I always thought the HOF was a place to showcase the best in the sport... not necessarily the nicest (See Ty Cobb), but the best... Rose was the best IMO as far as hits go...
Ineligible to play or for HOF? to play, I agree... But to have a plaque... I do not agree that he should be permanently banned... Steroids enhance your performance... that should eliminate one from records, but... I don't know... I like the idea of a plaque with a qualifying statement...
I like the idea of a 10,000 square foot outhouse 100 yards behind the HOF; for/with those Juicers....... Where a plaque goes on the wall, an outdoor toilet seat will be right below it........~!
...but that's just it, Baseball and the HOF are 2 completely separate entities ruled by themselves separately. And the HOF is strictly done by voting and the voters have spoken, not just about Rose but the PED users as well. ...but for me, the main differences are that Baseball is a business and a sport that I follow...while the HOF, IMO, is "hallowed ground" and should not be desecrated by by someone who not only broke a near 100 year old Baseball Commandment, but also continues to lie about it 30 years after the fact. ...fwiw, I do think Rose will eventually get in, but only posthumously.
Exactly "hallowed ground", that's why none of the Juicers belong in, and the most of an exception I'd make If I had a voice, would indeed be an Outhouse way out behind the HOF, call it the hall of shame.........!
I too think it'll be posthumously, and think Jackson should be in before Rose... So that rule you listed in post 19 is a MLB rule, not a HOF rule... I respect that and agree with it... the HOF voting has other issues that need corrections too... I'm thinking that someone who leads or led a certain number of categories (to be determined) is automatically entered baring the 'roid use Look at the records he holds/held... Hell, he has more singles than all but 13 people had in their careers... Major League records: Most career hits – 4,256 Most career outs – 10,328 Most career games played – 3,562 Most career at bats – 14,053 Most career singles – 3,215 Most career runs by a switch hitter – 2,165 Most career doubles by a switch hitter – 746 Most career walks by a switch hitter – 1,566 Most career total bases by a switch hitter – 5,752 Most seasons of 200 or more hits – 10 (shared) (Ichiro Suzuki) who IMO is better as he did it 10 consecutive years. Most consecutive seasons of 100 or more hits – 23 Most consecutive seasons with 600 or more at bats – 13 (1968–1980) Most seasons with 600 at bats – 17 Most seasons with 150 or more games played – 17 Most seasons with 100 or more games played – 23 Record for playing in the most winning games – 1,972 Only player in major league history to play more than 500 games at five different positions – 1B (939), LF (671), 3B (634), 2B (628), RF (595) National League records: Most years played – 24 Most consecutive years played – 24 Most career runs – 2,165 Most career doubles – 746 Most career games with 5 or more hits – 10 Modern (post-1900) NL record for longest consecutive-game hitting streak NL – 44 Modern record for most consecutive hitting streaks of 20 or more games – 7 How do those stats not be entered in the HOF? I'm not saying he should be a role model or that he is a class act, but his stats say he should be in... and being that it's stats that decide if someone is in or not, he should be in but banned from anything to do with the game and legally held to be unable to profit from the HOF status.
...I'll never sign on for Rose in the HOF...no way. IMO, if we were to overlook his transgressions and allow him into the HOF, it would be akin to saying "It's OK to bet on Baseball, as long as you set a few records". ...but I definitely agree about Ichiro...he's one of the top 10 best players I've ever seen play. ...also agree about Joe Jackson...there is absolutely NO evidence that he helped throw the WS, or that he ever received any money.
I don't know... I still think he should be in but is ineligible to reap any benefits, but his stats belong in there
...I understand you position, but to me, the HOF is a "benefit". ...and after this latest news, I'd be surprised if the people at Cooperstown want anything to do with Rose.
...most of his numbers were more of a bi-product of longevity than anything else and his last several years were just hanging on long enough to pass Cobb...he played for 23 years, most games played, most ABs, most PAs too, so that in itself will garner someone a lot of hits. Lifetime BA of .303...good but not otherworldly. ...don't get me wrong, his numbers are impressive, but he simply did something galactically stupid...and now he's paying for it, and IMO, he should be, as long as he's alive.
Nor I... and I'm ok with that... I think he should be in... would like him in sooner, but don't see it til after his death
And while we wait lets get shoeless Joe in there because as Ron mentioned, there was never any real proof that he was involved in the scandal.
IF, MLB ever decides to allow Japanese league records/stats integrated with MLB stats, (which I don't see ever happening, and I'm not even sure its a good idea to do so, as Japanese Lg BB is quit a different beast in japan, than in the USA), If so, Ichiro would have 4164 hits........ 15 more hits required by Ichiro to tie Tyrus Cobb....... 82 more hits to tie Rose ..... If I have my math right..........?
Unfortunately its called MLB baseball records. Speaking of which I remember that asshole Schilling during this past Sunday nights game (in an attempt to put down Japanese baseball) saying..."if we're going to count what Ichiro did in the Japanese league then we ought to be able to count what major league players did in the minor leagues also". Just another reason to hate that prick.
