And the US killed Iraqis by propping up dictators and giving weapons to Saddam Hussein. It is pleasant fiction to ignore our incompetence.
so did our ied's blow those people up, HK? Bush's fault? Military-industrial complex at work? Making a political statement to get the US out of their country? Nope. Just bad people doing illegal things.
Yeah fuck Bush too, we kill millions of People and still lose wars. The federal government has blown through our money.
...unless you invade a country, destroy whatever rule of law they had with house to house executions of anyone your informers say disagrees with America, and replace it with a massive torture state. 50 years from now, they may succeed in getting their electricity back. Most had 24-hour air conditioning under Sadaam. My world view is, of course, the same as that of almost all Earthlings and the majority of Americans. (I have previously linked to polls here showing that even at its peak of support at the start, the majority of Americans opposed the Iraq war. And it dropped fast from there. And I've linked to sources that 1.5 to 2M Iraqis died because of US aggression, and yes, some of those were the puppet state killing Iraqis.)
Then why do people like jlprk (post 3) bitch about a "prosecutorial" state, Maris (post 7) complain about a state where justice is doled out based on wealth (while stating with Natebishop that 2 guys should do 2 years for criminal mischief in Post 6 and 7), while multiple-time child rapists in Vermont getting 60 days, a rapist-kidnapper who got off 40 years early and did it again. Sometimes, jaywalking gets you killed (Dante Stallworth's prison term).
If you were a professional in intelligence, you wouldn't be showing off the goods. So you must collate information on people as the amateur that you are.
I enjoy it on the rare occasions when you show your red ass. The anger and frustration is palpable. You're a little teapot...
We all know why you have a phobia about your ass getting beaten red. Ever since racist Ben, speaking for everyone on the board, did the deed to you the night you went psycho over a picture of someone pointing a fake gun at you, you've recovered nicely, only because no one reminds you of what a horse's posterior you made out of yourself, huffing and puffing in dozens of posts that night, threatening repeatedly to sue him and the board, leaving the board, returning later under a different name, etc. Imagine if someone compiled a file of your greatest posts. It wouldn't be a pretty sight.
http://www.iraqbodycount.org/ 114,000 Iraqis killed. The million figure you cite must be the 300K/year children and infants that died prior to taking Saddam out.
Denny and I have cited dueling estimates before. In a war, governments try to control information, including such estimates, so some will be unbelievably low. ORB, one of Britain's biggest polling companies, found 1.2 million 4 years ago, so it's higher now. http://www.medialens.org/alerts/07/070918_the_media_ignore.php The famous Lancet survey had previously said it was 600,000. Whatever the number, we can all agree that the mass murder was pointless, history has judged the decision-makers as war criminals, and anyone for the war is evil. At least we have consensus.
Polling is the least believable source. Iraqis told us there were WMDs there, and see how that turned out? http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...IBAJ&pg=4537,345257&dq=lancet sanctions&hl=en
I agree that using polls to estimate war dead is an inferior method to the military disclosing its count. In all previous wars, the body count was not only published daily, it was bragged about to prove that the war was going well. During the Vietnam War, it was the proof that there would be light at the end of the tunnel. Alas, as we all know, Bush and his cronies are a different breed. Not veterans, just big spenders who campaign against spending, the cowards decided to keep the body count a secret. Obama is too weak to change what he inherited, so he joins the guilty parties. So we agree that polling is not the preferable method. The consensus continues, but for how long?
I wouldn't trust the government's body counts either. They have a PR interest in having the best their dead to our dead ratio as possible. At least IraqBodyCount is an unbiased source that is documenting each and every death possible. Including some number of deaths apparently documented in the wikileaks documents, the data is clear. Out of ~150K (including the wikileaks numbers), 25K were killed by the US, and most of those were Saddam's imperial guard and his military that we killed in action during the first 3 weeks. The rest are absolutely our responsibility, but they are Iraqis killing other Iraqis with IEDs and Mosque bombings and drive by shootings and the like. You cannot argue that we didn't spend blood (4500 US dead), treasure (several hundred $billions), or try to do right by these people (provide the best security we could for almost 9 years).
Sort of like getting drunk and driving your car into a crowd of pedestrians, and then saying, "you cannot argue that I wasn't hurt in the crash too, and I tried to pull the survivors out from under my car, after all!" barfo
Not at all. Ever notice barfo is a lot like blago? Same number of letters. Starts with b, ends with o. Same politics, too
I'll have you know I've never once sold a senate seat. However, I did have sex with that woman. barfo
