Evidence that god exists

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by MARIS61, Jan 30, 2012.

  1. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    No.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

    The Big Bang theory is the prevailing cosmological model that explains the early development of the Universe.[1] According to the Big Bang theory, the Universe was once in an extremely hot and dense state which expanded rapidly. This rapid expansion caused the young Universe to cool and resulted in its present continuously expanding state. According to the most recent measurements and observations, this original state existed approximately 13.7 billion years ago,[2][3] which is considered the age of the Universe and the time the Big Bang occurred.[4][5] After its initial expansion from a singularity, the Universe cooled sufficiently to allow energy to be converted into various subatomic particles. It would take thousands of years for some of these particles (protons, neutrons, and electrons) to combine and form atoms, the building blocks of matter. The first element produced was hydrogen, along with traces of helium and lithium. Eventually, clouds of hydrogen would coalesce through gravity to form stars, and the heavier elements would be synthesized either within stars or during supernovae.

    The Big Bang is a well-tested scientific theory which is widely accepted within the scientific community because it is the most accurate and comprehensive explanation for the full range of phenomena astronomers observe. Since its conception, abundant evidence has arisen to further validate the model.[6][7]
     
  2. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    I've already addressed your "first organism" dilemma in the other thread identical to this one (thanks a lot, MARIS...) -- nobody is claiming it happened randomly, so your calculations are pointless. The odds of a snowflake forming randomly in under a minute are also infinitesimally small, and yet they do every day, thanks to now well-understood interactions between water molecules.

    The Feynman quote is addressing the "can you believe the odds of getting a universe exactly like this one?!?!??" fallacy. If we didn't have a universe like this one, it would be different. End of observation. The universe would not be as we know it, but who knows how many different combinations of possible forces would have led to a stable one? There's absolutely no reason to assume that ours is the only "perfect" balance of constants.
     
  3. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Key words. "Extremely hot and dense state"
     
  4. crowTrobot

    crowTrobot die comcast

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    from His almighty noodly goodness
     
  5. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Yeah? Hence why I said "fine tuning"? If the universe was "life-less" without purpose; then you would have a great point. Unfortunately; it's constantly fixing itself; which in my opinion is serving "a purpose". And like I said before purpose = intelligence.
     
  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Keep reading. I don't see anything about self-replicating molecule.
     
  7. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    May we always remember to give thanks for the blessings of His Noodly Appendage!

    [​IMG]
     
  8. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    Wha??? "Fixing itself"? How do you figure?
     
  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    The odds of the earth forming are incredibly small. Let alone 300 sextillion stars - the probability of that would be practically zero.
     
  10. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    Good thing we have forces to get us through the randomness, eh? :)
     
  11. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    You don't think the universe is fine tuning? How do you explain dwarf stars, black holes, dark matter, red stars, movements of galaxies?
     
  12. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Ah that part. Yeah forgot that was Dawkins believing in the "self replicating molecule". My mistake.
     
  13. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Yep!
     
  14. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    I just looked out the window and saw 20 different cars driving past in opposite directions and at various speeds. Can you imagine the odds of seeing THOSE cars in THAT exact configuration of positions and velocities? Mind-boggling! So crazy low, in fact, that if I sat here and waited for the REST OF MY LIFE, I would almost certainly never see that exact configuration again! God must have WANTED me to see those cars like that -- how else can you explain my seeing something so ridiculously unlikely?
     
    BoBoBREWSKI likes this.
  15. TripTango

    TripTango Quick First Step

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    I don't understand this question at all. How do I explain that there is stuff that does stuff?
     
  16. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    Would be the case if "I video taped out my window and saw 15 different cars pass by in various speeds in less than 10 minutes. I didn't pay much attention until I realized that all 15 cars had one letter on the window. First car "S", second "P", third "O", 4th "R", 5th "T", 6th "S", 7th "T", 8th "W", 9th "O", 10th "F", 11th "O", 12th "R", 13th "U", 14th "M" and the 15th "S". Couldn't believe that it actually spelt Sportstwo forums! Amazing?!?!?!"

    You are over simplifying probability and you know it. Come on tango, you are better than that.
     
  17. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    So you don't believe galaxies are moving into normality? Be honest with what you know right now.
     
  18. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Odds do have something to do with the origin of life.

    As the big bang cooled, subatomic particles formed, and became (mostly) hydrogen. The hydrogen compacted due to gravity and ignited into stars. The stars created heavier elements. The key of these heavier elements being Carbon, since Carbon is a key atom in every organic molecule (that we know of).

    Stars explode and spew all these elements into the universe where new stars and other bodies form from the dust clouds.

    We know from looking at the spectra of stars that they're not made of the same atoms, though mostly hydrogen.

    At some point you have to say that conditions must be met for the precursors of life to be possible. Like a star with enough carbon goes nova and all that carbon is in the mix for making the precursor molecules.

    There is certainly some element of chance. If the cloud that our solar system formed from had little carbon, we almost certainly wouldn't be here.

    And the odds of you seeing those 20 different cars are 1:1 :)
     
  19. RR7

    RR7 Well-Known Member

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    normality?
     
  20. magnifier661

    magnifier661 B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

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    You trip me out Denny. It's almost like you are a closet theist. Are you debating just to debate?
     

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