Cops killed man at Walmart, then interrogated girlfriend

I do question if it is policy to just shoot a guy that isn't pointing a weapon at someone. I couldn't find a link last time I looked but 5 years ago or so a Metro cop shot a handcuffed murder suspect and killed him as he ran from the cops. I though the cop was fucked, but in Nevada it was a legal shoot.

 

What changes? I don't know what some of these men and children could have done differently other than not leave the house that day... Don't pick up anything resembling a gun if you are black? What about when cell phones are mistaken for guns? Don't use a cell phone if you are black?

The only changes that need to happen are for the human race to love each other instead of fighting each other. There's no need to worry about somebody with a gun shooting you if we choose not to shoot people with guns.

 

Talk about living in the dark, no pun intended.

 

???

 

If I asked you if it was going to rain later on in the evening I bet you would do 1 of 2 things. Either look at a weather report and repeat what you read, or look to the sky and make your own assumptions. Say it is raining at the time the question is asked. You would likely cite current conditions towards your reasoning of why it is likely to continue, or stop.

The fact of the matter is you cannot look at a cloud and assume it is going to rain, nor is a clear sky reason to believe it won't, but we are so used to rain accompanying clouds that it is easy to assume a gray sky is an indication of impending rainfall.

Now this is where I would partially agree with what Marazul said. However the black community is in no way solely responsible for the gun violence in this country, there are no changes that need to be made singularly in the black community.

 

Put down the crack pipe Dr. Phil.

Your own ridiculous example doesn't even mean what you think it means.

1. If you asked me if it was going to rain later I'd tell you to check your phone.
2. If you look at a huge dark cloud, there will be rain. When or where doesn't matter, it will rain eventually.

3. If young black males continue to look talk act gangster, there will be robbing and killing. They repeat that shit like parrots. It is and should be just as embarrassing for the so called black community as redneck trailer park meth freaks embarrass me.

That dude in Walmart may not have given a second thought to what he was doing. The asshole cop didn't either. He got a call and snuck in and wasted that dude.

I can't say if the cop wouldn't have shot me like that, hell it seems most of the crazed gunman types are white so you'd think he'd be more likely to shoot me.

MarAzul is right. I've always thought it seemed fucked up that our military wastes innocent people with Drones to get one or two targets. Well, it seems that those type of procedures are coming to our home towns.

 

And back to square one. It was worth a try but I can see you are too deeply ingrained in the thought process of #3. Part of me still believes you genuinely aren't as Xenophobic as you come across, but it is hard to tell being as this is just a message board composed of electronic text.

I can't even tell which standpoint you are taking anymore. You've gone from hating police officers to claiming they wouldn't be doing this if it weren't for the way the black community acts as a whole...Then I realized I am arguing with the person who wished physical violence on somebody because of advertisements on a web page. Like trying to hold a verbal conversation with a mime, I'm a fool to have been roped in to such an obvious losing battle.

 

We have at least three diffenent situations being discussed currently.

! Ferguson
2. Staten Is New York
3 The kid in Cleveland and the Guy in Walmart.

Different from each other. The Ferguson case was no fault of the police officer, the fault was with both the Kid (Brown) and police procedure.

The New York Staten Is incident is sort of strange. It appears the police were found to be following proper procedure but it was clearly the wrong procedure. So why the hell is the Mayor of the City howling about race?? Hell the man is the boss and the precise guy that should begin to change the procedure! Instead, he is hamming it up with Al Sharpton.

The other two are not so clear to me. Is that police procedure to blow away a guy with a gun (air or not) so quickly after issuing a command? Hell I am not so sure the dead guys ever heard the command or understood it. If that is proper proceedure then it has to change right now. Else the cop should be charged.

Then there is the thing were Black people (some) view the role of police differently than the other races. Long term that has to change but until it does, the police need to adjust their procedure to account for the difference. They really do need to minimize the possibility of giving guys like Brown the opportunity to try and intimidate a cop. Again by proper procedure.

Most won't like to hear that you need to police the Black community differently but I do think the cultural difference do dictate that reality.

 

I understand hyperbole and use it. You are unable to read anything and not take it literally. It isn't a personal attack to urge someone to seek counseling ( I don't think)

 

To clarify so as not to confuse people. I do NOT hate police. They have a hard job and like any profession there are bad police.

I do NOT blame black people for being shot for no reason.


However, there needs to be a serious discussion about both issues.

Saying that what people feel or think about either issue affects it is moronic if you are unable to look at the issue logically and fairly. I mean that ignoring hood rat mentality as a reason or even as a result of this. Like the chicken or the egg question. Who gives a shit which one was first? Just fix it now.

 

Yeah brb I'm gonna take lessons on logic and fairness from someone who uses the word retardation as an insult. You've already finished your painting bodyman, put the brush down.

 

Oh no! Some dirt bag has executed a couple NYP cops in pay back. Geez, this is going to end up as very bad news for a lot of people!
Nothing good will happen now.

I think Obama and Mayor De Blasio can take the credit. On an assist by Al Sharpton.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...=Qh3lGtMsTnDdponCPltLVA&bvm=bv.82001339,d.aWw

 

I seriously just give up, we are so fucked as a nation now and you can thank the über opinionated media outlets that we get our "news" from.

Cops aren't racists but a lot of them are under qualified to do the work (you can thank the cities for hiring these people) . It's simple as that.

 

I said retreadation, old joke about an insult edited by sly. You make Kingspeed look like Chuck Norris.

 

PS, I'd shove the brush straight up your ass and pull it out sideways.

That is how cops threaten black guys to get them to confess, not something I'd literally do.

 

The bad apples have it seems literally gotten someone to slaughter cops sitting in their cars. Good shit, makes me wanna do the speed limit exactly.

I feel terrible for the cops wives and husbands and children. Sleepless nights are coming.

 

Well said, but I want to add to this, if I may.

First, real quick: I was an Explorer Scout with the VPD from 1997-2004. Also did 10 years of Private Security work, both Armed and Unarmed, in both Washington and Oregon. I'm NOT saying this in any form of bragging (after all: being a Security Officer is hardly anything to brag about). But rather, just a statement of perspective: I understand, probably better than anyone else here, the mindset of most police officers. Never been one, but I understand.

That being said, I think that the claim of them being under-qualified is not entirely correct. Oh sure, I am quite certain that there are departments out there who's training could be better. But for the most part, I believe the problem is this: that the media and Hollywood has portrayed Cops to the average citizens of them being these magical superheros, who can read minds, see who's lying and who's not, see if Jamal just murdered 3 people or if he just dropped his grandmother off at the nursing home, or be able to shoot a person in the leg or shoot the gun out of a person's hand.

That is FANTASY. And utter bullshit. They are NOT the superheros that they have been portrayed as all these years. There is NO "shoot the suspect in the leg", or "shoot the gun out of the person's hand." It simply doesn't exist. And I'm telling you strait up: whoever believes, seriously, that such procedures should be in place needs to get their fucking heads examined, because it is completely and utterly unrealistic.

Take, for example, this "boy" in Cleveland (who, by the way, nobody could tell he was a boy and not a full-grown adult), who was waving a gun around and pointing it at people. Now, whether or not the gun was "fake" (which it wasn't), is irrelevant. It was a GUN. It was capable of firing a projectile. What the fuck does it matter if it fires a .45 ACP or a BB-pellet? You wanna be shot by either one? You wanna wait around and find out? Or how about you ask him: "hey, is that a .45, or is that a BB gun?"

And what if he's lying? What if he's trying to be a smart ass (what 12 year old wasn't?) and bluff the "Pigs" whom he thinks are bothering him? What if it's a perfectly harmless plastic toy that he painted black to make it look real, but he's going to try and scare the police into believing that it's real. You think it doesn't/won't happen? How much stupid shit did you do when you were 12?

What if they get to talking to him, and go to place cuffs on his to secure him for his safety and the officer's safety until the incident is either dismissed or he is transferred to JV, and he suddenly panics and makes a run for it. In the process, he reaches for the gun to either dump it, secure it in his waistband so it doesn't fall out. Do you think, to a normal Cop, that this doesn't look like he's going for a gun? How are they suppose to know whether or not he's going to shoot at them with a gun (pellet or otherwise), or whether or not he's just being stupid/scared?

And all of this is just a FRACTION of what goes through a Cop's mind when such a situation occurs.

And how about this: if they have to draw and fire, is there any bystanders behind the suspect who are potentially in the line of fire? "oops, the bullets are flying from Joe Criminal's gun; guess I better wait for those bystanders to move....." Bullshit; they're not going to wait. They're going to fire back. And that's merely ONE scenario of thousands that an officer faces every day.

Jesus, talk about stressful!

These policies and procedures are in place for a reason! The training that police go through is there for a reason.

I've studied firearms and ammunition, as well as Use of Force/Use of Force Continuum issues for years. I've read dozens of books on the topic, hundreds of magazine articles, hundreds of pages of training manuals, countless hours in training classes, countless books on guns, dozens of books by experts such as Massad Ayoob (look him up), and I've been to countless gun shows and handled hundreds of firearms in my life. I carry daily in the State of Washington.

I'm telling you, right now, if someone whom I'm suspicious of points a gun at me, the last thing on my mind is whether or not that gun is fake. Even further from my mind is what color they are. There is a THREAT to my safety, and the Law Enforcement community knows this as well, and they've trained and molded their training and procedures over the years accordingly. This is the result. They are NOT gun experts. I probably know more about guns than the average police officer, and I'm a civilian. I don't give a shit if it's a bb-gun or a 9mm....it's a GUN.

So how are we, as a society, suppose to tell them "hey, sorry you guys have these procedures and training in place to have to react like this. The world's not so fucked up after all; why don't you guys tone it down a bit?"

Wanna know what happens if we tell them to relax? Look at the two dead cops in New York, who DID NOT have situational awareness of what was going on around them; who got LAX in their training.

Society is getting WORSE. The police are going to continue to modify their procedures and actions to accommodate these dangerous times. The #1 rule of working the street as a Cop: "YOUR (the cop's) safety comes FIRST." Period. Fuck, that's WHY they wear a GUN on their belts! They don't put it on hoping to shoot people, and you are FUCKED UP if you honestly believe that.

So all of this "I hate pigs" bullshit is just that: frustration and bullshit; ranting about shit you know NOTHING about. And knowing your Brother's ex girlfriend's nephew who's a cop 600 miles away in a county with 2 people in it doesn't make you an expert. Nor is visiting the police station on a field trip when you were in the 4th grade; that doesn't count either.

If you think you can do a better job, then go through a year's worth of training (academy and FTO supervision), put on the uniform, put on the duty belt, put on the badge, and go out there and prove it. Otherwise, you're just a bitch keyboard warrior full of hot air.

Ultimately, I see I'm the minority here when it comes to defending the police, so I'm not expecting many favorable or reasonable responses. But I hope that gives you guys some perspective; if even just a glimpse.

 

This fantasy seems to have come from you, since no one has asked or wondered why police can't read minds or shoot pistols out of people hands.

People are mad because officers run into stores and blow away people before they even know what's going on. They choke people unconscious because they might be selling loose cigarettes. Because they enter a dark hallway and get spooked into instantly killing someone at the bottom of the stairs. Because they pull up and take all of 2 seconds to drop a kid that had a toy gun in his waistband.

That's a lot of what ifs and what could haves. 2 seconds is the amount of time it took for a car to come to a stop, an officer to jump out of his car, and kill a 12 year old. What's a kid gonna do in 2 seconds? What order does he follow to save his own life? He looked up and was dead.

Yes, we know. Here's how we know. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Empire_State_Building_shooting -

The problem is they don't wait. Even in a street full of people. They'll take out a shooter and anyone near him, no hesitation.

Violent crime has dropped steadily since the early 90s. That perceived constant and never ending danger is part of the problem. Yes they do need to relax, yes they do need to tone it down. Those two officers didn't die because they allowed themselves to go outside the bounds of constant paranoia. They're dead because some POS targeted them for what they were.

Using your favorite word, blaming those cops for being lazy in their training, is bullshit.

Working security, reading magazines and toting a pistol doesn't either.

A nice summation of your post.

...Sorry for this being my first post. I've lurked since the migration from BBF but, ugh, couldn't help myself.

...Merry Christmas.