This isn't an argument about whether the Israelis are right or the Palestinians are right, this is about why the United States keeps supporting Israel regardless of what they do. We support Israel financially with billions of dollars; we support them by giving them the latest artillery, tanks, and jets, and probably many more things. What do we have with Israel that is so special. We are allies with many other countries, but you don't see the United States shelling out Billions of dollars for them. Do we have some kind of special interests with Israel? Are we pursuing some special agenda? What is going on, and why is this going on? The United States' decision to allow Israel to do anything it pleases is 90% of why the middle east (and probably many other countries) hate the United States. If we were not so stuck to Israel, I think our problems with the world would almost be gone. (With the exception of North Korea)I'll leave my comments till later.
the US supports Israel so much because there is so many Jewish people in the Northeast, and so many of them have a lot of vested interest in our economy.
I've heard a theory that the US shells out tons of money to countries like Israel and India so that if we were to get in a war other nations would have bigger fish to fry, so to speak.
What do you have against Israel? First Hitler trys to kill them all (he tried to give them all away to other countries, and no one wanted them) and now middle eastern countries are starting to become more and more intent on blowing Israel off the face of the earth. Their countries use propaganda and other means of making all their people believe Israel is the enemy. They teach their children from birth that Israel is lower than dirt. Muslim extremists are trying to wipe Israelis off the face of the earth and all claiming it is what their religon wants.Now, with everyone trying to destory Israel, what is wrong with just at least one country standing up to everyone else and giving Israel a helping hand, if it wasn't for the USA, Israel most likely still wouldn't be here today. I am glad our country is helping Israel survive.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (drake24 @ Nov 19 2006, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What do you have against Israel? First Hitler trys to kill them all (he tried to give them all away to other countries, and no one wanted them) and now middle eastern countries are starting to become more and more intent on blowing Israel off the face of the earth. Their countries use propaganda and other means of making all their people believe Israel is the enemy. They teach their children from birth that Israel is lower than dirt. Muslim extremists are trying to wipe Israelis off the face of the earth and all claiming it is what their religon wants.Now, with everyone trying to destory Israel, what is wrong with just at least one country standing up to everyone else and giving Israel a helping hand, if it wasn't for the USA, Israel most likely still wouldn't be here today. I am glad our country is helping Israel survive.</div>*co-signs* but also take into account that Iran etc. are fed lies and are brainwashed to thinking that Jews are pigs and don't deserve to live (think like Cartman but worse)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Israeli official calls for killing Hamas leadersNovember 19, 2006BY JOSEF FEDERMANASSOCIATED PRESSJERUSALEM -- Israel's deputy prime minister said Saturday that Israel should assassinate Hamas' leadership, ignore the moderate Palestinian president and <u>walk away from international peace efforts.</u>They were the latest in a string of hard-line positions voiced by the newest cabinet member, Avigdor Lieberman.The comments came as the rival Palestinian factions, Hamas and Fatah, continued talks on forming a unity government. Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas of Fatah has said he hopes the coalition deal will enable him to revive peace efforts with Israel.Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert brought Lieberman into the government last month to shore up a shaky coalition government.But since becoming minister of strategic affairs, Lieberman's statements have raised fears that peace efforts will be frozen. Olmert has tried to distance himself from Lieberman, saying he remains committed to the U.S.-backed road map peace plan, which envisions an independent Palestinian nation alongside Israel.Speaking to Israel Radio, Lieberman said he believes Palestinians are not interested in setting up their own nation, but in destroying Israel. He dismissed Abbas as an ineffective leader and said Israel must get tougher with the Hamas and Islamic Jihad. "They ... have to disappear, to go to paradise, all of them," he said.Israel has killed a series of Hamas leaders in targeted missile strikes in recent years, including the group's founder, but has not targeted members of the Hamas-led government elected 10 months ago.The leader of the Hamas bloc in the Palestinian parliament, Mushir al-Masri, said any attack on the group's leaders would trigger retaliation.</div>Yeah, that sounds peaceful to me. I wasn't brainwashed into hating Israel, anyone can see with their two eyes that Israel is being too agressive in their offensive. They are hypocritical to their own standards and when they say they give the gaza strip to palestinians they just go back and bomb the sh*t out of it. Now this idiot who was appointed to office wants to kill everyone and blatantly is saying it - if that's not enough he also says that he is walking away from peace efforts. On the other hand the moderate Palestinian President Abbas is trying to keep peace talks flowing...now who is on the wrong side? Not to mention the US vetoed a UN motion that regarded Israeli attacks as too agressive - just last week like 20 people were killed in a city called Bait Hanoun....all civilians and not one of them from hamas. Don't give me that BS that arab countries give out propaganda to make everyone hate israel - that simply doesn't happen because my whole family lives in the middle east, and I have been there many many times - that stuff you are saying simply does not happen. We are not the ones being brainwashed, it's the people like you who really have no idea what really goes on. :ranting:EDIT: Oh Yeah, and what kinda f*cking "respectable" country assassinates political figures - please, what kinda bs is that. Assassination is done only by criminals - it's just know that Israel got an idiot to clearly say it for them.
I didn't say you were brainwashed or that you even hate Israel. Instead of naming each middle eastern country and muslim extremists that uses propaganda (like Iran), I just said middle eastern countries. If I offended you by that, I am sorry. Did I say Israel is peaceful? No. How can they be peaceful when they have suicide bombers walking around their streets all day. I am not saying they are the sole victims here, but I am saying that some muslim extremists are sending women and children with bombs and guns into Israel to blow them up and I do understand why Israel can be on the offensive. Countries hate and are attacking them left and right. They are just trying to survive. Am I making excuses for everything they do? No, Israel isn't always right, I am not saying that. But I am saying that I agree with helping the country out.Iran is developing nukes and everyone knows they will not hesitate to use them on Israel if given the chance. Iran is also saying one thing to the UN and civilized countries and then they are saying a total different thing to their own country.There was nothing I said wrong in my first post, besides I guess, generalizing the muslim extremists and those type of countries as "middle eastern countires." Like I said before, I didn't mean to offend you or anyone and I am sorry. But I stick to the fact of world peace, and Israel needs help or they will be blown off the face of the earth and that I do agree with.
The United States should help Israel if someone threatens Israel, but for internal affairs such as Palestinian conflict, the United States should not be giving Israel Billions of dollars in artillary...Israel is already an advanced country as it is - they do not need our help. Also, it is definetly not Israel that is being disadvantaged in this conflict, it has been the Palestinians - always. The last Israeli that died was a woman just a week ago. In response, 20 palestinians died...and none were even related to the killing of the woman. The ratio is just unfair...if anything the US should be helping the Palestinians with aid. (as in food, water, healthcare, etc) It is also unacceptable that anyone from the Israeli side to totally ignore Palestinian peace efforts set aside by President Abbas and just blatantly say that we are not going towards peace. How stupid is that?? Anyways - I agree with you that the US should stick up for Israel, but at the same time to be fair, it should also stick up for the other side as well. The United States has never helped the Palestinians...instead they just supply Israel with more rockets to kill palestinians with. How is the United States going to even side with a country that clearly does not want peace. (Israel) ?? It really puzzles me since we are in a war right now trying to promote peace. Don't you agree that the United States aid is a little too much on the military side, and it is also one sided? If they are going to help Israel, it should only be for protection...and if they help israel they should also help Palestine...it can't be one sided like that. Again, I can't ignore the fact that ISrael doesn't even want peace. Not to mention that douche bag up there in the article was mocking the religion of Islam.
I agree that it seems unfair that Palestine isn't being taken care of by the U.S. But part of the reason we aren't helping them, I assume, is that Palestine has been known to take care of terrorists. In fact, they have elected terrorists to power in their country. The terrorists are part of a group called Hamas. Hamas controls a lot of Palestine and is in fact a terrorist organization. They don't want peace with Israel, they want Israel off the map and in place they want Palestine. With Hamas, there is no peace. Hamas also doesn't like the USA and is funded by Iran and is, I bet, the reason we don't fund Palestine, in fear of helping Hamas.
Dude the Hamas leader in the government offered to stop down like a week ago in return for more peace talks and relief for his people (palestinians) - and it was rejected!EDIT: Also, you just said that the reason the US isn't helping palestine is because they don't want peace...well how can you say that when Israel itself also does not want peace. If a country clearly says that we want to "assassinate" political leaders, to me, it is considered a criminal and terrorist state.
One goal of Hamas is to destroy Israel, since they have even openingly said that, why should anyone believe they want peace? I mean, it sounds good, but history tells tales of terrorist and other evil organizations have said one thing, and then turned on what they said. Like when Hitler was given some land so that he wouldn't attack and take more of it, and he signed the papers saying that. Then he went ahead and attacked and took the rest of the land anways.What I am saying is, just because the Hamas said it, doesn't mean he ment it, why should the US believe him?EDIT: To your edit, I didn't say Palestine didn't want peace, I said Hamas didn't want peace, or at least that is what I ment. The US has labled Hamas as a terrorist organization, so I just going by what they say.
And so you're saying you're just going to blindly accept how the US labels countries or entities? The US isn't always right...and you gotta investigate for your own better understanding. How can you say that Israel isn't a terrorist state when the ratio for Israeli's killed and Palestinians killed is so wide that it's almost like a massacre or genocide type things. How can you say that Israel isn't a terrorist state when their own leaders say they want to "assassinate" political leaders? Just please answer that - don't go off how the US labels Israel - that is biased, go off of the facts and tell me how you can not consider what Israel as being of terroristic actions. Israel can protect itself as much as they want, but when it reaches to the point of killing more innocent people than actual terrorists than it's just wrong and terroristic. You really haven't seen anything that Israel does...just do your research about this please. But first answer the question.
It isn't just the US that has labled Hamas a terrorist organization. The group is funded by Iran (which is just about enough right there) and is also labled a terrorist organization by Canada, European Union, Israel, Australia, and the United Kingdom. It has also been banned in Jordan. I can not travel the world and talk to leaders myself, so I have to go off what governments give me, and that is enough right there. Now keep in mind, I am not saying Palestine is a terrorist country, I am saying Hamas is a terrorist organization.About me labeling Israel as a terrorist country, I can't judge them by myself. I have never been to the middle east or talked to any leaders from there. So I can't say, from my own opinions, exactly what is happening, I don't know. But that is where I have to trust my country, because I don't know what is happening, so I trust democracy and democracy hasn't labled Israel as terrorism. Although assassinating politcal leaders and killing inocent people would be considered terrorism in my books (am I saying Israel did that and is a terrorist country, no, but I am saying those act, I would label as terrorist acts). But we wanted Hitler killed and the Nazis gone, so is that terrorism?
If we ever want to be free from terror it needs to start with cutting off funding and supporting Israel. We will never have peace as long as we are involved with them.The Israeli government are terrorists too.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (1331 @ Nov 20 2006, 09:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>If we ever want to be free from terror it needs to start with cutting off funding and supporting Israel. We will never have peace as long as we are involved with them.The Israeli government are terrorists too.</div> It honestly wouldn't matter if we cut funding to Israel or not. Radical terrorist organizations would still attack us for supporting Israel before, accuse us of still giving money to Israel, accuse us of supporting bad regimes in the middle east. We are stuck against them, it doesn't matter what we do the opposite. Saying 'well if we cut money to israel and took our troops out of Saudi Arabai this sh*t wouldn't happen'...it's not true.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BrewCityBuck @ Nov 20 2006, 01:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Saying 'well if we cut money to israel and took our troops out of Saudi Arabai this sh*t wouldn't happen'...it's not true.</div>It may not work, who knows? But surely you agree that what we are doing now isn't working either.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (1331 @ Nov 20 2006, 12:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>It may not work, who knows?</div>Yeah, you're probably right... the Islamic extremists could probably just disappear!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Justice @ Nov 20 2006, 03:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah, you're probably right... the Islamic extremists could probably just disappear!</div>Lol. It doesn't matter that we are helping Israel, that is just their way of "justifying" thier attacks on the US. The fact is they just don't like us. They don't like our way of life, our culture, our exceptence for Jews, our freedom, our government, they don't like anything about us. So the second we stop funding Israel, that makes Islamic extremeists think we are weak and backing down, scared of them. So I don't think cutting the funds will solve anything.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (drake24 @ Nov 20 2006, 04:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Lol. It doesn't matter that we are helping Israel, that is just their way of "justifying" thier attacks on the US. The fact is they just don't like us. They don't like our way of life, our culture, our exceptence for Jews, our freedom, our government, they don't like anything about us. So the second we stop funding Israel, that makes Islamic extremeists think we are weak and backing down, scared of them. So I don't think cutting the funds will solve anything.</div>Please. :wtf1: You are so out of touch with reality regarding what the middle east is about. You are basically taking media talk and than just spitting it on the forums. Trust me when I say this: Arabs don't hate Jews - they hate Zionist Israel. Also, extremists don't use Israel as an excuse to hate the US - it IS ONE of the reasons they don't like the US - and trust me, the middle east isn't the only place that doesn't like the US. Middle Eastern countries also don't hate Americans, they just dont like their foreign policies - as you can see, the US is acting like the world police. (Iraq is a huge example) - no one likes that, it isn't only the mid east.and PLEASE stop saying "they dont like our freedom, our way of life, our culture" bull sh*t - that isn't true - they actually love Western Culture. (at least the younger generations) - and for the older generation they def couldn't care less about American culture - they are happy with their own. Actually, in Egpyt they find that Egyptian culture is better than American culture. Many of the countries in the middle east are 100x better than what is in America. (Kuwait, Dubai, Saudi Arabia are great places to live) and if we do cut funds to israel than we won't be doing it only to stop terrorists from attacking the US - we would also be doing the right thing in general. I don't see it being right to support another terrorist country while we are going on a huge war to stop terrorists.EDIT: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Israeli offensive in Gaza City kills 2 By IBRAHIM BARZAK, Associated Press Writer Tue Nov 21, 7:44 AM ET GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - The Israeli military launched a three-pronged offensive in the northern Gaza Strip early Tuesday, killing a top Hamas commander in its latest operation against Palestinian rocket squads. - (OK - they did their job, now leave)An elderly Palestinian woman died in a gunbattle between troops and militants. (+1 to innocent Palestinian dead)Troops entered the town of Jebaliya after dawn. Bulldozers plowed over farms, ripping up irrigation systems and destroying greenhouses and fields. A main electricity transformer, which provides about 60 percent of the power to the Zeitoun neighborhood, was also destroyed. (Ok - so than you go and tear up infastructure that is vital to the survival of the people - you go and destroy family farms and irrigation systems which have been kept in the family for generations and is a source for food and income...why?)Four people, including at least one Hamas gunman, was wounded when a tank shell hit a group of fighters, witnesses said. (Ok - +3 innocent Palestinians injured) Israeli bulldozers demolished a factory between Jebaliya and Beit Lahiya in an area where rockets were launched Tuesday morning. Troops also razed land on the outskirts of Beit Lahiya and took up positions on high ground. (...why would they do this - just to add to the devastation that's already taking place?)...The violence in Gaza has been accompanied in recent months by increasing poverty brought on by international sanctions meant to force the Hamas-led government to recognize Israel and disarm. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, the separately elected head of the moderate Fatah Party, had hoped to persuade Western countries to lift the boycott by establishing a government of experts to replace the Hamas-led body. On Monday Fatah officials suddenly announced that months of negotiations had broken down, but it wasn't clear whether the suspension was the sign of a real crisis or simply a negotiating tactic by a weakened Fatah. On Tuesday, the Saudi daily Okaz reported on its front page that Abbas, who was visiting Saudi Arabia, would resign if the U.S. refused to deal with the future Palestinian government.</div>Yeah...F*ck Israel.
The point is, Middle Easterners hate America regardless of whether we fund Israel or not. Pretty sure 9/11 didn't happen because of Israel. It was pretty funny when Saddam was going on about Zionist stuff during his trial verdict. I don't know what that had to do with anything.
