So, We're Leaving Iraq

was it unstable when we invaded them as a sovereign nation (that hadn't attacked us) and wasn't posing us any threat as our leaders professed? Hasn't it been pretty unstable ever since? Exactly when were we going to be free of our responsibility for having attacked them under false pretenses and destroyed their government and infrastructure? Can we agree that this was/is a very bad situation with no good exit option that should have been avoided from the get go?

I'm stoked the guys are going to be coming home soon. God bless them but good luck to those who's service is up on finding work stateside... especially with the Tea "Party" issuing a memo to it's business owner followers to pledge not to hire anyone until Obama is ousted.

STOMP

 

The problem, in my mind, is this: whether you agree or disagree with us invading Iraq in the first place, we have a responsibility to the people of that country. We destroyed the government and infrastructure of Germany and Japan too, but we stayed until the country was back on its feet and eventually an economic super power (in Japans case). Hell, we're still in Germany and Japan to some extent. I just don't want to see Iraq completely torn apart because Obama (or any politician for that matter) wanted to score a win with the people so he can get re-elected. Iraq is unstable right now, absolutely, and it is our fault. Period. We need to see it through until the country can self-sustain and we can limit our involvement to a minimum.

 

we should have never been there in the first place, we should apologize profusely and sulk away with our tail between or legs, and never ever do anything like that ever again

a fucking money grab war crime death machine, good riddance

 

Um sorry no. We beat Al-Qaeda back in October 2001, but the war goes on a lot longer than that.

Libya is a creepy place with a bunch of innocent people on the verge of being murdered. I doubt they'll be stable but we'll see. Egypt, Iraq, and Iran have never been stabilized. Lebanon was a huge failure too.

 

Iraq threw us out because Obama wouldn't budge on a few demands. The military leadership is not very happy about it, either.

 

If it took 60 years of the same insurrection bullshit we're dealing with now to do it, would you be ok with that? Do you want my 6 year old son to eventually fight over there? How about my eventual grandchildren?

Japan and Germany actually wanted our help. We didn't have a 9 year insurrection fight with either country. At some point you have to realize there are just some things American occupation just can't fix. Whatever we still owe Iraq, we'll never really be able to repay.

If Iraq is torn apart because Obama follows the will of the people of the United States, well, that's not crass pandering. That's democracy for you. This war has not had the support of most Americans for some time now. It's about time that the politicians who serve us notice this.

 

If by "we" you mean anyone who voted Bush/Cheney into office or subsequently supported the wars in the middle east, then I agree.

If you mean all Americans including those whose votes and efforts opposed the wars then you are way off base.

I owe nothing at all to the middle east and they owe me nothing but gratitude for my support of non-interventionism by my government.

 

Of course not. When they aren't given countries to devastate and "savages" to slaughter, they lead fairly dull and unimportant lives.

Iraq threw us out because they never wanted us there to begin with and they hate everything about us. And by "us" I mean the military industrial complex that slaughtered hundreds of thousands of people purely for profit.

 

Iraq wanted our help too. Many citizens from that country were overjoyed when we removed Saddam. Much of the insurrection was from outside the country. We were fighting insurgents from all over the Middle East, so obviously it's a different situation than Germany, but there was a Nazi resistance movement after the Allies took control of Berlin. It wasn't all white flags and rose petals after the Third Reich fell.

Of course most Americans are against the war. We're getting nothing out of it. There's no benefit to this cost. There's no "feel good" story to keep the American public motivated. That doesn't change the fact that we created this problem and there's a very good chance that things will completely fall apart once we leave. It is what it is.

 

If Iraq still wants our help, how come they aren't willing to agree to the same basic prosecution immunity agreement that Germany and Japan did?

Their unwillingness to abide by this requirement is entirely understandable, given the history. But it was their call. We told them we were willing to stay on if our soldiers were only accountable to the US military courts. We don't want our soldiers serving in a country where they can be arrested for not following local law.

What would you have us do? If an American soldier is accused of rape, are you ok with him being tried by an Iraqi jury? What if the trial happens to take place a few blocks from Abu Ghraib? Think he'll get a fair shake? That's a life sentence. I say that soldier is fucked, no matter what the circumstances are.

I fully support not putting members of our volunteer military in such a position.

 

If they aren't going along with the program, we obviously didn't do a good enough job of putting in a puppet government.

 

Not now. But it will happen if we decided to stay. Which is why we are pulling out completely instead of leaving in a small contingent like even the Obama administration wanted.

Any politician who tells you we should remain in Iraq needs to explain what they would do in this situation.

 

So that's great, we trained a bunch of their troops, gave them weapons and technology, and now they're kicking us out with a high probability that they will end up our enemies in the next ten years. Awesome.