Breaking News! Bulls avoid LT!

Discussion in 'Chicago Bulls' started by TomBoerwinkle#1, Jun 3, 2014.

  1. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

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    I would imagine there is a positive correlation between salary and wins in the NBA.

    A quick search came across this blog, which does a simple regression analysis for one season in the sports leagues. Only one season, but the NBA had the strongest correlation between salary - wins.

    http://blog.mathalicious.com/2014/04/27/win-at-any-cost/

    As for non-tax paying teams, I don't see one of the non-tax paying teams having won a NBA title in the tax era. In fact, LA Lakers, Boston Celtics, Miami Heat and Dallas Mavericks are some of the top tax paying teams around and have won many titles as of late. The Spurs are also a team that pays the tax when needed.

    In general, being an el cheapo team in the NBA isn't really the way to go, if winning titles is the goal. Spending money stupidly isn't the way to go either. Not being el cheapo and using the money you do spend on impact players seems to be the way to go.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2014
  2. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    If I want maximum profits, I want Pax as my team CEO. If I want to win championships, not Pax.

    Anniversary of The Shot. How many years ago was that?

    That era has passed? I don't think so. Words and actions do not match. Actions say "maximize profit."

    I do not agree with K4E that the team is "cheap." It is interested in $55M profit, and increasing that. If the team has $100M in expenses and generates $56M in profit, they'll spend the $100M. $100M is not cheap. The Chairman is risk averse. If he spends enough to pay the LT, the risk is the team loses in the first round and his profit is reduced by the extra salary and tax.

    Unfortunately, profits get in the way of Organizations Win Championships(tm). This organization wins the profit championship, and that's it.
     
  3. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

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    I don't think the Bulls are "cheap." I think ownership has a ideological opposition to paying the luxury tax. In other areas, the Bulls spends plenty of money on the organization.

    There are not many teams winning the titles with the 0 luxury tax to minimal luxury tax approach and there appears to be a positive correlation between $ spent and wins. "el cheapo" probably wasn't the best term to use. It just seems that at some point, the title winning teams are spending the tax.

    Uncle Jerry isn't going to run one of the top tax paying organizations, even if the payroll money is spent wisely. He's against it, IMO.
     
  4. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    No team wants to pay the LT because none are that stupid.

    The Bulls didn't pay the LT for the 2013-14 season because they made smart decisions and got lucky with the Deng-Bynum trade.

    The Bulls paid about $4mil in LT for the 2012-13 season. Once it was clear that Rose wasn't coming back and they would not contend for a championship, they attempted to get under the LT line by trading Richard Hamilton. They'd have been idiots if they hadn't tried to trade Hamilton under these circumstances...Hamilton had no role for the team going forward.

    Paying the LT when you can avoid it without hurting the team has always been bad and stupid. With the new collective bargaining agreement, it can actually hurt the team and is irresponsible.

    Slamming Bulls' ownership simply for not paying the LT is weak. If there's a move they made or didn't make, criticize that.

    Unless the Bulls can somehow trade Boozer, it's unlikely that the Bulls will be in LT territory for the next couple seasons. They have no stud players who are coming off the rookie scale and need to be re-signed (despite Butler being named 2nd team all-defense, he doesn't figure to break the bank). I guess some will criticize Bulls ownership for failing to pay the LT even if it's literally not possible for them to do so.
     
  5. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    If Reinsdorf feels that strongly about avoiding the LT, the team should not have signed Hamilton, Hinrich or Dunleavy and definitely should not have signed their backup PF to a 4-year $33mil extension.
     
  6. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

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    Keeping team payroll low = not paying the luxury tax. No team "wants" to pay the tax but some choose to spend more than others on team payroll, usually in an attempt to pay the talent needed to try and make a realistic run at a NBA title. Teams like the Mavericks, Heat, Spurs, Lakers and Celtics have done this in recent years and have the rings to back up their decisions. Others like the Magic, Cavs and Blazers did and came up short. And of course then you have the Knicks who are the anomaly.

    The Bulls are very smart about not paying as much as other teams on payroll. And they keep being one of the more profitable teams in the NBA, so more power to them.

    They are right there with the Bucks, Hawks, Clippers, Bobcats/Hornets, Hornets/Pelicans, Pistons, Thunder and Wizards in keeping team payroll low i.e. not paying the luxury tax. I guess these are the smart teams.
     
  7. kukoc4ever

    kukoc4ever Let's win a ring! Staff Member Moderator

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    You are correct, 1 season out of 11 the Bulls paid a small amount of luxury tax. The next season the Bulls dumped Luol Deng. We'll see this off season what comes of it, other than tax avoidance.

    The Bulls live among the bottom dwellers in the league when it comes to team payroll in the tax era.

    Uncle Jerry is highly tax averse. The NBA champions of the last decade are not, based on the numbers.
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I'm with K4E on this. Paying the LT some of the time is a cost of doing business, if business is about trying hard to win championships.

    The only time the Bulls went over the LT, they were careful to hard cap themselves to minimize the amount they paid, and took on only enough LT that they could get below by ridding themselves of Rip's contract; they didn't plan on teams wanting a draft pick in return. Paying that draft pick his rookie scale is profitable for years.
     
  9. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Good post. I'm going to fight my urge to "knee-jerk" it.

    I agree that Reinsdorf is tax averse. He thinks every owner should be and has expressed frustration with those who aren't. He thinks they threaten the long-term health of the game. His compromise is to be willing to pay the tax when he believes his team has at least a somewhat legit chance at the title. He believes that having a huge payroll for a team that sucks is unforgivable.

    I tend to agree with his POV.

    I haven't disagreed with many of the moves the team has made (or not made) in the last 10 years. That's pretty remarkable. Asik was an exception, but I think I was more ticked off at Forman for leading me to believe that the Bulls would match any reasonable offer. With hindsight, not only has Asik not taken the league by storm, but with Rose's injuries, not paying Asik big money looks pretty smart.

    For years, critics of the Bulls claimed that Reinsdorf would never pay the tax. Then he paid the tax and the critics didn't miss a beat...he's only paid it once. I believe in principles so this sort of shit doesn't sit well with me. IMO, the LT card should have at least have been put on the shelf for a couple seasons.
     
  10. Charcoal Filtered

    Charcoal Filtered Writing Team

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    I heard it somewhere recently that some owners do not want to win a championship because they cost too much money. Reinsdorf has already won six championships. What do you think #7 is worth to him?

    Miami also made some cost cutting moves this season. Did not get under the tax, but it will save the team lots of money. How much do you think it is worth to Arisen to win yet another ring?
     
  11. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Three times better than a 1st round exit since 1997-98. I'm not sure that's a record to suggest they made all the right moves all along.

    The fans want to win championships. So do the players.

    These guys aren't the enemy:

    [​IMG]
     
  12. TomBoerwinkle#1

    TomBoerwinkle#1 Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    There is no "enemy." However those beloved people were making some huge demands to keep together a crew that was IMO about at the end of their run. What happened after was clearly a fustercluck but MJ Pip and PJax did play a role in that.
     
  13. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Management made them their enemy.
     
  14. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    It was like 15 years ago. Get over it, people.
     
  15. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    That's silly.

    Organizations win championships. That's been the philosophy they've tried to sell us for ... 15 years. Coincidentally.
     
  16. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Sorry. I hate being considered silly.

    OK, don't get over it. No sense having a grudge if you can't hold on to it for a good long time I guess. Enjoy.
     
  17. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    How about they prove me wrong. They're proving me right over and over. I'd rather be wrong and see us win. I don't want to be satisfied with anything less than championships.
     
  18. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    A championship would be nice. Put me down as in favor of that.
     
  19. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Organizations don't win championships. Jordan, Pippen, and PJax win championships.

    The 15 year old problem is that Boozer is the best FA we're going to be able to sign because players would rather go to a team that's committed to winning championships. Even if it's a team that has never done it before.

    15 years ago, TMac wouldn't come here. 3 years ago, only Boozer would. I'm not talking about guys who are happy to make MLE kind of money.
     
  20. transplant

    transplant Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    The Bulls organization is highly regarded by virtually everyone. You like to embrace rumors when it suits your argument. Well, rumor has it that both Anthony and Love count the Bulls as a team in which they have interest. Feel free to dismiss these rumors.
     

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