This was pretty cool: http://youtube.com/watch?v=-nolNcJ1G7wonly the first part pertains to this topic.
That video was pretty decent except for a few completely irrelevant points. Most, if not all, people on Cops or World's Most [whatever] Police Chases are not terrorists."Wearing comical shirts that can be misunderstood the wrong way"Oh, as opposed to misunderstanding the right way!As for the passage you quoted BigMo763, that is indeed in the Bible. However, it has absolutely nothing to do with Christianity. That might sound silly, but it's true. Deuteronomy was written during the time of the Hebrews. There was no such thing as Christ at that time. Christ had not even been prophesized at that time. This is important because with Christ came the ability to evangelize and save people from hell. Before Christ, only Jews could be saved. Many people do not realize that with Christ came a new law and a new freedom. Quoting something from Deuteronomy or Leviticus doesn't exactly prove what some atheists think it does. Many times it only applies to Hebrew/Jewish people or is taken out of context, as the website you posted seems to do.I am not a Christian, but I was at one time, by the way.I don't think the Quran is necessarily a problem, but I do not know. I have not read it and probably never will, since I'm not really interested in religion anymore. It can be misinterpreted for sure, but I think the biggest problem is that many Muslim leaders are telling people that Allah and/or the Quran wishes for non-believers to be killed. What is frustrating for me and many others is that there is not a leader in the Muslim world that we know of that is attempting to establish peace as the foundation of Islam. If five percent of the Muslim world kills two or three people, it's going to cause people to have a pretty poor view of Islam. Instead of criticizing non-Muslims for misunderstanding Islam, Muslims should live good lives and criticize those Muslims who are terrorist. I think that's what the guy in the video was getting at, or attempting to at least.
"Wearing comical shirts that can be misunderstood the wrong way"you dont have to take it so seriously, he just threw in a couple of jokes -
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Justice @ Jun 26 2006, 05:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>If five percent of the Muslim world kills two or three people, it's going to cause people to have a pretty poor view of Islam. Instead of criticizing non-Muslims for misunderstanding Islam, Muslims should live good lives and criticize those Muslims who are terrorist. I think that's what the guy in the video was getting at, or attempting to at least.</div>That is the point I've been trying to make. It's not like all peaceful Muslims are just saying "oh, well the non-Muslims just don't know what Islam is really all about" and they just ignore the despicable acts of the terrorists who claim that they are doing what Islam and Allah tell them to do.Muslims hate what the terrorists are doing, and it just bothers us when people lump all Muslims as being terrorists or as being evil. We criticize the Muslims terrorists, like you say we should do, but we are still labeled as evil and what not, and thus have to "criticize" non-Muslims for their limited knowledge of Islam.Then again, its not really the non-Muslims' fault... it's all about what the media is spoon feeding them. I mean, its easy to sit there and believe whatever somebody tells you to believe, but if people really want to find out what Islam is REALLY about, the only way to do that is to read the Quran and actually research the fundamental values of the religion. That goes for everything in life... I mean, think about if you are doing a paper on basketball. It's easy to sit there and listen to somebody say "This player was the best player ever because he did whatever"... but you have to do your own research and formulate your own opinion, if that made any sense...
I'll still can't reconcile the fact that the Koran says you can kill unbelievers, and you yourself saying that you can see why terrorists can justify their actions, and you saying that they're actually twisting their words.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yozo @ Jul 16 2006, 03:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'll still can't reconcile the fact that the Koran says you can kill unbelievers, and you yourself saying that you can see why terrorists can justify their actions, and you saying that they're actually twisting their words.</div>I still can't reconcile the fact that it took you a month to formulate a response...Once again, the Quran says that the unbelievers will feel Allah's wrath in the AFTERLIFE, not in present life. How many times do I have to explain that before you comprehend it?Yes, I can see why terrorists use the Quran to justify their actions, because they are misinterpreting it just like you are misinterpreting pretty much everything I have stated. I have clearly laid out the true meaning of the Quran, and it's true teachings, but you somehow fail to see that just like the terrorists are failing to see the positive things the Quran tells all Muslims to do. The terrorists don't seem to understand that the Quran says Allah will take care of the unbelievers in the afterlife... he will be the one to punish them for not believing in him. No where in the Quran does it say that Allah wants us to go out and kill unbelievers. The only time we are "allowed" to kill them is if they continually persecute us, and we have exhausted every peaceful option to stop them. Now, if you really knew what the Quran was about, instead of relying on the media to tell you what it's about, then you would see how the terrorists are twisting the words of the Quran and the religion.Again, if Islam really was evil, then wouldn't the majority of Muslims be out there killing? Well, guess what... the majority of Muslims are peaceful! I still haven't heard any explanation as to how Islam can be evil by nature when in fact the majority of it's followers are peaceful and condemn the actions of the terrorists.I guess you don't have an answer to that, right? Nor do you have a response to the passage that I pulled out of the bible regarding the advocacy of killing disbelievers and innocent people, right? I guess you just choose to see what you want to see... similar to the way the terrorists choose certain things out of the Quran to twist the meaning of and use it to support their own sadistic plans.Hm... looks like I'll have to wait another month for your response...
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Once again, the Quran says that the unbelievers will feel Allah's wrath in the AFTERLIFE, not in present life. How many times do I have to explain that before you comprehend it?</div>And yet, it says that you can let them feel his wrath a little early by killing people in real life.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Again, if Islam really was evil, then wouldn't the majority of Muslims be out there killing? Well, guess what... the majority of Muslims are peaceful! I still haven't heard any explanation as to how Islam can be evil by nature when in fact the majority of it's followers are peaceful and condemn the actions of the terrorists.</div>Ever heard of fundamentalists and liberals? And why do these terrorists spend days studying the Koran is a small, hot, dusty room somewhere in the Middle, yet the Muslims sitting in their nice little room somewhere in Europe or America, profess to know to true meaning of Koran?And, might I add, if you were a Christian living in a Muslim country, you would be completely supressed, whereas Muslims can do whatever they want in America. And, according to your profile, you're from Texas.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Nor do you have a response to the passage that I pulled out of the bible regarding the advocacy of killing disbelievers and innocent people, right?</div>evilbible.com actually uses just about every English translation of the Bible, preferring none, just the one that sounds the worst. I could go through all of that, but just looking at the one you used: First of all, the original (Hebrew) translation said to take those who were unrighteous, not the innocent. It says "enquire, and make search, and ask diligently". In other words, seek carefully.Secondly, it doesn't say "From now you can kill all unbelievers, with or without reason". From your own mouth you said that the Koran said that.Right now, I really don't want to talk about. Not that I don't want to expound my views, but this is going nowhere, a fact you have already pointed out. You have not changed my views in the least, and I haven't changed yours. I suggest we draw this to a close.
[quote name='Yozo' post='116343' date='Jul 16 2006, 05:03 AM']And yet, it says that you can let them feel his wrath a little early by killing people in real life.Ever heard of fundamentalists and liberals? And why do these terrorists spend days studying the Koran is a small, hot, dusty room somewhere in the Middle, yet the Muslims sitting in their nice little room somewhere in Europe or America, profess to know to true meaning of Koran?[/quote]Please tell me where the Quran says that we "can let them feel his wrath a little early by killing people in real life." Again, the only time we can engage in warfare is if we are continually persecuted, and any and all peaceful option to stop it have been exhausted. That is not evil at all... that is peaceful, and we can only engage in violence if it is the absolute last option, but unfortunately the terrorists must have missed that fact.Also, if you acknowledge the existence of fundamentalists and liberals, then why do you continue to lump all Muslims into one category, and judge the entire religion based on the actions of a certain group? You don't see me or anybody saying Christianity is evil simply because the KKK exists, or because people are out there killing doctors who give abortions, etc.Alright, so I know nothing about the Quran because I live in America and not in the Middle East? That shows how ignorant you are... so then according to you all Muslims that do not live in the Middle East don't know "the true meaning" of Islam? If that is so, then how would you, living in Hong Kong, know the real meaning of the Bible and of Christianity? Yeah... you're not being ignorant nor biased, are you? Just a little fact for you... Muslims can't do whatever we want in America. Yes, we still have all our rights, etc., but we are still labeled as terrorists. Every time we go to the airports, guess what? We are the ones stopped for the "random" searches, and thats not all. I'm not saying we are being denied our rights or whatever, because we're not, but there are these small little things that have changed because of 9/11.The difference between being a Christian and living in a Muslim country and being a Muslim and living in America is the way the country is run. The main reason for the terrorists existence is because the government benefits from their existence (in that respective country), or they share the same evil view. So, obviously the government over there is going to protect them and harbor them, and thus will share the same views as them, otherwise they would not have allowed them to exist or they would be taking some measures to try and get rid of them. If President Bush shared the views of the KKK, he would be rounding up all the African Americans right now, wouldn't he? That's the difference... those countries in the Middle East are screwed up from the top down. Why do you think Bush wanted to hold free elections over there? To give the people a say... and to prevent evil "dynasties" to continually run those countries. Alright, so then when I have repeatedly stated and showed evidence that the Quran says hundreds and thousands of times to be peaceful, accept other religions and regard them as true and valid, that Allah is most merciful and gives the nonbelievers numerous and countless chances to repent and indeed accept Islam and the existence of Allah before he punishes them in the afterlife... why then is that any different from what you're saying? If you don't believe what the Quran says, despite the evidence straight from the Quran, then you shouldn't believe what the Bible says. If you do... that's called ignorance.Another thing, if evilbible.com uses the "worst sounding" version of the text, and thus cannot be regarded as a legitimate source, then I can find you things that are wrong with every "evilquran" or "evilislam" site out there, yet you would still call most, if not all, of them legitimate sources. Once again... ignorance. Wow, I didn't know you could hear me speak from across the internet! Anyway, enough sarcasm. Yes, we are allowed to DEFEND ourselves and our religion if we are continually persecuted in a violent fashion, and every peaceful option to suppress the persecution has failed. What is so wrong with that? So, if somebody was gathering up all the Christians and killing them (I'm using an extreme example here), you wouldn't try to defend yourself AT ALL, because according to you the Bible doesn't allow you to kill nonbelievers? That's fine with me... you can keep lumping all Muslims into one category, and regarding the ENTIRE religion and ALL it's followers as evil simply because of what the terrorists are doing, despite the fact that the majority of Muslims are peaceful. If you want to keep your ignorant views despite all the evidence that refutes a lot of what you have said, well, then go right ahead.Go read the Quran, take some time and actually put forth the effort to learn what Islam is all about. Obviously, the Quran is long and will take a while to read, but if you are truly interested in expanding your views, as you have stated, then why not read it? You will clearly understand everything I am saying if you actually took the time out to read the Quran in its entirety, and studed other books that us Muslims have grown up studying. But hey... who wants to put forth the effort when we can just listen to the media and think everything they say is true!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigMo763 @ Jul 16 2006, 04:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Please tell me where the Quran says that we "can let them feel his wrath a little early by killing people in real life." Again, the only time we can engage in warfare is if we are continually persecuted, and any and all peaceful option to stop it have been exhausted. That is not evil at all... that is peaceful, and we can only engage in violence if it is the absolute last option, but unfortunately the terrorists must have missed that fact.Also, if you acknowledge the existence of fundamentalists and liberals, then why do you continue to lump all Muslims into one category, and judge the entire religion based on the actions of a certain group? You don't see me or anybody saying Christianity is evil simply because the KKK exists, or because people are out there killing doctors who give abortions, etc.Alright, so I know nothing about the Quran because I live in America and not in the Middle East? That shows how ignorant you are... so then according to you all Muslims that do not live in the Middle East don't know "the true meaning" of Islam? If that is so, then how would you, living in Hong Kong, know the real meaning of the Bible and of Christianity? Yeah... you're not being ignorant nor biased, are you? Just a little fact for you... Muslims can't do whatever we want in America. Yes, we still have all our rights, etc., but we are still labeled as terrorists. Every time we go to the airports, guess what? We are the ones stopped for the "random" searches, and thats not all. I'm not saying we are being denied our rights or whatever, because we're not, but there are these small little things that have changed because of 9/11.The difference between being a Christian and living in a Muslim country and being a Muslim and living in America is the way the country is run. The main reason for the terrorists existence is because the government benefits from their existence (in that respective country), or they share the same evil view. So, obviously the government over there is going to protect them and harbor them, and thus will share the same views as them, otherwise they would not have allowed them to exist or they would be taking some measures to try and get rid of them. If President Bush shared the views of the KKK, he would be rounding up all the African Americans right now, wouldn't he? That's the difference... those countries in the Middle East are screwed up from the top down. Why do you think Bush wanted to hold free elections over there? To give the people a say... and to prevent evil "dynasties" to continually run those countries.Alright, so then when I have repeatedly stated and showed evidence that the Quran says hundreds and thousands of times to be peaceful, accept other religions and regard them as true and valid, that Allah is most merciful and gives the nonbelievers numerous and countless chances to repent and indeed accept Islam and the existence of Allah before he punishes them in the afterlife... why then is that any different from what you're saying? If you don't believe what the Quran says, despite the evidence straight from the Quran, then you shouldn't believe what the Bible says. If you do... that's called ignorance.Another thing, if evilbible.com uses the "worst sounding" version of the text, and thus cannot be regarded as a legitimate source, then I can find you things that are wrong with every "evilquran" or "evilislam" site out there, yet you would still call most, if not all, of them legitimate sources. Once again... ignorance.Wow, I didn't know you could hear me speak from across the internet! Anyway, enough sarcasm. Yes, we are allowed to DEFEND ourselves and our religion if we are continually persecuted in a violent fashion, and every peaceful option to suppress the persecution has failed. What is so wrong with that? So, if somebody was gathering up all the Christians and killing them (I'm using an extreme example here), you wouldn't try to defend yourself AT ALL, because according to you the Bible doesn't allow you to kill nonbelievers?That's fine with me... you can keep lumping all Muslims into one category, and regarding the ENTIRE religion and ALL it's followers as evil simply because of what the terrorists are doing, despite the fact that the majority of Muslims are peaceful. If you want to keep your ignorant views despite all the evidence that refutes a lot of what you have said, well, then go right ahead.Go read the Quran, take some time and actually put forth the effort to learn what Islam is all about. Obviously, the Quran is long and will take a while to read, but if you are truly interested in expanding your views, as you have stated, then why not read it? You will clearly understand everything I am saying if you actually took the time out to read the Quran in its entirety, and studed other books that us Muslims have grown up studying. But hey... who wants to put forth the effort when we can just listen to the media and think everything they say is true! </div>ehm...owned. case closed. BigMO has won this argument. It's over. K.O. FATALITY, UNCLE UNCLE UNCLE!!!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BCB @ Jul 16 2006, 10:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>When do you judge when all other options have been used?...</div>It's common sense a little bit, but I doubt the terrorists ever tried any peaceful method anyway.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>ehm...owned. case closed. BigMO has won this argument. It's over. K.O. FATALITY, UNCLE UNCLE UNCLE!!!</div>Thanks for your valuable contribution to this debate. I applaud you. :thumbdn1: BigMo, as I said, I don't want wish to continue this, so I'll allow you to have the last word.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Yozo @ Jul 17 2006, 02:52 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Thanks for your valuable contribution to this debate. I applaud you. :thumbdn1: BigMo, as I said, I don't want wish to continue this, so I'll allow you to have the last word.</div>You don't want to continue this because he owned you and laid out all the facts while you had no idea what you were spitting out of your mouth.Perfect example of a Muslim who represented a good image for Islam. Malcolm X. White folks discriminated him and he grew up hating whites, or "crackers" as he called them. When he was in jail, he reconciled white peoples after picking up Islam. Soon, he converted to Islam and changed his slave name to X. He said the religon of Islam had shown him peace and prosperity and that he had no longer had a hatred for any other race. He also influenced Muhammad Ali on this topic.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>You don't want to continue this because he owned you and laid out all the facts while you had no idea what you were spitting out of your mouth.</div>You seem very eager to tell me how uncled, nuncled, owned, and pwned I've been. And yet what have you contributed to this discussion? Well, let's see...In your exact words:<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Because people like the movie you ****face.</div>Yep, that's the only thing you contributed. Ya, I see it all now. Insult the other person, and then let the other posters back you up when he comes back with something real to say. Unless you can actually post coherently and in an agreeable manner, keep your oh-so-precious Malcom X sayings to yourself.
I don't have to say it in an agreeable manner, why would I want to agree with you?That post I made first,was before BigMo owned your ass.And it's true, it's probably one of the best, short statements. It got to the point."Because people like the movie"Yep, they do, and it's true.You lost the debate with BigMo, just admit it and move on.BigMo, laid out facts directly from himself, since he is a muslim I believe. YOU, however, thought you knew more about Islam than a real muslim does, which was actually funny. BUT, it turns out, all you know about Islam is the stuff the media tells you.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Island @ Jul 25 2006, 07:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>"Because people like the movie"Yep, they do, and it's true.</div>A lot of people like the Mohammed cartoon. And quite a few people hated both. What's the difference?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>I don't have to say it in an agreeable manner, why would I want to agree with you?</div>You are the message-board of Islamic terrorists who say "Disagree with me and I'll blow myself up and you along with me; you say "Disagree with me, and I can do whatever I want, call you all sort of colorful names, because, hey, you disagree with me." At least BigMo had the decency to post his opinions in a decent, polite manner, unlike a certain person.And you still haven't answered Justice's question. It appears you have been owned . But never mind, "You lost the debate with Justice, just admit it and move on."
