Politics The ACLU took Trump to court over his Muslim refugee and immigrant ban — and won

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by SlyPokerDog, Jan 28, 2017.

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  1. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

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    Gosh that was a sad story. Just one heart string tug and then another. Well by Monday I imagine the traffic will cease, and those are targeted by the bans won't travel. It will get sorted out.
    Sort of reminds me of an Austrian employee some years back. We never could get him off the no-fly list. He was not the guy "they"(who ever) put on, just had the same name.
     
    MarAzul, Jan 28, 2017
    #21
  2. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    NBC is reporting that the document was not reviewed by DHS, the Justice Department, the State Department, or the Department of Defense, and that National Security Council lawyers were prevented from evaluating it. Moreover, the New York Times writes that Customs and Border Protection and U.S. Citizen and Immigration Services, the agencies tasked with carrying out the policy, were only given a briefing call while Trump was actually signing the order itself. Yesterday, the Department of Justice gave a “no comment” when asked whether the Office of Legal Counsel had reviewed Trump’s executive orders—including the order at hand. (OLC normally reviews every executive order.)

    This order reads to me, frankly, as though it was not reviewed by competent counsel at all....

    https://lawfareblog.com/malevolence...horrifying-executive-order-refugees-and-visas
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 28, 2017
    #22
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  3. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    In the broader sense, however, it is most emphatically not good news to have a White House that just makes decisions with no serious thought or interagency input into what those decisions might mean. In fact, it’s really dangerous.

    Let’s start with the malevolence of the document, which Amira Mikhail summarized and Adham Sahloul analyzed earlier today. I don’t use the word “malevolence” here lightly. As readers of my work know, I believe in strong counterterrorism powers. I defend non-criminal detention. I’ve got no problem with drone strikes. I’m positively enthusiastic about American surveillance policies. I was much less offended than others were by the CIA’s interrogations in the years after September 11. I have defended military commissions.

    Some of these policies were effective; some were not. Some worked out better than others. And I don’t mean to relitigate any of those questions here. My sole point is that all of these policies were conceptualized and designed and implemented by people who were earnestly trying to protect the country from very real threats. And the policies were, to a one, proximately related to important goals in the effort. While some of these policies proved tragically misguided and caused great harm to innocent people, none of them was designed or intended to be cruel to vulnerable, concededly innocent people. Even the CIA’s interrogation program, after all, was deployed against people the agency believed (mostly correctly) to be senior terrorists of the most dangerous sort and to garner information from them that would prevent attacks.

    I actually cannot say that about Trump’s new executive order—and neither can anyone else.

    https://lawfareblog.com/malevolence...horrifying-executive-order-refugees-and-visas
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 28, 2017
    #23
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  4. Rhal

    Rhal Well-Known Member

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    Glad thats its halted for now. This was not well thought out or implemented by our government and its shocking how badly the ball dropped on his one.
     
    Rhal, Jan 28, 2017
    #24
  5. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    It's quite a surprise to find that it is amateur hour at the white house.

    Who could have ever predicted that?

    barfo
     
    barfo, Jan 28, 2017
    #25
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  6. THE HCP

    THE HCP NorthEastPortland'sFinest

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    I said I wouldn't come back here, but I'm going to give it a try. This is for Denny.......

    On a lighter note, what do you think about Luol Deng and Thon Maker and how this ties into their situation? They would not be able to go play against the Raptors for fear of not being able to return.

    And on a serious more sad note, today I saw that a woman who is a scientist I believe was trying to get to Harvard University to try and basically help save the lives of other human beings...... was declined entrance.

    Screen Shot 2017-01-29 at 12.04.54 AM.png

    Denny, this is beyond unreal if you ask me. I don't know you personally, but you don't agree with what is happening right? I'm not talking about as a conservative or liberal.....a republican or democrat..... I'm talking about a living,breathing, human being with a brain, heart and common sense and decency.

    Educated or not, open minded or not, stories like this and all the other I saw today about how familes would be affected by this.... that doesn't make you think twice about whether this man should be in control of our lives and represent us and you.

    Does this make you and your family feel safer?

    I'm sure I will get blasted for even asking these questions, but this just makes me want to hold my wife and kids that much tighter. I can honestly tell you that moves like this scare me.

    At what point or what will it take this (I refuse to type his name or call him a man) person to do for you to stop supporting him? What line will he have to cross? It just seems like we are slipping back in time and that frightens me. If you think I'm out of line for asking you this, I'm sorry. I just have lost all respect for so many on here seeing their replies. I understand people wanting change and you voted for him, but you can't tell me that you all have this much hate for other human beings no matter where they come from in your heart. I would never teach my children to treat people differently because of where they are from or who they pray to.

    Thanks for your time.
     
    THE HCP, Jan 29, 2017
    #26
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  7. THE HCP

    THE HCP NorthEastPortland'sFinest

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    And somebody please correct me because like I've said on here before, I never watch the news and am not up to date on all things politics, BUT didn't the majority of the terrorists involved in 9/11 come from Saudi Arabia? If you're gonna block threats, shouldn't you block the right ones? Set me straight on this if you must.
     
    THE HCP, Jan 29, 2017
    #27
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  8. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    I like this HCP and wish he would post more.


    I hope you don't get blasted either, the last time you posted in the OT section it got ugly when all you did was ask questions.

    As far as what you're asking, I can only hope that this causes all to continue to ask what we expect of us, our country and our democracy. It appears this will move to a constitutional argument and these are always good to have.
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 29, 2017
    #28
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  9. THE HCP

    THE HCP NorthEastPortland'sFinest

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    THE HCP, Jan 29, 2017
    #29
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  10. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    Yes, majority came from SA. We have major business and military interests in SA so no neither party is interested in jeopardizing them. I find that wrong but many don't.
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 29, 2017
    #30
  11. THE HCP

    THE HCP NorthEastPortland'sFinest

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    I have a very good friend of mine who I work with who is an award winning field producer at HBOSports....... He is from Iran as is all his family. I reached out to him today to check on him in Manhattan and he is terrified. He travels all over the world for RealSports and 24/7......he was told to stay put in the states. This is one of the most genuine people I have ever met in my life and he is being treated like a criminal. How is this good for the US let alone humanity.
     
    THE HCP, Jan 29, 2017
    #31
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  12. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    SlyPokerDog, Jan 29, 2017
    #32
  13. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    It's not.
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 29, 2017
    #33
  14. rasheedfan2005

    rasheedfan2005 Well-Known Member

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    She's pretty hot. If she wants in she can marry me?
     
    rasheedfan2005, Jan 29, 2017
    #34
  15. oldfisherman

    oldfisherman Unicorn Wrangler

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    Woke up with two depressing thoughts.
    1) We need answers, what is going on in the white house? Someone call Russia to find out.
    2) Having visions of a dinosaur drowning in a swamp, rather than draining it.

    And that is before coffee.
     
    oldfisherman, Jan 29, 2017
    #35
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  16. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Who is Trump's attorney general?

    NOBODY.

    He's been blocked in the Senate.

    Let the man have his guys so the job can be done right.
     
    Denny Crane, Jan 29, 2017
    #36
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  17. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    @HCP

    I've posted numerous times that we should take in refugees (especially of the wars started in the past 8 years) and even have open borders. I do not support this in any way.

    My only hope is that he said this is for 90 days. Let's hope the 90 days flies by.

    I had sinus surgery several years ago. The doctor/surgeon is from Iran originally. A wonderful person. I knew he was from Chicago, so I wore a Cubs hat or Bulls shirt when I went to see him afterward for post surgery checkups.
     
    Denny Crane, Jan 29, 2017
    #37
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  18. oldfisherman

    oldfisherman Unicorn Wrangler

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    Large ships operate normally without the Captain (AG) at the helm. The top man gives the ship direction, he does not do the day to day bilge work.

    Trump did not check with the AGs office if his program was legal, or if it could be implemented. He just shoved it down everyone's throat. He did not need an AG to get an answer. Heck even mods can run a forum without the owner being active. Sometimes better.

    I have been in the wait and see column with Trump. Much of the uproar has been fabricated. But Trump created this mess himself. His behavior was totally unprofessional. And scary.
     
    oldfisherman, Jan 29, 2017
    #38
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  19. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    That might be a valid argument if this had been 1 or 2 months but he's been in office a week. One week isn't blocking.
     
    SlyPokerDog, Jan 29, 2017
    #39
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  20. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

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    Great post John....really heartfelt and I'm with you bro....I have family in 4 countries...friends overseas and etc.....I feel exactly like you do...irregardless of politics or money...my family is ashamed of what's happening here...I don't know how anyone can celebrated the current state of the nation period. Trump has divided the world, not just the country....for a bunch of guys around here spouting the Constitution....I'll gladly lend them my copy...I can only hope this guy gets impeached.....sooner the better for everyone
     
    riverman, Jan 29, 2017
    #40
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