Minnesota: full of shit (confirmed)

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Chuck Taylor, Jul 10, 2012.

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  1. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    June 30, day before the moratorium.
     
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
    #41
  2. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    and it's not a huge deal...if for whatever reason we don't meet the minimum, it just means that we make the difference up by giving bonus checks to our own players. There's not a fine or loss of draft picks or anything. SAC did this a couple of years ago, iirc.

    EDIT: They were close, but didn't end up paying. Additionally, there's a difference b/w "Cap Number" and "minimum payout of salary." Minimum payout is just that.

    So, let's say we just sign Nic for the 11M he wants and some other FA at 2.5M a year (leaving our cap number at 49.3M, right at the minimum salary line for this year). We're good, right? Not really. Since Wes had the "toxic contract" a couple of years ago, his salary for this year is a couple of million below the cap # and as such we'd be paying end-of-year bonuses out for not meeting the minimum.
    Conversely, lets say we sign Nic for the 11M and sign Lopez (for instance) to a max deal (starting at 13.6M). That would put our cap number at 60.4M, well over the minimum. Let's say that we now trade LMA at the deadline for a package of draft picks (no salary coming back). We would've paid about 60% of his 14M salary for the year (8.4M), but to the "cap number", he's now zero. However, that 8.4M is what's used by the league to determine the minimum salary payout. So our "cap number" would be 46.6M (well below the 49.3M "league minimum"), but to the league our "minimum salary out" number would be met.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2012
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
    #42
  3. Blazinaway

    Blazinaway Well-Known Member

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    that's cool, would rather give a bonus to the players as a group as opposed to signing one guy just to make up the diference
     
    Blazinaway, Jul 11, 2012
    #43
  4. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    BTW, Roy's salary also counts to that "minimum". So we don't need to worry about it. ;)
     
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
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  5. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    How?
     
    Mediocre Man, Jul 11, 2012
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  6. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    ...
     
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
    #46
  7. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    makes sense, right? I mean, the minimum payroll was to make sure that owners weren't being cheap and not paying players. No one can say that Uncle Paul paying Roy 16+M this year to play against him is being cheap.
     
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
    #47
  8. crandc

    crandc Well-Known Member

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    OK, I have a question for you capologists. People talked about calling Minny's bluff. Well, what about Portland? Can't Portland make Nic an offer right now? Is there any reason they have to wait for Minny to make the first offer?
     
    crandc, Jul 11, 2012
    #48
  9. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    No, but Nic doesn't have to sign the offer. Nic doesn't want to be here
     
    Mediocre Man, Jul 11, 2012
    #49
  10. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    The primary reason to wait is because we want to use our cap space before Batum goes on our books. If we sign him, he will eat up a huge chunk of our cap space, especially if it's for around 11 mil per year. I think we're trying to get everything done first and then if Minny hasn't signed him we will throw another offer his way.
     
    Natebishop3, Jul 11, 2012
    #50
  11. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    eyes brown
     
    3RA1N1AC, Jul 11, 2012
    #51
  12. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    POR can offer anytime they want to. But there's a catch here.

    Nic's pretty sure he can get 11M/yr on the market (at least, if you believe MIN). So if POR was to say "we'll give you a 4/32M deal, because that's what we think you're worth" then Nic can just sign the 4.4M qualifying offer, play out the year, and leave next year as an unrestricted free agent. We don't have the ability to trade him unless he agrees, because he'd be giving up Bird Rights to do so.

    Right now MIN is up a creek. They like Nic, they want Nic, they'd give up Webster and Miller and amnesty Darko to get Nic. But they have to do all those things BEFORE giving him an offer sheet. If we match it, they lose all of those players/trade chips and get nothing in return. Meanwhile, if we don't sign Nic to a contract he likes, he can sign the QO and we lose him in a year for nothing in return.

    Right now, it's a matter of POR trying to extract as much as possible back from MIN, b/c it's in both teams' best interests to get a sign-and-trade done.
     
    BrianFromWA, Jul 11, 2012
    #52
  13. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    So we can not trade him in February with out his OK? I did not know that, although i still think he would OK it if it was to a Playoff contender.
     
    Pinwheel1, Jul 11, 2012
    #53
  14. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    Time lines are

    Can't trade him period until December

    Can't trade him without his permission for the first year

    Can trade him to anyone we want after the first year except Minnesota (if they actually offer him a contract)

    Can not trade him to Minnesota for the life of the contract they offer him (assuming they offer him)
     
    Mediocre Man, Jul 11, 2012
    #54
  15. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    So it behooves them to make us a good offer.
     
    Natebishop3, Jul 11, 2012
    #55
  16. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    That being said I still think there would be a pretty good chance he would OK a trade after December. Minnesota is not the only team that likes Nic. There are plenty of teams that would need him once the season starts and players get hurt. Teams that also think that once he gets there he would want to stay. Teams on the East Coast that have a shorter flight to Paris?
    I doubt we would come out empty handed in that scenario. And that's if Nic doesn't change his mind and decides he likes the new coach and his role and wants to stay. Anything is possible.
     
    Pinwheel1, Jul 11, 2012
    #56
  17. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    I think I would feel a lot worse about Batum leaving if he wasn't supposedly commanding a deal in the range of 11 to 11.5 million per year.
     
    Natebishop3, Jul 11, 2012
    #57
  18. e_blazer

    e_blazer Rip City Fan

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    Yes Minnesota is full of shit. What's new on the Batum front?
     
    e_blazer, Jul 11, 2012
    #58
  19. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    no way, he would have to give up his bird rights, which in essence lops 20 million or so dollars off his contract, aka, any team acquiring him would be for a PURE rental, hence, crap offers in the first place
     
    3RA1N1AC, Jul 11, 2012
    #59
  20. Nikolokolus

    Nikolokolus There's always next year

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    Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

    Same here ... it's the number that makes me queasy -- he's almost certainly never going to live up to it.
     
    Nikolokolus, Jul 11, 2012
    #60
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