Date ended: Thursday September 7th Topic: Who will be the most improved team next season and why?Rules: Keep it clean, No need to throw put instults and harmful remarks. You guys can just go at it unti the due date, Debate like crazy. If you both agree with the topic, See if you can prove your opponents points wrong, If you agree to the extent where there is nothing to debate about, Then say something and we will get you a new topic.Good luck.
I KNOW the NO Hornets will be the most improved.My reasons, 1. Chris Paul! He was a revelation last year.He is already one of the best PG getting around. He showed alot of leadership, he got his teammates involved and made the Hornets competitive. All that and he was a rookie!!!! This up coming season he has a year of experience under his belt and won't be making any rookie mistakes. He will improve in scoring and assists (peja will help here). 2. Peja, Now one of the main issues for the Hornets last year, was the lack of outside shooting, and shooting in general. Peja easily solves this issue. He is an allstar calibre player and can flat out light it up. He will give Paul some good backup and is a great scorer.3.Tyson Chandler, Tyson is a good defender and rebounder. He is young and will fit in with the hornets style of play. He will be given more playing time than in Chi Town and will develop into one of the leagues top rebounders. He averaged 9rpg in 26mpg last year, imagine what he can do playing 35 - 40 mpg!!!The Hornets were about 6-7 games out of a playoff birth. Paul's improvement on its own should make up that few games. Add Peja's 17 -22ppg and Chandlers 10+ boards to that and your looking at a 4 or 5 seed maybe even better!Who else out of the teams that missed the playoffs can make that kind of improvement?Answer = None of them!!
Sorry this has not been much of a debate so far. I will try to keep myself available to post tomorrow night at least once...I think it depends on how you look at it. One of two teams would be my pick for most improved next year.If you go by record, it will be the Houston Rockets. The reason I say by record is because the roster hasn't changed a whole lot, but if TMac and Yao return in full force, this will be a team in the middle of the pack of the Western Conference playoffs... probably a five or six seed. You can't tell me that NO gaining Peja and Chandler is going to improve them more so than Houston regaining a healthy Yao and TMac, not to mention Battier joining the club as well. They are going to improve record-wise a ton. NO might be able to get a seven or eight seed, in my opinion. And Peja is aging, so I believe his impact will be at best mediocre.As far as pure talent, I would say the Chicago Bulls. Now, I know the first reaction might be, "Well, they won't have chemistry, they can't beat the Pistons or Heat, etc." That might be true, but we don't know that yet. All we do know is what they have obtained and what they have lost.They've lost Piatowski (OH GOD NO), Songaila (a decent player but not irreplaceable), Othella Harrington (obviously they didn't need him or they wouldn't have waived him), and Eddie Basden (uhh, who?). What did they gain for such huge losses? Two great defenders in Adrian Griffin and Ben Wallace, a couple of great prospects in Thabo Sefolosha and Tyrus Thomas, and a few more decent players in Khryapa and PJ Brown. I can't see how anyone could not see them as the most improved team. They will go from being an on-the-bubble type team to a finals contender. Worst case scenario, I see them moving up to about a five seed.Also, the Bulls have actually proven themselves to be a good team. The Hornets have never made it past the conference semifinals in franchise history. The Bulls have been in the playoffs for the past two years, while the Hornets have been sitting at home. Both teams have made improvements, I will allow you that much. But the Bulls have proven that their improvements can take them past just being a regular season team. Until the Hornets make it back into the playoffs, I don't want to hear about them being a four or five seed. And there is no way in hell they would ever be better than SA, Dallas, and Pheonix. That is heresy.
I do agree with you that the Bulls will be an improved team, however they were already good! The jump from being a ordinary team (Hornets) to being a good team is often only one or two players, whereas the jump from being a good team(Bulls) to being a great team can be alot more! It takes a huge amount of intangables. Chemistry, the ability of coaches to get the line up right, and most of all leadership. Who do the Bull get leadership from? Sure you could argue Ben Wallace, but he's the new guy and has yet to prove he can gel. Kirk Hinrich? Well again he is a good player but not really the kind of leader they need to "glue" the talent together. Who else? No one I can think of. No-one can lead and bring that team together, at least no this coming year. Talent doesn't always equal improvements. Look at the knicks! The bulls have made HUGE moves to get better just like the knicks, they have brought in expensive talent just like the knicks. On paper the bulls have a loaded roster....just like the Knicks! I do not think they will flop like NY has but I think it will be at least a year before we see the promise of this team.N.O is one of those "ordinary teams" that one or two players will make a big improvement. And they do have great leadership. Chris Paul whilst young has proven himself to be a great leader. He is thier floor general and has single handedly taken them from the lottery to playoff contension. Like I have said they have signed the right players to fill thier needs. Now i dont think they will beat Phoenix, SA, Dallas or the clippers in the standings, I do think they can challange the rest of the west for the other positions!The Hornets will be the most improved team next season.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (clangus @ Sep 7 2006, 08:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I do agree with you that the Bulls will be an improved team, however they were already good! The jump from being a ordinary team (Hornets) to being a good team is often only one or two players, whereas the jump from being a good team(Bulls) to being a great team can be alot more!</div>I can agree with you there. This past year they gained the most of any team from what I can remember, anyway. But a big reason for that is Chris Paul. There is not a Chris Paul level player joining the team again this year. There is no way in hell you can tell me that Peja is anywhere near that level now. He will make a positive impact if he plays, but nowhere near enough to make them the most improved team.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (clangus @ Sep 7 2006, 08:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>It takes a huge amount of intangables. Chemistry, the ability of coaches to get the line up right, and most of all leadership. Who do the Bull get leadership from? Sure you could argue Ben Wallace, but he's the new guy and has yet to prove he can gel. Kirk Hinrich? Well again he is a good player but not really the kind of leader they need to "glue" the talent together. Who else? No one I can think of. No-one can lead and bring that team together, at least no this coming year. Talent doesn't always equal improvements. Look at the knicks! The bulls have made HUGE moves to get better just like the knicks, they have brought in expensive talent just like the knicks. On paper the bulls have a loaded roster....just like the Knicks! I do not think they will flop like NY has but I think it will be at least a year before we see the promise of this team.</div>And when recently has Chicago not been able to make the most of players entering the club? Skiles is a great coach, and I think Griffin and Wallace fit in perfectly to the system. And speaking of them, they are leaders. How can you ignore them? They've both had finals experience, and they both can bring a backbone to the Bulls defense. That is leadership, even if it's not verbal. The difference between NY and the Bulls is that the Bulls actually are bringing in players that they have room for rather than logjamming positions with star (read as: selfish) players. You cannot tell me that the guys they are bringing in are selfish like some of those NY players. That was a pretty piss-poor comparison.<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (clangus @ Sep 7 2006, 08:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>N.O is one of those "ordinary teams" that one or two players will make a big improvement. And they do have great leadership. Chris Paul whilst young has proven himself to be a great leader. He is thier floor general and has single handedly taken them from the lottery to playoff contension. Like I have said they have signed the right players to fill thier needs. Now i dont think they will beat Phoenix, SA, Dallas or the clippers in the standings, I do think they can challange the rest of the west for the other positions!The Hornets will be the most improved team next season.</div>I have trouble believing that the Hornets will be better than LAL or Houston next year. I could definitely see them missing the playoffs again entirely, too.I don't think it's at all ridiculous to believe that the Bulls could win up to 50 games. Then I can also see them winning quite a few playoff series as well. That to me is a huge improvement. And yeah, the Bulls were "good," if you call 41-41 good (In most leagues, that's mediocre at best). They will go from an on-the-bubble kind of team to a team that people actually fear. They will go from an almost certain first-round knockout to an eastern conference champ contender, at least.
*i'm not sure how to do that "quote" thingy. so sorry about not doing it*Firstly as far as Ben Wallace being a leader on the Bulls, 1. The Bulls are a hugely different team to the Pistons. They aren't a workman like team, who clocks in, goes to work and clocks out. They are a team full of young guys, energetic, enthused and no doubt a rambunctious lot. Wallace was a perfect fit in the Pistons. It will be an ajustment for him to just fit in let alone lead anything. Yes IF the Bulls put it all together its possible they may make it out of the first round. And that's a big IF! Wallace isn't the same gentle hearted guy he was a few years ago! Over the last season he has publically berated his coach and teammates, and refused to go back into games. And that was on a winning team! Look out if the Bulls dont win right away! He could be a real problem for a team who used to win games because of thier chemistry.And Griffin a leader? He may lead the queue to the showers but thats about it. Your correct my camparison the the Knicks wasn't right. I was trying to make a point, and usually the best way of doing that is to HAMMER it home with an exaggeration. However the Bulls are in serious risk of becoming like the Knicks. An injury here and a squabble there and thier once peaceful team could be in utter turmoil. I'm not saying that Peja is as good as Paul. Nowhere near. Peja will stretch the defense with his shooting (one thing the Hornets lacked, last year was an outside threat) and give CP more room to work his magic and Chandler to crash the offensive boards. Peja may not be a superstar, but he does bring scoring and long-range shooting. I mean the man has a career scoring average of over 18, that is going to help the Hornets a HEAP. Now why would they not be able to beat Houston exactly? Oh yeah Houston have two often injured players who can't seem to put together a string of games where they both are playing. Yao MIGHT come good on the injury front and Tmac MIGHT and they MIGHT be a better team. Sounds more likely they wont make a miraculous comeback to me.The Hornets clearly have a better chance of improving. They didn't bring a player who, in the twightlight of his career might be showing signs of trouble. They are not pinning thier hopes on a pair of unproven rookies (Thabo Sefolosha and Tyrus Thomas) and they adressed thier main need (a outside scorer). The Bulls main need was a leader they didn't address that problem, what they did do was get a player from another team who was a disgruntled employee (old habits die hard as they say) and a few role players.To sum up New Orleans got more "cogs" that will greatly improve thier team and Chicago got a few spanners that could do more harm than good.As I've said before New Orleans WILL be the most improved team this upcoming season.
Winner: JusticeFirst of all, I just wanted to say I disregarded any posts made after midnight last night since that was the deadline.The reason I'm giving my vote to Justice is simply because he seemed to put up the better argument in my opinion. Also, in clangus' response he said:<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>The jump from being a ordinary team (Hornets)to being a good team is often only one or two players, whereas the jump from being a good team(Bulls) to being a great team can be alot more!</div>That really seemed to support Justice's claim more than it did clangus', and that just really seemed to be the deciding factor in my eyes.As of right now, Justice leads 1-0.
Almost forgot about this debateWinner: JusticeLike Mo, any posts after midnight were disregarded but anyways, Justice put more detail into his arguement and simply provided better points. This debate was really just statements since the posts were made after the time limit.
Well, well, what can I say? Nothing, since BigMo already said it. Therefore, I judge Justice to be the winner. If you have arguements, refer to BigMo.Justice is now through to the last 5.
