<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Michael Bryant @ Oct 21 2006, 03:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Who's everyone? everybody on this site? There are a lot of experts and NBA historians who would take my side in that debate.</div>Find me one. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>No way, what killed the Lakers was them always falling behind by like 25 points and then having to make an insane comeback in the 4rth quarter just to have a chance to tie the game. TD's big numbers really didn't hurt LA, the Lakers were always able to deal with that quite well. Parkers penetration was troublesome at first, but once the Lakers started knocking him on his ass, he cooled off. Ginobili was big though, you're right about that.</div>Oh yeah, TD's huge numbers didn't hurt them, ok man
You people are forgetting how strong and quick Malone was in his prime. Duncan looks good because he is going against sub-par talent. other than KG what other prime PF were there in the NBA during TDs prime? Malone had to go against guys like Charles Barkley, Derrick Coleman, Shawn Kemp ect. Duncan isn't strong, like MB said he uses the backboard a lot because he simply cannot over power people to get to the rim. Trust me, if you took Malone and the Jazz during Malones prime, and put them against Duncan in his prime with the Spurs, Malone would win.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (redneck @ Oct 21 2006, 01:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You people are forgetting how strong and quick Malone was in his prime. Duncan looks good because he is going against sub-par talent. other than KG what other prime PF were there in the NBA during TDs prime? Malone had to go against guys like Charles Barkley, Derrick Coleman, Shawn Kemp ect. Duncan isn't strong, like MB said he uses the backboard a lot because he simply cannot over power people to get to the rim. Trust me, if you took Malone and the Jazz during Malones prime, and put them against Duncan in his prime with the Spurs, Malone would win.</div>Thats awfully funny that when you are naming 3 guys that Malone had to face, you pick Derrick Coleman who sucks. When the Lakers would play the Spurs in the playoffs, Shaq guarded him. He has to go up against Ben Wallace, KG, and there are alot of other shot blockers that he goes up agaisnt. Fine, you can say that Karl was stronger, but I find it rather funny how Tim Duncan was and is more effective in the post than Karl. And its also funny how he has some of the best if not the best footwork in the history of the NBA.(2nd behind Hakeem IMO) And its also really funny how Tim Duncan has had the same level of talent on his team if not less and he has produced 3 rings when Karl has produced none. And you can say all you want how he had to face Jordan, but Duncan has had to face Kobe and Shaq on the same team. And Jordan was gone from basketball for two years and the Jazz got their asses handed to them in the playoffs. Duncan is better and has accomplished more than Karl...case closed.
The Jazz got their asses handed to them by the Rockets during those two years, two very good Houston Rocket teams I might add. I wouldn't say the Jazz-Spurs teams were equal, starter wise yes, but the Spurs have much better and smarter role players. Derrick Coleman didn't suck, he was an all-star and was on the fast track to becoming a great, had he had the mental fortitude he would have been, same goes with Kemp. the NBA right now also has a lower level of talent than it did from 87-98, the years when Malone was at his best. look at the top bigmen from each period.87-98James Worthy, Xavier McDonald, Kevin McHale, Dennis Rodman, Derrick Coleman, Larry Johnson, Shawn Kemp, Otis Thorp,Charles Barkley,Anthony Mason, PJ Brown, Cliff Robinson, Tom Chambers.99-04Kevin Garnett, Ben Wallace, Karl Malone, Shaq...Look at the talent levels each had to go against, Malone put up better numbers against better Defenders than Duncan did against lesser defenders.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (redneck @ Oct 22 2006, 01:43 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>The Jazz got their asses handed to them by the Rockets during those two years, two very good Houston Rocket teams I might add. I wouldn't say the Jazz-Spurs teams were equal, starter wise yes, but the Spurs have much better and smarter role players. Derrick Coleman didn't suck, he was an all-star and was on the fast track to becoming a great, had he had the mental fortitude he would have been, same goes with Kemp. the NBA right now also has a lower level of talent than it did from 87-98, the years when Malone was at his best. look at the top bigmen from each period.87-98James Worthy, Xavier McDonald, Kevin McHale, Dennis Rodman, Derrick Coleman, Larry Johnson, Shawn Kemp, Otis Thorp,Charles Barkley,Anthony Mason, PJ Brown, Cliff Robinson, Tom Chambers.99-04Kevin Garnett, Ben Wallace, Karl Malone, Shaq...Look at the talent levels each had to go against, Malone put up better numbers against better Defenders than Duncan did against lesser defenders.</div>Are you telling me that the Los Angelos Lakers were not better than that Rockets team? Of course they are. They have two players that could be top ten of all time and they were in their primes when the spurs beat them. Its not like the Spurs didnt play agaisnt good teams to get there. And if I might have, they beat the Lakers very handidly. What are you talking about man? In 99, The Spurs had Tim Duncan and a over the hill David Robinson as their 2nd best player. And besides those two, the rest of them were role players. Karl Malone had one of the best PG's of all time on his team, and an amazing shooter who poured in a good amount of points and leadership for the team as well. The 03 team of the Spurs wasnt that impressive either. This was before Tony and Manu were good players and they had a David Robinson who got you about 9 or 10 points a game. Tim Duncan CARRIED the Spurs in 99 and 03 which is something that Malone never did.Thats funny how you got guys from 11 years when comparing who Malone went up against and you have 5 for Duncan. doesn't seem to fair does it? Another thing, alot of those guys that you listed were not that great of defenders. Clifford Robinson would have gotten abused in the post by Tim Duncan, PJ Brown was in his prime when Duncan was in the league, and the rest of those players are good defenders, but please tell me how they would have competed with Duncan? They couldnt have. Duncans offensive skillset is far to advanced. All Malone has on Duncan is "numbers". Fine, you can have them. But if Duncan wanted to put up the numbers Malone did, he could have. But when your team is winning 58+ games each year, and going deep in to the playoffs, I dont think putting up 27 and 10 compared to 22 and 11 makes to much of a difference.
the 2000s Lakers couldn't have beaten the 90s Rockets. We seen what Hakeem could do to Shaq in 95. Shaq in my opinion was better in 95 than he was in the 2000s. Clyde and Kobe would pretty much be a wash at that point in their Careers. though Kobe may have an advantage with better legs. Robert Horrys heroics would be a mute point because they'd cancel each other out. Kenny Smith and Derek Fisher are practically the same player. but the key for Houston would be their bench. they had guys like Vernon Maxwell, Sam Cassell, and Mario Ellie off the bench.but back to Malone-Duncan. I listed 11 years for Malone because he was dominate through 11 years, unlike Duncan who was only dominate through 5. which is another reason why I'd list Malone above Duncan, durability counts for a lot.Houston wasn't the only only team Utah had to face that was tough, they also had to face very good Seattle, Portland, Phoenix and San Antonio teams as well. while the Spurs had only the Lakers in the west. The Jazz from 94-98(after the acquistion of Jeff Hornacek) had a tougher time in the playoffs than Tim Ducan did (99-04).Something should also be said about the fact that when the two faced each other in the playoffs(98,03), Malone dominated Duncan. I will conceed that Malone was in his prime in 98 and TD was a rookie, but in 03 Malone gave Duncan fits offensivly.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Nitro1118 @ Oct 21 2006, 12:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Find me one.</div>I don't have them on a direct line but trust me, them and anyone who's seen the game in those days will agree. I guess you just had to have been there.Anyway...Malone was a badass. I don't know, when the Spurs had TD doing all the work(2000-2002) they went nowhere. TD has turned into Michael Jordan, he's getting help from great role players, yet he's getting all the credit.And yeah, Hakeem was a better center than Shaq.
