A damning picture

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by maxiep, Sep 18, 2012.

  1. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    It's cultural. We're a country unique in the world. Other than slaves, everyone else's ancestors came here looking for a better life. We're constantly being renewed by immigrants who come for the same reason. We're like the Borg in Star Trek; we come to this country unique, but blend the best of every culture to create an American one. There's a dynamism in this country that doesn't exist anywhere else. In no other country is there a feeling of unlimited potential if you're willing to work for it.
     
  2. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    our advantage is a magical idea that means nothing? because we have alot of immigrants means america is innovative? it really sounds like a load of shit, maybe you should run for office though, its a nice story :lol: i mean are you saying that americans are born with the "innovation gene"?

    are we even in the top 20 education wise anymore? because i would say that that would be more indicative of innovation than immigrants
     
  3. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    What's past is prologue when it comes to the American character. We lost the steel industry, we dominated the computer hardware industry. We lost computer hardware, we dominated computer software. Computer software topped out and we exploited the internet. We innovate.

    Our primary and secondary education are subpar, but our university system is still the best in the world.
     
  4. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    if our primary and secondary education systems were better, would it be fair to say we would "innovate" more? if there is no reason you see other than "we innovate" to why we innovate, couldnt it be considered an anomaly, and possibly fleeting? i just see no logical reason to expect it to continue if there is no reason for it.
     
  5. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    Because it's not our educational system; it's the culture of possibility. We're encouraged by our culture to think differently; to see opportunity and to build a better mousetrap. It doesn't necessarily take formal education; it takes guts, hustle and faith. We have an entrepreneurial culture.
     
  6. VanillaGorilla

    VanillaGorilla Well-Known Member

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    I think most European countries are encouraged to think more differently than we are. You're talking about the future, which means my generation will be a big part of it. I don't know what it was like to be 20 in the 70s, 80s, or 90s, but I'm fairly certain it's not heading in a good direction. American culture is deteriorating, and it's due in part to the internet and social media and all that. Obviously there are still a lot of people who are smart, motivated, and innovative, but I think American culture as a whole is on the decline.
     
  7. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Native Americans?

    Damn, we're the Borg. There's some high praise, all right.

    barfo
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Obama's going to win. Who cares how fucked up things will become. Resistance is futile.
     
  9. ABM

    ABM Happily Married In Music City, USA!

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    I'm gonna resort to playing the violin. At least the music will sound good.
     
  10. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Exactly.

    What I don't understand is why people insist that doing "X" will work (X is Keynesian stimulus) when it's demonstrable it doesn't. They insist on repeating the mistakes of the past.

    The whole point behind the jobs projection graph and Obama's "promise" about lower unemployment than we actually saw is that it is empirical evidence that the plan did not work as intended. So we saw the plan did not work as intended in the 30s, now we have seen it did not work during Obama's first term. Guys like Krugman wanted to spend even more than the $800B on stimulus, but the effect would have flattened and lengthened the recovery even more. Krugman predicted hyperinflation due to Reagan's fiscal policies, and he wasn't right about that, either - in fact the opposite was true; the inflation rate fell by 90%+.

    [​IMG]

    Now bluefrog posted that "Cutting govt. spending will put more people out of work and reduce incomes." It doesn't have to put people out of work. The feds alone spend about $15K per man/woman/child in the nation and simply doesn't employ but a tiny fraction of the workforce.

    That said, unemployment numbers need to be fully understood. Full employment does not mean 0% unemployment. There are always going to be some fraction of the workforce between jobs, so you end up with an optimistic 3% possible minimum or a realistic 4% minimum unemployment rate.

    When unemployment hits 8%, Obama and his ilk see 4% of the people who need 99 weeks of unemployment benefits. 99 weeks is going to be the minimum length of the flattening of the recovery curve - fully 1% of that 8% unemployed, at least, will take the benefits and not seek employment.

    The better way to look at the 8% is you have 8% of the workforce between jobs. Maybe 8-23 weeks of unemployment benefits to tide them over.

    "But there are no jobs!" is a bogus claim. Of course there are jobs, but people have to be willing to work them. That's not the half of it, though. There's no reason to assume that people have to be employed by someone else.

    When this recession started, there were all sorts of empty storefronts in my neighborhood. That is an opportunity, not a sign of doom. The landlords were willing to deal, and many would do free or low rent in exchange for a % of the take.

    When faced with the dot bomb bubble bursting and 85,000 lost jobs in Silicon Valley alone, people did not panic as unemployment went up by 25%. They hung tight and formed businesses in their garages, many of those succeeded. Without the 99 weeks, they had to.

    Which boils down to this truth: people are resourceful and when their backs are against the wall they find a way to make it. For the most part. Have faith in them instead of having so little you expect they can't find something productive to do.
     
  11. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

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    Asian land bridge. That's why I don't call them "native" Americans.
     
  12. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

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    I can't figure out what you're arguing.

    Do you disagree that America is and has been more innovative (yes, there are many different ways to quantify innovative) than the rest of the world?

    Or, are you disagreeing with the statement that the innovation is a result of the combination of our university system and cultural system?
     
  13. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    america - guts, hustle and faith

    :lol:

    thatll save us
     
  14. MARIS61

    MARIS61 Real American

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    They came here, presumably for the same reason, and they're no more "native" than you or I.
     
  15. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    umm, everyone knows native americans are jews that were cursed with dark skin for being evil and not following christ
     
  16. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

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    You don't want to actually answer a question?
     
  17. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    are you another one of these "we innovate because we are innovators!11!!" types? :lol: hustle and grit built america! and we still have it! sweat and steel and book learnin'! bed bath and beyond!

    our "culture", which all of you high waisted types are so quick to spout about, is of welfare and lazyness, right?

    you want it both ways? TOUGH.
     
  18. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Right... so when you said

    How does that make us unique, exactly? Wouldn't that be true of every country?

    Didn't the non-slave ancestors of, say, the Russians go there looking for a better life?

    Well, ok, Australia might be an exception, prisoners are neither slaves nor looking for a better life.

    barfo
     
  19. 3RA1N1AC

    3RA1N1AC 00110110 00111001

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    well, they ARE slaves, at least in most of america that is
     
  20. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

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    Do you want to keep ignoring my question?
     

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