Politics Abraham Lincoln: worst president ever?

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by Sinobas, Aug 26, 2017.

  1. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    And FWIW, I'm not opposed to Hawaii seceding. Their grievances are legit.
     
    bodyman5000 and 1 and riverman like this.
  2. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It wouldn't if the Hawaiians took over....a lot would have cows.....and you're talking about eggs? My Hawaiian friends had chickens or an auntie and uncle with chickens....those prices are geared for the tourists.....a loaf of bread in Yachats market on the coast here is about 4 times more expensive than the market 40 miles away...why? Tourists.......I taught public school and at a Japanese college there....I know about the tensions in public schools...it's why I left after my son was born...didn't want him in the school system there...but that is driven by a lot of poor or even homeless Hawaiians...but I promise you brah....none of them are hungry..most are actually overfed.....alcohol is a big problem, just like it is here. Let's say in Hawaii....lots of the natives are restless and frustrated with mainlanders.
     
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    There are dairy farms on most, if not all, of the islands. Cows are cheap, too.
     
  4. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Contrary to haole beliefs....most Hawaiians I know don't drink milk...at all. Same with Chinese folks...or eat cheeses..some do but it's not their go to diet.
     
  5. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    It's too expensive. Duh.

    And it's not just milk, it's most everything. Gasoline, electricity, etc.
     
  6. Further

    Further Guy

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2008
    Messages:
    11,099
    Likes Received:
    4,039
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Stuff doer
    Location:
    Place
    There is a repeating issue in understanding history of 'reason' vs 'stated reason'. Politicians, rulers and those in power often state one reason for an action but have a very different reason actually driving them. Lincoln stated his reason for the fight was decidedly not slavery but the holding together of the union. But most accounts around the situation show that slavery was an integral wedge leading to the attempted split. Lincoln could not publicly state that slavery was the impetus for the fight. Truth is, we don't know exactly where the line lay.

    However, all that is inconsequential in my eyes because the fight was required. Even if slavery would have died a natural death, when is still a huge question and as a moral nation, one building itself on principals of freedoms and equality slavery needed to stop immediately. Any slowed curtailing would have dragged the moral core of the nation down for centuries and America would have never become the epicenter of the global world. We lead by leading.
     
    Nikolokolus, riverman and Minstrel like this.
  7. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    [​IMG]
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Compromise

    Missouri Compromise

    The Missouri Compromise is the title generally attached to the legislation passed by the 16th United States Congress on May 8, 1820. The measures provided for the admission of the District of Maine as a state free to ratify a state constitution that neither recognized nor permitted slavery within the state. Further, the Compromise provided that the Missouri Territory was free to enact a state constitution that both recognized as legal and permitted (through affirmative state legislation and state government regulation), the institution of chattel slavery. In addition, it outlawed, as a matter of federal law both the recognition and legality of the institution of chattel slavery in the federal territory that remained of the Louisiana Purchase that was still unorganized and north of the 36°30′ parallel (excluding Missouri, hence "Missouri Compromise") within the Purchase lands. With these actions, the Compromise committed the largest remaining portion of Purchase territory to free soil.
     
  9. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
  10. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    America is such a baby country in the history of the world....really young...the civil war was brutal but it's not all on Lincoln in my view...that was a meatgrinder of a war just like WW1 was. .
    Lincoln was not the worst president by a long stretch
    worse..
    Tyler, Fillmore, Pierce, Buchanan, Andrew Jackson and Warren G Harding as well as Andrew Johnson, Grant..Nixon...W. , soon Trump will probably take top honors as the worst..
     
  11. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    That Jimmy Carter didn't make your list says it all about your list.
     
  12. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,281
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    Only one President started a Civil war. Everyone knows his name.

    Just as everyone knows this sign;
    [​IMG]

    It doesn't figgin matter where it is, it is an InterState highway.
     
  13. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    oxymoron...just like I pointed out
     
  14. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    sure ...Jefferson Davis comes to mind..
     
  15. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,281
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    I did it again! Fail to account for the overtly obtuse.
     
  16. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    3 presidents on my list were important in the Civil War happening at all....Buchanan failed to stop the war from being inevitable...secession was in the works before Abe was voted into office
     
  17. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,281
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    Buchanan had no thought about going to war.
    Secession is not an act of war.
    Abe... You finally name the man that began war.
     
  18. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Buchanon did not but he did drop the ball on secession...he failed to unite the country and had every chance to....poor health didn't help but govt failed under him...
     
  19. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,281
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    I suspect Jesus would have met the same result.
     
  20. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    67,843
    Likes Received:
    66,598
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Lincoln was elected and inherited a splintering nation....those who say he caused it to happen I would disagree with...it was already on the table when he was elected
     

Share This Page