FINDING A PF: Number 1 offseason priority

Marvin Williams is a top notch power forward that would be a perfect compliment to Nurk.....as a bench player for maybe his last stop in a Kaman type role, ZBo would be great to bring back

 

I didn't know, assumed he was a free agent....I still don't get excited about him..if we bring in another PF we could do better...right now I'm seeing Vonleh looking like he's making the leap and if he is...I like it. Run plays for him and he'll show you more offense.

 

I don't disagree, just responding to the person who said he couldn't.

Wait, actually that was you LOL!

 

"top notch" might be a stretch. I'd take him over Ed Davis or Leonard though.

 

Lets go after Trevor Booker. He would fit perfectly. Brooklyn is probably looking to blow it up.

 

Cleveland moved Thompson to center this year. And for good reason, he is tough underneath but struggles offensively and defensively on the perimeter. I guess he could be our back up center and back up PF.

The problem with choosing the right POWER forward is that the opponents are no longer one type. I think we need a more athletic type of player for that position. Aminu is great coming off the bench because he gives us flexibility. But with Harkless at SF I think we need a dependable outside shooter (and passer) at the 4 spot.

 

I'm not sure why you lump O'Quinn in with Faried and Thompson. O'Quinn may not have 3-point range, but he does shoot very well from 16' - 3-point distance. He can also play back-up center, which Faried can't.

When I think midrange (aka: long two range) I think of two players: C.J. McCollum (present) and LaMarcus Aldridge (recent past). Of course, O'Quinn isn't in the same class as either, but he does have a sold long two game. 25 - 30% of his FGAs are in the 16' - 3-point range and he knocks them down at a very respectable clip.

Here's how O'Quinn's long two game compares to C.J. and Aldridge:

Kyle O'Quinn:
2015-16 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = .303; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .439
2016-17 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = .253; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .443

C.J. McCollum:
2015-16 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = .201; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .443
2016-17 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = ..222; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .465

LaMarcus Aldridge (last two seasons in POR):
2013-14 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = .415; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .442 (career best)
2014-15 - Percent of FGA by Distance 16' < 3 = .365; FG% by Distance 16' < 3 = .415 (career average = .420)

Of course, C.J. can create his own shot from anywhere on the court, that's a huge reason he is so effective and Aldridge has always made his living with the long two, but in term of shooting percentages in this range, O'Quinn compares favorably with these two midrange specialists. I don't want O'Quinn shooting the long two as much as Aldridge did, I just want him shooting it often enough to keep defenses honest.

O'Quinn is also a much better passer (15.4 AST%) than Faried (6.1 AST%) and Tristan Thompson (4.7 AST%) and a bit better than Amir Johnson (13.1 AST%). His passing, plus his midrange shooting makes him look like a good fit, on the offensive end, in Stotts' system.

O'Quinn is equivalent to Faried in rebounding (19.4 TRB%) , and better than Johnson and Thompson and twice the shot blocker (6.8 BLK%) as all three: Faried (19.8 TRB%, 2.6 BLK%), Johnson (12.6 TRB%, 3.2 BLK%) and Thompson (17.5 TRB%, 3.0 BLK%).

With Vonleh's emergence, playing next to Nurkic, I'm fine with continuing to start that pair and see how they continue to develop. I think our draft picks (if not traded) would be better spent finding a difference make at the SF position, a cheaper Crabbe replacement and a cheaper, better Leonard replacement. That leaves us with a glaring hole at back up 4 and 5, which is why I think Kyle O'Quinn is a great fit. He has the size and strength to back up Nurkic at the 5 and the midrange game and passing to play next to Nurk as a back up 4.

As an underutilized player on a cheap contract, he also seems like the classic Neil Oshey target. Like Nurkic in DEN, O'Quinn is playing behind his team's franchise player of the future and only getting about 15 minutes per game. With Jokic breaking out in DEN, Nurkic was never going to get the minutes he deserved. Likewise, with Joachim Noah signed to a ridiculous contract and Porzingas (and now Henangomez) being the future of the Knicks, O'Quinn is going underutilized in NYK.

The Knicks were supposedly shopping O'Quinn at the trade deadline. They know he's not part of their future. He could be part of ours.

BNM

 

Personally, and I know I'm in the minority here, I'd rather look for a Harkless replacement in this draft (or via trade) than a PF of the Future. Mo is a below average starting SF and after five years and 8000 minutes of playing time, I see any future improvement as very marginal. He basically is who he is (or at least 95% of who he will become).

I think there are better options available at SF in this draft than at PF. Go after a solid veteran back up PF/C (Kyle O'Quinn) and use our top 1st round pick on the best wing available. Whoever we get won't likely be ready to start from day 1, but that's fine, we currently have all of Turner, Harkless and Aminu who can start at SF if need be. Start by letting the rookie grow into a cheaper Crabbe replacement, and hopefully eventually grow into an above average starting 3.

I think we REALLY need an above average 3 and D guy starting at SF. Turner is a little above average on D, but can't shoot a 3 to save his life. Harkless is basically slightly below average at everything. Aminu is the best defender of the bunch, but his 3-point shooting is too inconsistent and decision making too terrible to be counted on as a starter. Crabbe is a great 3-point shooter, but gives you NOTHING else, and easily the worst defender of the four guys who get minutes at SF. And then there's that contract. Crabbe needs to go and if his replacement can eventually grow into our SF of the Future, all the better.

BNM

 

I said he couldn't really dunk off one foot, but of course he did just that a few hours later. I don't know, I've always defended Vonleh so it's not like I'm against him, I just wouldn't label him as "explosive."

 

I am sorry, but I cannot seriously compare O'Quinn's reserve numbers to any starter. I mean compare these %s with Aldridge's (10,6% AST, 13,1% REB, lower TS% than O'Quinn etc) and someone may think they are kind of same level player while one is an All Star and the other a bench warmer. Yes he might be a bit better than these guys (which I don't believe, but I can accept it), but he belongs to their group, not a level above that.

I think there is a reason he has played for 2 mediocre teams in his career and never managed to find meaningful playing time. He is just not good enough.

 

But I didn't say O'Quinn would be starting, I said he'd be the perfect back up 4/5, something we desperately need. Why can't he continue that level of production as a back up here? He seems like the perfect fit next to Nurk as a back up 4 and perfect backing up Nurk at the 5. And, he's WAY cheaper than the other guys and available.

BNM

 

I agree with most of this. Especially with Vonleh looking as good as any of the potential PF draft picks. I like Crabbe coming off the bench, and I think Neil was right to match. Not much downside because he can be moved. But yes his contract is too big for coming off the bench. There are some attractive wings in the draft and although I like Harkless, I agree we will eventually need an upgrade.

 

Contractwise I'd prefer him yes, but I think Faried could do that too. He has played small ball 5 for the Nuggets and is a good finisher.
All in all I don't see O'Quinn doing anything more than what Ed Davis did last year. Maybe Davis gets this time off and the offseason to get back into shape and we already have him without giving up anything. Of course if it was to get rid of Leonard's contract then ok, but just to dump some salary. I don't see any other point in trading for O'Quinn.

In any case I'd prefer we work a deal for a starting calibre PF and we use Vonleh, Aminu and Davis to back him and Nurkic up. Or just trade Aminu too and get a rookie PF/C.

 

I'd really like to use Iverson voice and say "we're talking about O'Quinn?"

 

Just MO, but in looking for a PF "Motor" should be a top priority. Meyers and Noah both have all the physical abilities and basic talents needed to be very good, but are both low motor guys.

 

I view O'Quinn as a combination of what Ed Davis brought us in 2015-16 and what a healthy Festus Ezeli was supposed to bring us in 2016-17. Davis is an undersized 5 and not nearly the rim protector O'Quinn is. O'Quinn gives us the elite rim protection we hoped Ezeli would provide, with the added bonus is he's cheaper and younger than both Davis and Ezeli.

Faried may play some small ball 5. Good for him. but he's not a true center and not an elite level rim protector. Not even close.

BNM

 

O'Quinn looked like crap last night outside of that one dunk. Largely unimpressive on both ends

 

Yeah I wasnt impressed either and he looks bulky, meaning he could be quicker than most to lose a step and become too slow for our offence.

 

Vonleh is proving that he can be a very good defender - both on the block and the p&r.

He's almost like a Kurt Thomas type - very good post defense with no rim protection. In 67 games this season he has blocked 20 shots -- 0.3 per game.

I still don't know if he's the future at PF but he looks like he could at least be a very good defensive/rebounding role player - like Kurt Thomas.

Or do you go after Zach Collins/Jarrett Allen?

 

They need to bring in one of those top PF prospects with one of their picks to challenge him and see who steps up.