Politics Google employee writes memo stating Google is anti-diversity of thoughts/political ideas

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by santeesioux, Aug 7, 2017.

  1. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I didn't defend him. I suggested he be fired. You did not.

    The only bit he wrote that I found interesting was about the monoculture.

     
  2. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    I agree, I did not suggest he be fired. I didn't defend his ideas (as you did), but I did defend the idea of allowing alternate viewpoints when they don't appear to be malicious.
     
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    By definition, you defended him.

    I suggested he be fired. That's not defending him, one iota.
     
  4. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    Yes, well, I see you're not arguing that you defended his ideas. That's the important thing when it comes to what one defends or doesn't.
     
  5. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    He wrote 10 pages. If he said the sky is blue in one sentence and I agreed it is blue (at least at this time), that's not defending him.

    Saying he should be fired is the opposite of defending him.
     
  6. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Agree to disagree.
     
  7. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. That's got you beat.
     
  8. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Be the woman who shares the cubicle with him for just a moment.
     
  9. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Guys, both of you are defending him to an extent. I think he's an asshole who had

    "conduct detrimental to the team"

    and his firing was justified.
     
  10. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    Yes, that's a good argument to drum out anyone with differing opinions in every situation. As a society, I think we need to be able to differentiate ugly, malicious rhetoric from things we disagree with even if they're wrongheaded.

    I've "been" the non-white person who shares an office with someone making similar arguments about race. I told him what I thought of his (wrongheaded) viewpoints when he brought them up but I didn't feel he should be fired. If he were saying flagrantly racist things, I would expect him to be fired and I'd ask for it to happen.
     
  11. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    Instead, I'm the man that works in an office full of women who continually malign males, and then say to me, "but not you, you're different".

    I imagine it's different for me though, because I'm a male, and therefore privileged.
     
  12. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    It is different for you, because you're not really at risk. That's why I find the arguments about "reverse racism" or "reverse sexism" to not be compelling--when black people or women, for example, are mocked or stereotyped or attacked, they're at real risk for marginalization. No such risk exists for white men, so while mockery or stereotypes about them are still inappropriate, it's far, far less damaging.
     
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  13. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    I don't deny that I benefit from the more male-dominated hierarchy or the subconsciously-elevated value placed on those (traditionally male) characteristics to which I'm more naturally inclined. However I'm talking about the workplace/social aspect of it, where the power dynamic is removed. When suggesting that the woman in the cubicle with the memo-writer would be uncomfortable having to work with him as an equal after his "sexist" views are revealed, it seems comparable to me being subject to similarly sexist views from equals.

    It's also mildly amusing to me that the memo seemed intended to advocate ways in which Google could alter job expectations to accommodate some of the (author's perceived) natural differences between men and women, with the goal of narrowing the wage gap and elevating women, rather than marginalizing them.
     
  14. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Making an argument about it and penning a 10 page manifesto are 2 completely different things. Again, don't try and sell me on it not affecting workplace morale.
     
  15. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Speak up about it in the office. I would.
     
  16. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    I understand what you mean, but I think that it's hard, likely impossible, to separate out the "power dynamic," because your security in society is pretty established. You may not have any direct power over those women or vice versa, but jokes or stereotypes are inherently more threatening when your security is not so assured.
     
  17. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    Hey, man, I'm just giving my opinion. You're free to take it or leave it. I like further elaborating on my viewpoint when questioned/confronted.
     
  18. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    I just don't buy that morale around the workplace won't take a hit. He'd probably be uncomfortable working there just like everyone else.
     
  19. H.C.

    H.C. Well-Known Member

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    I will be frank here.
    I find this very offensive.
    I understand what you're saying.
    However saying it is far less damaging is bunk.
    You never know how mocking or stereotyping of any human will effect them mentally.
    Saying it's just inappropriate, yet it doesn't damage due to their skin color is offensive.
     
  20. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    That's true of any given human but minorities and women have an added layer of threat to deal with. So yes, even given that it can be extremely hurtful regardless of skin color or gender, I still certainly believe it's much more damaging when it's done to groups of people at risk for being marginalized.
     

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