggressive approach to the start of the 2002-03 season. Other than that, there's not much to complain about.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo_061 @ Jun 8 2006, 06:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>During the 3 peat, he was playing Weak centers in Tod Mcwhatever, Aaron williams and all the other losers he faced [only good centers he faced in the finals were Hakeem and Dikembe]. I had to point that our Besides that, Shaq is one of the greatest players of all time.</div>And let me point out that if Shaq stayed and Kobe left LA, you would be saying the same exact thing about Kobe saying: "Cummon, Kerry Kittles and Lucious Harris were quarding him." Sorry I just had to point that out. Shaq was probably 70% of Lakers fans favorite player 5 years ago, but now that he's gone, everyone finds any little detail and turns it into a Shaq bashing. How about you say that he got past DAVID ROBINSON, TIM DUNCAN, and CHRIS WEBBER to get to the Finals.Anyway, on topic, great post Balla, and a lot of great statistical facts. Shaq is still the best center in the league, no question. He still changes every opposing team's outlook on defensive schemes. I mean you can't just double him in the paint because he is an excellent passer in the low post and will find the open man. You also can't just leave him 1-on-1 down there, because he WILL score or get fouled 90% of the time. I mean Shaq still has it. Sure, he may not be able to put up 28/13/3 anymore every night, but he does still have his nights (ala game 6 vs. Detroit and that 30/20 game vs. Chicago).People knock on him a little now, saying "oh he's on his decline, he's not the same." Well maybe he is on his decline, but tha fact of the matter is that a 34 year old Shaq is better than any other center in the NBA without any arguments (except for the occasional insane homer). Sure, Dallas won game 1, but do not expect Shaq to slow down in the series. And really watch out if they lose game 2, because Shaq will go crazy at home. He knows when it's crunch time, and he will get it done, no matter what age he is.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Steampunk @ Jun 8 2006, 08:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I disagree. His statistics show him to be one of the most consistent players in NBA History. He shot around 60% from the field. Also, unlike all these players who have 7-28 shooting nights, he very rarely has a bad game. He's about as dependable as they come.He has, however, been out of shape a few times and took a less than aggressive approach to the start of the 2002-03 season. Other than that, there's not much to complain about.</div>But, if you are going to say that he came in out of shape one year, you should probably add in that after that he worked his ass off to get into shape again, and maybe even better shape.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticBalla32 @ Jun 9 2006, 03:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>And let me point out that if Shaq stayed and Kobe left LA, you would be saying the same exact thing about Kobe saying: "Cummon, Kerry Kittles and Lucious Harris were quarding him." Sorry I just had to point that out. Shaq was probably 70% of Lakers fans favorite player 5 years ago, but now that he's gone, everyone finds any little detail and turns it into a Shaq bashing. How about you say that he got past DAVID ROBINSON, TIM DUNCAN, and CHRIS WEBBER to get to the Finals.Anyway, on topic, great post Balla, and a lot of great statistical facts. Shaq is still the best center in the league, no question. He still changes every opposing team's outlook on defensive schemes. I mean you can't just double him in the paint because he is an excellent passer in the low post and will find the open man. You also can't just leave him 1-on-1 down there, because he WILL score or get fouled 90% of the time. I mean Shaq still has it. Sure, he may not be able to put up 28/13/3 anymore every night, but he does still have his nights (ala game 6 vs. Detroit and that 30/20 game vs. Chicago).People knock on him a little now, saying "oh he's on his decline, he's not the same." Well maybe he is on his decline, but tha fact of the matter is that a 34 year old Shaq is better than any other center in the NBA without any arguments (except for the occasional insane homer). Sure, Dallas won game 1, but do not expect Shaq to slow down in the series. And really watch out if they lose game 2, because Shaq will go crazy at home. He knows when it's crunch time, and he will get it done, no matter what age he is.But, if you are going to say that he came in out of shape one year, you should probably add in that after that he worked his ass off to get into shape again, and maybe even better shape.</div>Not really, kobe bryant dominated the Spurs who were a great defensive team. Kobe in the finals played second fiddle to shaq. Secondly, i don't bash Shaq for leaving. I bash him for his actions that caused his depature and then the aftermath, he's comments.And yao ming is better Shaq.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ Jun 8 2006, 11:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I dont think swingmen help Shaq be dominate downlow </div> Well you don't win with one player, he's always had a 25ppg all-star SG whereever he's played.
I think Shaq's skills have diminished greatly with age. If you watch a Miami game, how many of Shaq's points arent dunks? He no longer uses his hook shoot nor does he rely too much on any post moves, instead, relying on penatration for teamattes creating open looks for him as well as put back dunks on misses. He is obviously still a force because of how strong and massive he is, but I think the skill has deteriorated somewhat and he no longer does many of the things he used to do. I still think he draws alot of attention from the opposing team's defense which makes him valuable for his team because it creates open looks for teamattes, yet I dont think he is a single, dominant force any longer. I dont think you can just dump it inside to him outside of the paint and expect him to score. If he has position, he will finish with force, but if he doesnt have position or get an open look via penetration or ball movement, I dont think he is as capable of creating for himself any longer.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Steampunk @ Jun 8 2006, 09:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I disagree. His statistics show him to be one of the most consistent players in NBA History. He shot around 60% from the field. Also, unlike all these players who have 7-28 shooting nights, he very rarely has a bad game. He's about as dependable as they come.He has, however, been out of shape a few times and took a less than aggressive approach to the start of the 2002-03 season. Other than that, there's not much to complain about.</div>Consistent? This year he has been in and out of injuries, in and out of foul trouble. He is only Shaq-like half the time. THe other times he just fouls too much and is sloppy.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (hoopskidd5 @ Jun 9 2006, 11:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think Shaq's skills have diminished greatly with age. If you watch a Miami game, how many of Shaq's points arent dunks? He no longer uses his hook shoot nor does he rely too much on any post moves, instead, relying on penatration for teamattes creating open looks for him as well as put back dunks on misses. He is obviously still a force because of how strong and massive he is, but I think the skill has deteriorated somewhat and he no longer does many of the things he used to do. I still think he draws alot of attention from the opposing team's defense which makes him valuable for his team because it creates open looks for teamattes, yet I dont think he is a single, dominant force any longer. I dont think you can just dump it inside to him outside of the paint and expect him to score. If he has position, he will finish with force, but if he doesnt have position or get an open look via penetration or ball movement, I dont think he is as capable of creating for himself any longer.</div>I disagree, not many of Shaq's points come off dunks. Out of his 20 points I'd say probably 6 points would come off dunks but he still has his hook shot. He may not be as effective as he was when he was back in LA but he still demands double teams and can score when his team needs him to. If he doesn't have position in the post he will usually back down his man to the most and try to see if he can get a good shot off, if he can't he just kicks it out to whoever is penetrating or the open shooter.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Consistent? This year he has been in and out of injuries, in and out of foul trouble. He is only Shaq-like half the time. The other times he just fouls too much and is sloppy.</div>He only missed games at the start of the season and it was only 15 games I believe. He has been consistent all season and of course hes going to get in foul trouble at times, lots of calls go against him because of his big body.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo_061 @ Jun 9 2006, 05:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Not really, kobe bryant dominated the Spurs who were a great defensive team. Kobe in the finals played second fiddle to shaq. Secondly, i don't bash Shaq for leaving. I bash him for his actions that caused his depature and then the aftermath, he's comments.And yao ming is better Shaq.</div>LMAO a Laker fan saying Yao is better than Shaq. What else is new? I GUARENTEE that if Shaq was still wearing purple and yellow, you would make fun of anyone that said that. Guarenteed. Like I said, he was probably 65-70% of Laker fans favorite player of all-time 3+ years ago. But now that he's not a Laker, you all whine and complain about everything WRONG he has done. You had a top 3 center of all-time, in his prime, who gave you everything he had and brought 3 championships, and all you can do is bash him now? That's wrong, cold, and plainly idiotic.I mean 3 years ago, Shaq makes a comment that's funny, you laugh your ass off and say "Shaq's the man." But if he makes the same comment now, you say "That's not classy." Haha it just kills me.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Heatfan32 @ Jun 9 2006, 01:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>He only missed games at the start of the season and it was only 15 games I believe. He has been consistent all season and of course hes going to get in foul trouble at times, lots of calls go against him because of his big body.</div>He has missed around 25 games this year. I think that is quite a bit of games missed. He was not consistent all year. There have been games where he's scored 7, 8 or 10 points. That's because of foul trouble. A lot of times he is not a huge factor because he gets into foul trouble early on in games. He did this alot against the Bulls, and he has done it all year. Shaq is not "the man" he used to be. Face it.
1. I noticed an argument saying that Shaq can't score anymore, and only gets dunks off penetration. That is true in a sense, but not how you are looking at it. Last night in the fourth quarter, I believe Shaq got one touch in the final three minutes. During the regular season, Shaq averaged only 13 shots per game. Last night, Shaq got alot of turnovers because he was trying to pass the whole game. Shaq is getting less touches, and trying to involve teammates more, therefore scoring less. Shaq still has his hookshot, Shaq still dunks when angry, but is scoring less simply because he is trying to be a 2nd, perhaps 3rd option in the Heats offense. If you didn't notice how unselfish he was last night, something is wrong. The man is getting the ball less, and passing more. THhat's why he's scoring less, not because his skills are much worse. When he wants to shoot (Ala Game 6 vs. Detroit) Shaq can still do his thing with the best of them.2. Yao Ming better than Shaq? Are you kidding? Yes Yao Ming gets better statistics than Shaq, but thats it. I know that sounds stupid, because "stats tell everything." However, they really don't. In Houston, as a first option, I believe Yao averaged 22 and 11. In Miami, as a 2nd option, Shaq averaged 19 and 9. Imagine if Shaq was relied upon to take as many shots, and shoulder the load as much as Yao Ming? He'd be a definate 24 and 11 threat, the 2 extra rebounds coming from Shaq's ability to rebound his own misses. Plus, Shaq is still a superioir passer to Yao, and if his teammates paid attention last night, he'd have 8 assists to show for it. Both turn the ball over too much, and both are inconsistent from the line (Although Shaq is more consistently horrible). All you've got to do is watch them play, and you see that Shaq influences a game more than Yao, and does more with less.(touches) As mentioned, If you weren't so biased towards the Lakers melo_061, you'd laugh at that statement. If Shaq was still with the Lakers, you'd laugh at that statement. You are just saying that because you clearly have shown a dislike towards Shaq, and continue to push if further.
I don't think Shaq is trying to be a second or third option. I think he was passing because he kept getting double teamed, and he is useless at the free throw line (as if I had to tell you). He only had two turnovers, which wasn't that many considering how many everyone else had. It was a pretty terribly played game.But you are right about Yao, he isn't as good. Yao put up better numbers this year, because he had to. I don't think it's that hard to figure out that he had to up his game considering what team he plays for.
