Julius Erving is undoubtedly one of the elite players in NBA history, overshadowed by the rivalry between Magic Johnson and Larry Bird. Where does he rank among the other greats of All-Time?I'd put him 10th, behind:MJKareemWiltBirdMagicRussellOscarHakeemShaqThose 9 are in no order, by the way.
DR J is terribly overrated by you guys. Here are the players I would rank above him:Kobe BryantShaquille O'NealMichael JordanMagic JohnsonLarry BirdDavid RobinsonKarl MaloneJohn StocktonWalt FrazierKareem Abdul-JabbarCharles BarkleyElgin BaylorDominique WilkinsWilt ChamberlainMoses MaloneClyde DrexlerScottie PippenWes UnseldIsiah ThomasBill RussellHe doesn't crack my top 20.
I don't know enough about Erving to say if he's overrated or not but I can definitely say this: that move where he went from one side of the basket to the other in the Finals is by far the most overrated, overhyped move in NBA history. It wasn't even that spectacular for its time period. It was a nice little up and under. People call it the greatest move in history.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>DR J is terribly overrated by you guys. Here are the players I would rank above him:</div>
Are you guys ranking him including his ABA days, or soley on his NBA career?If you include his ABA days, he'd have to be at the maximum 10th all-time
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BALLAHOLLIC? @ Dec 21 2006, 06:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>DR J is terribly overrated by you guys. Here are the players I would rank above him:Kobe BryantShaquille O'NealMichael JordanMagic JohnsonLarry BirdDavid RobinsonKarl MaloneJohn StocktonWalt FrazierKareem Abdul-JabbarCharles BarkleyElgin BaylorDominique WilkinsWilt ChamberlainMoses MaloneClyde DrexlerScottie PippenWes UnseldIsiah ThomasBill RussellHe doesn't crack my top 20.</div>Finally somebody who sees the truth about Dr. JHe was an innovator but not as great as he is made out to beHe was like pistol pete maravich, a guy who added a lot to the game but wasn't an MVP calibre playerHe was flashy, but he definately doesn't crack my top 20 eitherWe never saw him in his prime in the ABA so we'll never know, but from what I've seen of him he would've been about a 20 ppg scorer these days (before you jump all over me for that assertion, research, he was a 22 ppg scorer for his NBA career)His NBA career was similar to that of Bernard King (who by contrast is one of the most underrated players of all time)
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lakaboy42 @ Dec 21 2006, 09:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't know enough about Erving to say if he's overrated or not but I can definitely say this: that move where he went from one side of the basket to the other in the Finals is by far the most overrated, overhyped move in NBA history. It wasn't even that spectacular for its time period. It was a nice little up and under. People call it the greatest move in history.</div>I don't think the most common video of that play captures it's difficultyI will say this: Magic Johnson has seen more basketball than you, I or anyone in these forums, and he was VERY impressed by the play
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tHe_pEsTiLeNcE @ Dec 25 2006, 11:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Finally somebody who sees the truth about Dr. JHe was an innovator but not as great as he is made out to beHe was like pistol pete maravich, a guy who added a lot to the game but wasn't an MVP calibre playerHe was flashy, but he definately doesn't crack my top 20 eitherWe never saw him in his prime in the ABA so we'll never know, but from what I've seen of him he would've been about a 20 ppg scorer these days (before you jump all over me for that assertion, research, he was a 22 ppg scorer for his NBA career)His NBA career was similar to that of Bernard King (who by contrast is one of the most underrated players of all time)</div>funny that you say Erving was not an MVP caliber player when he won 1 NBA MVP and 3 ABA MVPs...If anything, Dr. J is underrated because he played his most individually dominant ball in obscurityDr. J's 3 years with the New York Nets (1973-74 through 1975-76) were as dominant a stretch of basketball played by any player in pro basketball history no matter WHAT measure you use (stats, team winning, clutch play, respect from critics, etc.)I know you people will argue that the ABA was an inferior league, but it was anything but that. Just check out how many former ABAers went on to be NBA All Stars. At the time of the merger, the ABA was at the same level of the NBA, maybe even better.when Doc joined the 76ers in 1976-77, he noticed that the 76ers had other all-star caliber players (George McGinnis, Doug Collins, World B. Free), as well as other players who demanded the ball (Henry Bibby, Steve Mix, Joe Bryant, Darryl Dawkins). So he sacrificed his stats to try to be a good teammate, averaging in the low 20s. He could still carry the team when they need him though.The 76ers had bad chemistry, so they traded away some of their headcases in the late 70s, and Doc started shouldering more of the scoring load, averaging 27 ppg in the 1980 season, and winning the MVP in 1981. During this time, the 76ers made it to the NBA finals twice (in 1980 and 1982) losing to a more talented Laker team each time, and in 1981 lost the ECF to the Celtics by the narrowest of margins.You can't judge a player by stats, especially in the older days. For example, everyone agree the 80s best players were Magic Johnson and Larry Bird, but their scoring totals paled in comparison to others like Adrian Dantley, Alex English, George Gervin, Dominique Wilkins. Does that mean that the latter players were better?While other players were padding their stats, Dr. J did what his team needed in order to win, making plays when they mattered the most. In his first 7 seasons with the 76ers, they made the conference finals 6 times, the NBA Finals 4 times, and won one championship. During this stretch, Dr. J was on the All-NBA first team 5 times, and won an MVP award. That puts him above all of the players with good stats who weren't franchise players on his level.If Dr. J played his entire career under the same spotlight as Larry Bird, he'd be considered better than Bird.
I don't know about tenth...I would probably put him around the 15th spot. I would put Isiah, Tim Duncan, David Robinson, Karl Malone, and Moses Malone over him.BALLAHOLLIC, I think you are going over the top...
Wow, I look throughout this thread and nobody has Oscar Robertson in their top players lists...pathetic.
Dr. J had his prime years in the ABA...if you count his ABA days, he was a top 15 player.Yeah Oscar is defiently up there....averaged a danm triple double. Hes probably the most underrated player..ever.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CB4AllStar @ Feb 12 2007, 09:04 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't know about tenth...I would probably put him around the 15th spot. I would put Isiah, Tim Duncan, David Robinson, Karl Malone, and Moses Malone over him.BALLAHOLLIC, I think you are going over the top...</div>I can see Tim Duncan and maybe Moses Malone...but what the hell did David Robinson accomplish? Isiah was great, but his peak doesn't come close to Erving's....I won't start on Karl MaloneErving = Top 10 of all time
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>but what the hell did David Robinson accomplish?</div>- Completed the 2nd greatest team turnaround in NBA history as a rookie. He led the Spurs from a 21-51 record the year before he arrived to a 56-26 record as a rookie.- Scored 71 points in an NBA game.- 8 time all defensive team.- NBA's MVP (1995)- One of 4 people to accomplish a quadruple double.- In his 13 NBA seasons, he has never missed the playoffs or had a losing record.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BALLAHOLLIC? @ Feb 12 2007, 09:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>- Completed the 2nd greatest team turnaround in NBA history as a rookie. He led the Spurs from a 21-51 record the year before he arrived to a 56-26 record as a rookie.- Scored 71 points in an NBA game.- 8 time all defensive team.- NBA's MVP (1995)- One of 4 people to accomplish a quadruple double.- In his 13 NBA seasons, he has never missed the playoffs or had a losing record.</div>That's really not much compared to 3 ABA MVPs, 1 NBA MVP, 2 ABA Championships, 1 NBA Championship (as the co-best player, not as a washed-up role player), 7 NBA Conference finals appearances, 4 NBA Finals appearances...that's not even mentioning that the Doctor was one of the best clutch performers of his generation, while Robinson was known to choke in big games and wasn't a difference-maker in the playoffsDavid Robinson doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Julius Erving
I'd say top 15 including his ABA days. As previously stated, he was an absolute freak in the ABA and dominated everyone. he averaged 29/12/5 on 50% shooting in ABA, and was even more dominant in playoffs. In NBA he was also great, putting up around 25PPG or mroe each season, and around 6-8RPG and 4-5APG. He won MVP's and championships in his career and was an elite player for a long time.In other words, he deserves to be top 15 all time.
the doc definitely in my book deserves to be around top 12-10 players of all time. he could take over games as well as play well with his team
The Doctor had arguably the greatest performance in a championship series ever:In the 1976 ABA finals, Erving averaged 37.7 ppg, 14.2 rpg, 6.0 apg, 3.0 spg, and 2.2 bpg leading both the Nets and the Nuggets in all five categories.He did all this while being guarded mostly by Bobby Jones, widely considered to be the best defensive forward in pro basketball for much of his career (Larry Brown called him "the best defensive player on the planet")The Nuggets had a very strong team, with Jones, future HOFers David Thompson and Dan Issel, and other solid players, and coached by HOFer Larry BrownIn the series, Dr. J hit a buzzer beater, and also had a 25-point 4th quarterDavid Thompson said that if one man ever beat a team by himself, this was itand that's just one series.I don't see how you can put David Robinson, Dominique Wilkins, John Stockton, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen, Clyde Drexler, and most of the other guys you people mentioned ahead of such a player
