So if the Chairman thinks we are good for 4 ' chips with Derrick....

Discussion in 'Chicago Bulls' started by FatJerry, Apr 25, 2011.

  1. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    The Knicks don't have a "ton" of cap space. They might have some the summer after next.

    The Nets have $40M in guaranteed salary this summer. $37M next summer. That's not a "ton" in my book. They did have a "ton" of cap space this past summer and really did awesome with it: Travis Outlaw, Jordan Farmer, Anthony Morrow, Johan Petro. They are locked into those guys to the tune of $18M per year for the next 2 years. Well done. Now maybe they have 1/2 of that space which they can use 1-time.

    We will see about the Heat. We have a lot more assets to improve than they do IMHO. I'm also not sure if good players really want to go there an be a fourth wheel.
     
  2. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    Billups' $15.2M contract is not guaranteed for next season. The Nets have at least $15.3M in cap space this summer.

    The only difference between Outlaw, Farmer, Morrow, and Petro and the Bulls guys on 2 years contracts making the same kind of money is.... not much.
     
  3. bullshooter

    bullshooter Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2008
    Messages:
    2,175
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Outlaw is making $35/5, nobody on the bulls has a deal that bad. There is a big difference. I'd take the bulls bench and their deals in a heartbeat.
     
  4. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    So what? Expriring <> Capspace. Billups has a $3.7 M buyout. So they would be at mid $40M anyway. They won't have more room than a MLE. And no PG. No C. Not much beyond Melo/Amare.

    There is no CBA next year so what the hell are you basing that on. They have $40M in guaranteed deals.

    http://www.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/nets.jsp. They won't have that much space.
     
  5. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Except our guys are good and theirs suck.
     
  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    Care to prove it?
     
  7. bullshooter

    bullshooter Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2008
    Messages:
    2,175
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Denny, why are you such a bulls hater? You don't think the bulls bench played a huge part in why they won 62 games. How many did NJ win?
     
  8. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Ronnie Brewer
    Kyle Korver
    C.J. Watson

    Anthony Morrow
    Jordan Farmar
    Travis Outlaw
    Johan Petro

    Really? We got double the Win Shares out of our 3 guys compared to their 4. We also are spending $13M on them next year instead of $18M for Nets.

    Humphries played better than anyone above. He is a UFA. Wright is a RFA. Nets have Lopez and Petro at the 4 and 5 although I guess Outlaw plays some small ball 4. Nets will be lucky to upgrade their roster much this offseason given his departure and the cap room they have. Or maybe the just resign Humphries and go in with basically the same roster and 1 MLE guy. They also have the #27 and #36 picks in the draft. Jazz have their 1st this year (#6).

    But yea, they are likely to be better than us. They have a billionaire.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2011
  9. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    4,111
    Likes Received:
    210
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Turning out to be a nice divisive thread.

    Anyway, the Bulls won 62 games and that's a fact. Pythagorus only gave 'em credit for 61 and gave the Heat the same. 61's pretty good too.

    They're playing the playoffs now and it's kind of designed to tell us who's best. I don't know if it'll be the Bulls and it seems that the Vegas guys are favoring Miami, but I still like the concept of having the teams contest the thing on the court.

    As for the Knicks and Nets, if you want to worry yourselves sick about them, have fun...I'll sit out that dance, thank you.
     
  10. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    Divisive? I guess it's between seeing role players play 100% for 48 minutes vs. better players playing 100% for 48 minutes...

    I'd be really happy if we had a Pippen to Rose's Jordan is all. That would be a huge start towards being a no brainer type contender. Where even the Vegas oddsmakers favor us.
     
  11. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I don't think anyone is against better players.
     
  12. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
  13. FatJerry

    FatJerry Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Hopefully this might make my point better.

    At the trade deadline Orlando took risk to improve, Boston took risk to improve , the Knicks made moves to improve, the Nets made moves to improve.

    None of these teams were peddling out lines in the media that they were reluctant to make moves because they were concerned what the new CBA looks like and that they might be stripped of players and might not be allowed to resign etc

    Someone like Stephen Jackson could have been had ( in my opinion ) that would have been ( in my opinion ) an over the top move.

    Jackson has won a championship, can handle , can isolate, can defend , can shoot the 3 and would have lightened Derrick Rose's load considerably. A move like this , because of the extra freedom it affords Rose, would have made Rose even more lethal and therefore the flow on benefits in making the rest of the team better would have also accrued.

    Cost ? Ronnie Brewer and Keith Bogans plus our 1st round pick would have been a rational package

    But we had our balls in a knot talking about cost and uncertainty of costs and labour when a move like this would have carry over at a cost of $2m a year for the next 2 years.

    My concern is that not much has changed in the front office despite their recognition that they have the player that can deliver multiple titles to this organization and City.

    The question is : Does the front office expect that what we have is enough with a bit of chicken little tinkering or are they too going to compete with other front offices to take risk and build genuine , further, supporting assets to this team that will position this team at the top of the contenders list ?

    And if they think we can win 4 titles with Derrick and a bunch of supporting role players ( and yes Joakim Noah and Luol Deng are role players ~ super uber role players , but role players ) then Derrick will get ground down and end up being a more diminished player in the long run as his Bull gets misconstrued as the Golden Goose.

    And we all know what happened to the Golden Goose don't we ?

    This is the point
     
  14. FatJerry

    FatJerry Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    687
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    18
    And good move by the Knicks too

    A championship point guard with two all-star forwards and good young role players in Douglas, Fields and Walker.

    The following season when Billups option comes off they have $41m in committed salary and room to make more moves.

    Insofar as the Nets are concerned I reckon the only pooch they screwed was Outlaw. The rest of their contracts to Morrow , Farmar and even Petro make sense for bench role players and are on par with we paid for ours

    And if they don't resign Humphries what am I missing ? They will have a top 5 point guard , a top 5 Center and around 15m in cap room to play with won't they ?
     
  15. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    4,111
    Likes Received:
    210
    Trophy Points:
    63
    FJ, please help me with

    I don't remember this.
     
  16. such sweet thunder

    such sweet thunder Member Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    3,509
    Likes Received:
    78
    Trophy Points:
    48
    I think you've possibly made the mistake of believing the Reinsdorf was honest in his assessment that the Bulls will win four championships. I think it's more likely that, with the passing of this years' trade deadline there is very little opportunity over the next two years for this team to take on any additional salary. By that time, the story on this rendition of the team will have been written. Why not say nice things when there's no chance you will be forced to anti-up?
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2011
  17. such sweet thunder

    such sweet thunder Member Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    3,509
    Likes Received:
    78
    Trophy Points:
    48
    There was that bizarro unsourced press release in the Sun Times.
     
  18. JayJohnstone

    JayJohnstone Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    This assumes the cap is only $3M lower than this season. I guess that is possible. Still I like every aspect of our team better than the Nets even if they pick up a solid FA such as David West or Carl Landry.
     
  19. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    4,111
    Likes Received:
    210
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Thanks, SST. I have bizarro unsourced press releases on my ignore list, so that's why I missed it.
     
  20. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    Just for grins.

    Morrow 12.1 PER
    Farmar 14.1 PER
    Outlaw 8.8 PER
    Petro 9.9 PER

    vs.
    Brewer 13.8 PER
    Korver 13.0 PER
    Watson 12.8 PER

    But let's not cherry pick.

    Bogans 9.0 PER
    Thomas 10.0 PER
    Asik 11.8 PER
     

Share This Page