<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticBalla32 @ Jun 10 2006, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>He is a leader</div>A leader who threatened not to play defense or rebound if he didn't get the ball. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticBalla32 @ Jun 10 2006, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>a man of his word</div>"I will never play for anyone except Phil Jackson" Shaquille O'neal<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticBalla32 @ Jun 10 2006, 09:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>and he really is a great guy too</div>Has had multiple mistresses, gotten drunk and been in fights at parties, jarred at teammates, and abandoned two franchises (I know LA traded him but he put them in a position where that was their only option).Anyways, easily Shaq. He's 7 foot 320 for god's sake, why wouldn't you pick him? Kobe's skill set is out of his world better but just the size and strength makes Shaq the easy pick. Can you imagine what a prime Shaq would do in the league of today? It would be ridiculous.
KMart poot it good.Kobe right now is easily better than Shaq, but putting them while in their prime just changes the entire story. This guy was a monster ever since he was in the NBA. His prime started before he was in the nba.Shaq in his prime by a longshot. Unless Kobe keeps his prime and does what Shaq did, which I doubt.But definitely Kobe of the now vs Shaq of the now.
I think Shaq is obviously the better player in his prime, but that phrase is the very key. Kobe is more durable and will easily be in the league for many years to come, whereas Shaq is coming into a sharp decline.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Jun 11 2006, 09:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>1 - A leader who threatened not to play defense or rebound if he didn't get the ball. 2 - "I will never play for anyone except Phil Jackson" Shaquille O'Neal3 - Has had multiple mistresses, gotten drunk and been in fights at parties, jarred at teammates, and abandoned two franchises (I know LA traded him but he put them in a position where that was their only option).</div>You Laker fans baffle me. It's like, Shaq was the only reason you won 3 championships, yet you continue to take shots at him that are undeserved.<span style="color:#FF0000">1)</span> Yes Shaq said he wouldn't play defense or rebound if he didn't get the ball, which was a dip-sh*t thing to do.<span style="color:#FF0000">2)</span> That is the worst attempt at trying to prove someone as dishonest I have ever seen. "Shaq isn't a man of his word!He said he would only play for Phil Jackson!"The reason Shaq said that, was because that was Shaq's coach at the time. That's what Shaq does on whatever team he is on: He tries to make everyone confident."I'll never play for anyone but Phil Jackson" - That was said to make Phil seem appreciated"Kobe Bryant is the best basketball player in the world" - That was said to inspire confidence in Kobe at the time, and perhaps make Kobe more willing to give the ball up"Dwayne Wade is the best basketball player in the world" - That was said to inspire confidence in Dwayne Wade at the time, and perhaps make him more willing to listen to Shaq"Damon Jones is my best friend, and best shooter in the NBA" - This was said to give Damon confidenceNotice the trend? Wherever Shaq goes, he says bullsh** things to make his teammates and coaches more confident, and also in inspire faith in Shaq. It's actually a great move on the part of Shaq. It has absolutely nothing to do with his word. Shaq saying he will only play for Phil Jackson was a statement made in the spur of the moment, in effort to create a relationship, and quite simply: A Shaq Response. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with keeping one's word, and the fact you had to bring it up makes me wonder about you.<span style="color:#FF0000">3)</span> Again, multiple mistresses? You actually believe Kobe Bryant?- This is a guy who cheated on his wife, something that automatically suspects dishonesty in anything he says- This is a guy who was clearly against Shaq at the time, while Shaq was clearly against him. This makes it more likely they'll bullsh** at each other, and make sh*t up- This is a guy who has historically had no friends on his team. I've seen specials on it, read it in books, and read it in newspapers. Aside from the company of his wife, Kobe Bryant is a lonely individual. He is a quiet guy who doesn't hang out with anyone. Therefore, with all the talent and media surrounding him, and with him trying to break out of his quiet personality to be a loud leader, of course Kobe is going to say idiot thingsListen guys, Shaq says allot of crap, I'll be the first to admit it. "Dwayne Wade the best player in the world" - Yea, my dick he is"Pythagorean Theorem spelled with two "Gs"? Sure (Or something to that regard)"Ericka Dampier could dominate the WNBA" Note to you: Eric Dampier is outplaying you in the NBA FinalsBoth Kobe and Shaq say allot of stupid things. Shaq has proven to simply be retarded, while Kobe has been depicted as a prick by the media, his factual actions, and his opposite personalities on and off the court. Add the fact they both shared a dislike for each other, and you can't take what they said about each other at that time into mind.And Shaq signing with another team is abandoning them? You arrogant, biased, disgrace of a basketball fan! I know my motto is:"First insult looses"But this situation is a different story. Players sign with other teams all the time. If I'm not mistaken (Which I may be) Shaq signed with LA after Free-Agency. Even if he asked for a trade, he was still with them for four years, and did more for that franchise than anyone. Yes he ripped them years later, yes he was obviously pissed at Orlando, but at the time, it was a clean process that didn't show allot of hurt on either end. What are you talking about?You are a Kobe fan correct? Well, Kobe was going to sign with the LA Clippers! He was actually heading in that direction. Do you see me, an obvious believer than Kobe is a prick, saying: Kobe abandoned his team because he wanted to go somewhere else after 8 years? NO! And again, don't insult Shaq for wanting to leave LA. Yes Shaq demanded a trade, something I don't support 95% of the time, yet, you being a Kobe fan... Kobe admitted that he would not have re-signed if Shaq stayed. Don't insult Shaq for wanting to leave, when Kobe wouldn't have come back for the same reason.I give up Melo, yes my posts are repetitive. They are repetitive because I keep replying and proving all these Laker-fans wrong about everything. It's always Shaq's fault. Shaq is a horrible leader.I don't care what Shaq has done, none of it is as bad as Kobe possibly raping a woman! Shaq has never had anything liek that landed on him. Even if that's untrue (Note how I said "Even if that's untrue") - Cheating on his wife!? You can say Shaq also cheated, but no one knows it for a fact. Kobe did it for a fact. You people absolutely baffle me!It's like saying:- "Don't kill animals!" As you ruthlessly beat one with a stick- "I hate underage sex" As you engage in intercourse with a fellow 14 year-old- "Johnny, you are a prick!" As you tell a harmless girl she is fatDon't say Shaq had other mistresses, when it is a fact Kobe cheated on his wife, and your suggestion is only a guessDon't say Shaq always fights with teammates when he actually makes the effort the be-friend members of his team, something I saw Kobe say he doesn't do much on national TV!I've really had about enough of this. Someone always finding a way to make Shaq look worse, while Kobe has done just as bad. Perhaps I am a culprit of this, the other way around of course, yet I have cut down on it greatly. 6 months ago I remember ripping Kobe every time I could; now I call him the best player in the NBA, and my opinions of him have changed for the better.You guys however continue to make horrid posts and pointless claims about both. Once again:There is a reason you Laker fans are widely regarded as some of the stupidest members of the board.<span style="color:#3333FF">Once you realize it, you will allow yourselves to expand upon your limited and basic knowledge of basketball.</span>
Lol, you finally see what i mean which repetitve. I didn't even read you're response because i knew what it was about.You need to ignore any kobe related topic because you're wasting your time.And oh Lakaboy, don't wase your time with k-mart. He likes to waste people's time. It isn't a coincidence that he loves Shaq and dislikes Kobe. I'm still thanking god at the moment that him and his contract are not on the lakers roster.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KMart @ Jun 12 2006, 03:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You Laker fans baffle me. It's like, Shaq was the only reason you won 3 championships, yet you continue to take shots at him that are undeserved.<span style="color:#FF0000">1)</span> Yes Shaq said he wouldn't play defense or rebound if he didn't get the ball, which was a dip-sh*t thing to do.<span style="color:#FF0000">2)</span> That is the worst attempt at trying to prove someone as dishonest I have ever seen. "Shaq isn't a man of his word!He said he would only play for Phil Jackson!"The reason Shaq said that, was because that was Shaq's coach at the time. That's what Shaq does on whatever team he is on: He tries to make everyone confident."I'll never play for anyone but Phil Jackson" - That was said to make Phil seem appreciated"Kobe Bryant is the best basketball player in the world" - That was said to inspire confidence in Kobe at the time, and perhaps make Kobe more willing to give the ball up"Dwayne Wade is the best basketball player in the world" - That was said to inspire confidence in Dwayne Wade at the time, and perhaps make him more willing to listen to Shaq"Damon Jones is my best friend, and best shooter in the NBA" - This was said to give Damon confidenceNotice the trend? Wherever Shaq goes, he says bullsh** things to make his teammates and coaches more confident, and also in inspire faith in Shaq. It's actually a great move on the part of Shaq. It has absolutely nothing to do with his word. Shaq saying he will only play for Phil Jackson was a statement made in the spur of the moment, in effort to create a relationship, and quite simply: A Shaq Response. It has absolutely NOTHING to do with keeping one's word, and the fact you had to bring it up makes me wonder about you.<span style="color:#FF0000">3)</span> Again, multiple mistresses? You actually believe Kobe Bryant?- This is a guy who cheated on his wife, something that automatically suspects dishonesty in anything he says- This is a guy who was clearly against Shaq at the time, while Shaq was clearly against him. This makes it more likely they'll bullsh** at each other, and make sh*t up- This is a guy who has historically had no friends on his team. I've seen specials on it, read it in books, and read it in newspapers. Aside from the company of his wife, Kobe Bryant is a lonely individual. He is a quiet guy who doesn't hang out with anyone. Therefore, with all the talent and media surrounding him, and with him trying to break out of his quiet personality to be a loud leader, of course Kobe is going to say idiot thingsListen guys, Shaq says allot of crap, I'll be the first to admit it. "Dwayne Wade the best player in the world" - Yea, my dick he is"Pythagorean Theorem spelled with two "Gs"? Sure (Or something to that regard)"Ericka Dampier could dominate the WNBA" Note to you: Eric Dampier is outplaying you in the NBA FinalsBoth Kobe and Shaq say allot of stupid things. Shaq has proven to simply be retarded, while Kobe has been depicted as a prick by the media, his factual actions, and his opposite personalities on and off the court. Add the fact they both shared a dislike for each other, and you can't take what they said about each other at that time into mind.And Shaq signing with another team is abandoning them? You arrogant, biased, disgrace of a basketball fan! I know my motto is:"First insult looses"But this situation is a different story. Players sign with other teams all the time. If I'm not mistaken (Which I may be) Shaq signed with LA after Free-Agency. Even if he asked for a trade, he was still with them for four years, and did more for that franchise than anyone. Yes he ripped them years later, yes he was obviously pissed at Orlando, but at the time, it was a clean process that didn't show allot of hurt on either end. What are you talking about?You are a Kobe fan correct? Well, Kobe was going to sign with the LA Clippers! He was actually heading in that direction. Do you see me, an obvious believer than Kobe is a prick, saying: Kobe abandoned his team because he wanted to go somewhere else after 8 years? NO! And again, don't insult Shaq for wanting to leave LA. Yes Shaq demanded a trade, something I don't support 95% of the time, yet, you being a Kobe fan... Kobe admitted that he would not have re-signed if Shaq stayed. Don't insult Shaq for wanting to leave, when Kobe wouldn't have come back for the same reason.I give up Melo, yes my posts are repetitive. They are repetitive because I keep replying and proving all these Laker-fans wrong about everything. It's always Shaq's fault. Shaq is a horrible leader.I don't care what Shaq has done, none of it is as bad as Kobe possibly raping a woman! Shaq has never had anything liek that landed on him. Even if that's untrue (Note how I said "Even if that's untrue") - Cheating on his wife!? You can say Shaq also cheated, but no one knows it for a fact. Kobe did it for a fact. You people absolutely baffle me!It's like saying:- "Don't kill animals!" As you ruthlessly beat one with a stick- "I hate underage sex" As you engage in intercourse with a fellow 14 year-old- "Johnny, you are a prick!" As you tell a harmless girl she is fatDon't say Shaq had other mistresses, when it is a fact Kobe cheated on his wife, and your suggestion is only a guessDon't say Shaq always fights with teammates when he actually makes the effort the be-friend members of his team, something I saw Kobe say he doesn't do much on national TV!I've really had about enough of this. Someone always finding a way to make Shaq look worse, while Kobe has done just as bad. Perhaps I am a culprit of this, the other way around of course, yet I have cut down on it greatly. 6 months ago I remember ripping Kobe every time I could; now I call him the best player in the NBA, and my opinions of him have changed for the better.You guys however continue to make horrid posts and pointless claims about both. Once again:There is a reason you Laker fans are widely regarded as some of the stupidest members of the board.<span style="color:#3333FF">Once you realize it, you will allow yourselves to expand upon your limited and basic knowledge of basketball.</span></div>I wonder how long that took you, because however long it did, you completely are wasting your time. Did I ever say Kobe was a better person than Shaq? Did I ever say Shaq was a bad person? Did I ever say Kobe is a good person? All I did was point out known facts to show that maybe Shaq isn't all he's cracked up to be.
And I was showing that:Yes Shaq says and does stupid thingsButon't point them out if the player you support daily does worse<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Melo_061 @ Jun 12 2006, 06:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Lol, you finally see what i mean which repetitve. I didn't even read you're response because i knew what it was about.You need to ignore any kobe related topic because you're wasting your time.And oh Lakaboy, don't wase your time with k-mart. He likes to waste people's time. It isn't a coincidence that he loves Shaq and dislikes Kobe. I'm still thanking god at the moment that him and his contract are not on the lakers roster.</div>Is this repetitiveness for you?I win MVP Poster awards and are respected while you... Are considered one of the dumbest members on the board and are genreally disliked?Again (Wow, that is repetitive!) not revisiting topic, because I don't want to get in more trouble
I think the only repetitive thing here is Melo's responses, it's pretty clear who has won this debate yet he continues.<span style="color:#FF0000">I know I'm a prick for doing this, but don't insult Melo - KMart</span>
I would elaborate, but I have sent Melo a PM for a truce.Melo only says his opinion, the same as you or I. I, as much as anyone, must give him a shot!
Obviously my responses are reptetive because i've had to respond to the same arguments. I sometimes copy stuff from previous posts because there's no point in me wasting my time.And this thread is dead.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KMart @ Jun 12 2006, 05:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Notice the trend? Wherever Shaq goes, he says bullsh** things to make his teammates and coaches more confident, and also in inspire faith in Shaq. It's actually a great move on the part of Shaq. It has absolutely nothing to do with his word.</div>That is completely contradictory.
Explain? I said that Shaq saying stupid things is a smart move, because it inspires confidence in whoever he says them about. He's not making a vow, promise, or anything like that, he is simply saying what he feels is right to make his teammates more confident, and by doing so, they feel better about Shaq himself
You said that his comments are BS. Then you said that's not a case of him not keeping his word. How is he keeping his word then? I mean, if he doesn't believe his own words, then it probably doesn't matter to him. But what about Laker fans? Should they not be annoyed that he makes up crap, then turns around and disrespects the coach that is the "only one he'd play for"?I agree with you to an extent on the inspiring confidence thing, but I disagree because eventually people will take his word as a lie. I am really curious if Pat Riley thinks he is the greatest coach Shaq has played for. How can he believe him when he clearly has made similar statements about other coaches? Same for Wade... does he think he's better than Kobe? If Shaq's claims are all BS, how does that inspire confidence?
Alright, let me use my experience as an exampleuring a game last year, my team was tied with the other team, six seconds to go in overtime and I was at the line (Believe me, I'm not making this up) Before going there, my coach said out-loud to the team:"We have our best free throw shooter at the line boys, call it a game"However, I was not my teams best free throw shooter. My coaches confidence in me however, gave me confidence in myself. I prceeded to make one of two shots, and we won by a point. I don't know if it was because of my coach of not, but I really needed that confidence boost. It also gave me respect for him, atleast for another week.Was my coach "bullshitting" or simply saying something stupid?Yes.However, did it still inspire confidence in me at the time? Yes!It's life and logic: If someone says something positive about you, and you believe it, you will feel better about yourself. Even if that particular person doesn't believe it, you will know no better, and you will take it as a plus.That's what Shaq did: He made his teammates feel better, look better, and sound better, all while making them appreciate him more as a leader. In short form: Someone says something nice about you, you feel better about yourself Even if Shaq didn't mean any of what he said, it was never a situation of Shaq being "untrue to his word" because Shaq never made any "word." It's not like Shaq told Phil he wouldn't play for anyone else. He simply told the media that, because he knew it would get back to him.Shaq never meant it, but he only said it to come as positive. He had no negative intentions, at the time he might not have even had an intention to leave, and was doing what he felt was right.From what I know, he never made any guarantee to Phil himself, he never made any guarantee to the organization, and therefore never went back on his word.
I understood what you said the first time, I just don't understand how saying, "I will never play for a coach besides Phil Jackson" then doing otherwise is not going back on your word. It doesn't matter who he said it to. If he said it and went against it, that is going against his word. I don't care if it is to inspire confidence. There are ways to inspire confidence without saying something you don't believe, are there not?
