Even if you like McCann better than Saltamacchia (looking at last years stats - pretty comparable) - not sure that I would have paid the older McCann almost 5 times as much (around $100M with the vesting year vs. $21M) and twice as long (6yrs vs. 3yrs). Seems like a pretty large disparity for 2 players that don't appear all that different.
Vette, although I for one like the signing of McCann, the similarities in 2013 stats are obvious. I think Salty has a higher K factor and they both are average to less than average on defense. I feel most scouts and GM's had McCann as a better player, but not a better bargain perhaps. As I stated in other threads, this is the price you pay for no farm system. I give the Yankees credit, at least they are using their only asset currently available to them, money. I pray that after this reset of quality players for 2014, the focus shifts to the player development side, with the occasional FA signing to fill one need ideally.
Major, I'm with you but how many years and resets already have we said this about trashman. He is clueless with draft picks and the player development staff doesn't develop anybody which is a bad combination. Until that changes we will be resetting again in 4 or 5 years.
...simple question, if McCann and Elsbury help to produce at least 2 more Titles in the next, 7 years, is it worth it?
A few "things" to consider. 1)Salty has been a semi-regular/backup catcher for the most part and McCann has been a regular catcher. 2) Career stats Salty----- .246 BA, .310 OBP, .428 SLG%, .738 OPS McCann-- .277 BA, .350 OBP, .473 SLG%, .823 OPS 3) Salty has struck out more times than McCann with 1862 FEWER career ABs than McCann. And from what I saw defensively from Salty this past post season, the catcher's position might be the LAST place I would want him.... lol I'll take McCann....even if it costs alot more. 4 or so years down the road, he should still be a dangerous hitter at Yankee Stadium as a dh or part-time 1B, My opinion- if he stays healthy, he'll be a very good signing/Yankee.
...Salty is not very good and simply had a career year in 2013...but that's enough for some to compare him to McCann.
McCann also boasts a respectable career CERA of 3.78, and a great CERA over the last 5 years, he's a great game caller, Salty not so much at 4.49, last year was his only good year, he's a pretty bad game caller. I know CERA is not a great stat, but still, the stat shows that McCann handles a staff well, and that must have weighed heavily on the decision, NY and Girardi like their catchers to know the batters and call a good game, that is very clear. Also McCann seems like a guy passionate about the game and wants to win, Salty may be the same way, don't know, but we have seen this with McCann so player attitude may also have been a big part of their wanting the guy bad.
Yes, for all of the reasons highlighted above…and his right hand bat was aided by the handball wall in Boston. He would have been an unmitigated nightmare here. McCann will win over fans in no time here.
Seeing that you're for this deal and the Ellsbury deal terms, I can only take away that you would rather spend $253M on McCann and Ellsbury than spend $253M on Cano ($200M) and Salty ($21M), and still have another $30M to use on other areas of need with this team (Pitching, 3B)? You can't keep rubber-stamping these overpays as "good moves" and not have a grasp of the bigger picture. If the Yankees lose Cano because they won't go to $200M, they will have spent the same amount of $$$ on 2 guys, instead of perhaps 4 guys (which would include Cano, who is clearly the best player in this group).
Please quote my support of Ellsbury's terms or stfu. I like the idea of Ellsbbury but the term and money are too much. AND if that deal in any way hampers the resigning of Cano then I hate it. I do like the Johnson signing, low money good utility player. Much rather them make that move then wait until Feb/March to pick somebody off the scrap heap. The McCann move is a great one to me. Best player available at that position that bridges you to Sanchez. The need for a McCann type could not be clearer, growing from the year Jorge left and highlighted most this past season. For anyone to call it a minor upgrade (RiverAveBlues) is absolutely absurd.
So if that's your stance (and yes - you were NOT one of those slobbering over the Ellsbury deal terms).....wouldn't you rather sign Salty over McCann, and use some of that "extra" $80M to make sure you get Cano locked up, and STILL have $$$ to sign another starter and perhaps a closer? For a team with as many needs as the Yankees have - you can't take a 1-off view of any one move, unless you look at the bigger picture. Now, if the Yankees sign Cano (which I think they will do), this makes things look better for sure, but spending $250M on 2 guys, and neither is named Robinson Cano IMO does not make sense.
No. Catcher was a huge need and they filled it with the best available option. I would rather they didn't sign Ellsbury and sign Cano if I had to make a choice. They can sign Cano and the debate is moot but my feeling is that a catcher was a must and Ellsbury was overkill. Love the fact that the best leadoff hitter in the game is here, it definitely isn't worth losing an elite player like Cano. So, again, don't tell me I'm blindly supporting Ellsbury's terms.
You still don't see how $80M more for McCann over Salty or $64M more of McCann over Ruiz has limited this team to fill multiple needs? I think you are grossly overrating McCann by a large degree if you think he is $80M better than the field, as opposed to a guy like AJ for 1 year at a time at $8M, Salty or Ruiz for a deal for half the length, and 20% and roughly a third, respectively. $80M is larger than the payroll of some teams, including playoff teams. And yes - you were not one of those all over the Ellsbury deal - my bad.
Vette, what is the variable here is this. It is pretty clear that the Yankees are counting on 2 things. (1) The Arod suspension will be upheld. (2) If it's not then 189 be damn, the Yankees lost 52 mil in just ticket sales last year. One of the reasons that caused this as you know was a knee jerk reaction to all of the injuries which are part of the game but the Yankees couldn't forsee all those lost games with the exception of Jeter. With that said, The Yankees will most likely pay between 30-60 million in tax penalties as they right the business model by adding marquee named players that people will (1) pay to see, (2) Pay to watch, and (3) pay for jerseys and all that goes with the licensing income. Don't you think Hal is running this portion of the off season, your points above are very true if the Yankees cared about money. To a point, everyone cares about money, and your argument would hold true for almost all the other franchises. But the Yankees are paying top dollar, I have always said that 8 years and 200 will be Cano's contract. At the end, he holds the leverage and the Yankees will continue spending to reload because they can. So in closing they will pay the 50% tax for most likely being 40 million over and around 239 with Arod's figured in. Is this the way it should be? NO.... But does making the playoffs every year except 2 normal or the way it should be? No... So to take this from 59, where I agree with him, if we win 2 World Series, which is no guarantee, would it be worth it yes. My final point, according to the experts a win is worth 7 million above replacement. If they, McCann and Ellsbury combine for a 7 up, they pay for themselves in theory... Until someone in Yankee land can get player development to a reasonable level, this is the business plan and the money and terms are the cost of doing business, Thank God they choose to do business...
MB - I think we would all sign up for 2 titles in 7 years if these guys helped make that happen, but we have to get those 2 titles in 7 years first. Giambi, Sheffield, and all the other in-between 2001-2008 FAs didn't get us anything at all. Comparatively, for the $423M splurge of 2009, we have 1 title in 5 years to show for it. Heck - I'm good with 2 titles in 7 years, if we start in 2009, meaning they get it done this year or next. BUT, unless Hal is willing to go all-in (and that includes signing Cano, signing 2-3 starting pitchers, a 3B, perhaps a closer, and whatever else on top of McCann and Ellsbury) - my fear is that they will stop prematurely, and too many holes will remain, and this becomes a zero sum gain. My concern is that while the $189M may be out the window, it has been replaced with another $$$ in Hal's mind (not sure what that number is), but that number may come into play. As such, questioning the $$$ paid to McCann and Ellsbury is legit IMO if it means that other holes do not get filled. And of course we know that none of these holes get filled from the minor leagues...
...I get it, they are bad deals now, but if they Yanx win 2 or more titles in the next 6-7 years, the deals then retroactively become good deals.
