Doc Rivers: Bulls would be nuts to let Thibs go

Discussion in 'Chicago Bulls' started by kukoc4ever, Jan 24, 2014.

  1. truebluefan

    truebluefan Administrator Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2010
    Messages:
    212,768
    Likes Received:
    821
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good post. You pretty much said what I would say.
     
  2. truebluefan

    truebluefan Administrator Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2010
    Messages:
    212,768
    Likes Received:
    821
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I tend to think that as well. KK4E. It is no coincidence that a pt guard case a hell of a year for us.

    If derrick comes back as an all-star and not an MVP, we will be fine. I am worried about his knees and wonder how much explosiveness he will have. Once Iverson started getting hurt his game declined rapidly. Same was true for McGrady. Although Tracy had a bad back.
     
  3. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    4,111
    Likes Received:
    210
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Caché. Nice.

    As cool a word as that is, I'm not sure I buy it for NYC. Most recently, they got the great "Melo" because he wanted to return home. They got Stoudemire by grossly overpaying. What other stud FA's did the Big Apple attract in the past 10 years that weren't all about overpaying?

    While we're at it, before the whole "Three Amigos" thing in Miami, what history did the Heat have for being a top FA destination? Shaq went there on a trade as I recall.

    Tough to argue with the Lakers.
     
  4. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    63
    One thing is for certain. The Bulls don't have it.

    Studs don't switch teams very often. When they do, they don't choose the Bulls.

    And with all the weirdness that comes out of the front office, who can blame them?
     
  5. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    4,111
    Likes Received:
    210
    Trophy Points:
    63
    For the most part, a stud FA is going to want

    - money, which they can get by staying or leaving; and

    - a chance to win, which may require leaving where they're at.

    Beyond these two, weather, state tax, market size and proximity to where the player grew up usually top the list.

    The Bulls believe that their organization is a draw and some Bulls fans believe it is a repellant. IMO, it's probably not much of a factor one way or the other until after the FA comes here at which time you hear about the "great winning tradition" and other "happy to be here" b.s..
     
  6. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    Maybe they prefer management that treats players well.
     
  7. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    63
    If Carmelo Anthony comes to Chicago it will be to play with Derrick Rose, to be coached by Thibs and to a much lesser extent to be a in big market.

    Chris Paul wants to be coached by an elite coach, Doc Rivers.

    Lebron, Wade and Bosh all want to play with fellow elite talent.

    If Melo is going to leave NYC, Rose and Thibs are the key. Paxson and Gar Forman are not really important in this, unless they continue to screw with Thibs and Rose.

    The team USA thing is huge. Its essential for Rose and Thibs to have positive things to say about the Chicago Bulls, if a guy like Melo is going to choose to come here.

    The nonsense from the front office need to cease immediately. They need to mind their place. That is, if they are interested in building an elite squad. Otherwise, it will just happen somewhere else. But, building an elite squad isn't really the #1 priority for this front office, at least from Uncle Jerry and Paxson.
     
  8. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    63
    So, how did the Heat superteam get formed? Pat Riley (exec) and Dwayne Wade (star) were working together in lockstep to make it happen. Lots of networking and sweet talking going on during Team USA times. No nonsense getting leaked to the media in Miami. No crazy articles being written (and yes, where there is smoke, there is fire). Because Pat Riley wants to win and knows how to run a championship organization. He's been there and done that. We don't have that at the top of the Bulls. We have Paxson.

    So, when Thibs and Rose are hanging with Team USA, are they going to have good things to say about being employed by the Bulls? Keep in mind the locker room currently motivates itself by comparing their situation to the Indians in major league, Thibs is still smarting from the Ron Adams firing, Rose knows that the org will leak info to the media to turn public opinion against him.

    The team has an image problem. And, judging by Paxson's reaction to a question about it during the Deng presser, I don't think he knows / cares about it.

    But, they are the #3 team on the Forbes list and have been living off MJ/Pippen/Krause and the #1 pick falling into their lap for years. So there isn't really an incentive to change anything. Paxson likely thinks he's doing a great job.
     
  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,978
    Likes Received:
    10,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    If I had one wish for the Bulls, it would be for Mark Cuban to be the owner.
     
  10. such sweet thunder

    such sweet thunder Member Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    3,509
    Likes Received:
    78
    Trophy Points:
    48
    We can bitch about Paxson and Forman all we want but it was Reinsdorf who said he'd trade six basketball championships for one baseball championship. Reinsdorf said "basketball is a game, baseball is a religion." http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-b...eball-american-basketball-193854609--nba.html. Why on earth would anyone want to play for him?

    The Bulls save 500k letting Korver go; the White Sox announce they're looking to acquire talent for the stretch run. The Bulls ship Deng; the White Sox all the sudden enter the bidding for Masahiro Tanaka.
     
  11. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    63
    My two cents on this age old Bulls debate.

    Its pretty clear that Bulls ownership isn't going to spend willy nilly. They are going to spend between the salary cap limit and the lux tax limit. For the first time last season they paid some tax, but that was more of a mistake than anything, and they didn't pay a lot of it, and they made sure to pay it for only one year. So its clear that the lux tax limit is a big deal for the Bulls still. Uncle Jerry said he'd pay for a winner, whatever that means. Luol Deng isn't here because of the lux tax, but the Bulls were not winning the title this year without Rose, so take that for what it is.

    An Uncle Jerry ownership group team won 6 NBA Championships. An Uncle Jerry ownership group won a World Series in Chicago (that's a really big deal). So, my contention is that an Uncle Jerry ownership group isn't a limiting factor on a championship. The money that the Bulls budget should be enough to win if well spent.

    Its not just penny pinching that's the problem. For the Bulls, its a corporate culture thing. Uncle Jerry is pretty hands off on this front, except for the big issues. He lets his management pretty much run the show on this front. So, why is the Bulls culture so weird? Why is it that other great teams run pretty smooth, but ours is filled with so much needless drama? Why do our coaches either get physically attacked by management or, in the case of our elite, top 3 in NBA, Team USA level coach have their top assistants fired from underneath them in brazen power play moves? Why does injury information about MVP level players get leaked to the press in an attempt to smear the player publicly?

    Why don't you hear about this level of weirdness with the White Sox, who have the same guy at the head of the ownership group?

    The main issue is that if you are in management under Uncle Jerry, you pretty much have a job for life, if he likes you. And if you mismanage money and make poor decisions, you won't get fired from a general manager position. In recent history, you'll get kicked upstairs to a cushy position where you don't face scrutiny anymore and can pretty much cash fat checks and dictate policy / culture. See John Paxson / Kenny Williams.

    I fear the reputation for the Bulls org around is the league is kind of a joke in many ways, or at least considered strange. Can't argue with the dollars and cents though.

    The rep for Thibs is sky high.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2014
  12. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    2,086
    Likes Received:
    144
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Also keep in mind that the Tanaka thing is a classic move that we've seen used with the Bulls, IMO.

    Remember Team Paxson flying out to LA to talk to Kobe a few years back?
     

Share This Page