I've seen Bird, Magic, Jordan, & Kobe play, IMO LeBron is the G.O.A.T

You may be right, but Pepperidge farms remembers. That he went into chuck mode up 3-1 against a 73 win team, choked it away then ditched for not a “decent set of team-mates”, but a team that before he got there had won a championship and people were talking about if they were as good as the bulls.

 

KD is Dominique Wilkins.

 

I completely disagree with that. It seems like everything is in the now and not reflected on better in the future anymore. I think it will be worse for Durant after his career because he couldn't win on a team that had 3 eventual MVP players and decent role players in OKC. I will never give Durant credit for winning a ring. He joined a 73 win team that didn't have to lose any significant pieces to sign him.

Edit: I will never give Durant credit for winning with GS. If he pulls a LeBron and leads a different team to a title then I will give him proper credit.

 

I wondered when Wilt would enter this g.o.a.t. discussion. Also Russell was the best defender of all time. But...

Jabbar's longevity is what seperates him from Wilt & mj, from my view.

 

I don’t use rings as a way to judge a players greatness honestly. There are scrubs walking the streets today that have won rings while Stockton, the Mailman and Chuck have zero.

 

I agree that rings aren't a determining factor for being great BUT this conversation is about the GOAT which you absolutely can't be the greatest player ever without a ring.

 

Should I post another picture of her?

 

Actually Sly, we were nominated again and the ceremony is next weekend I believe. SHould we have a thread created for this?

 

One word: Sabonis.

 

Not conviced Dog. You replace Curry with Westbrook and Durant still has no ring. Perhaps even James could not over come that drag.

 

I tend to agree. It falls under the category of history being written by the victors.

 

Wilt is the most amazing athlete I've ever seen in any sport - period. His combination of size, strength, stamina, speed and leaping ability has never been equaled - even by athletes using steroids. He used that unique combination of size and athleticism to become the most dominant scorer the game has ever seen. I mean, come on, the guy averaged over 50 pg for an entire season. I don't care what era you played in, that's just ridiculous. That meant if he had an off night and only scored scored 40, he'd need to score 60 the next night just to keep up his scoring average - and he did, for an entire season.

But, Russell totally got in Wilt's head, and NOBODY ever got in Jordan's head. Jordan willed his team to win like nobody else (Bird came close). This is why I still give Jordan the edge as GOAT. During the prime of his career, nobody else was winning a title. I believe 100% that if he hadn't taken off nearly 2 years to play baseball, he would have led the Bulls to 8 straight championships.

LeBron let Delonte West get inside his head. What he is doing now is amazing, but at the same age, Jordan was dominating the entire league, not just the weaker of the two conferences.

I also think you underestimate how good Kareem was defensively. He wasn't nearly as athletic as Wilt, and didn't have Russell's motor, but he still made 1st or second team all defense 11 times. As on offense, he wasn't flashy on defense, but he used his length and timing to maximum advantage. He twice blocked over 3oo shots in a season and averaged over 3 bpg seven straight seasons (and over 4 bpg twice). Like Walton, he played for John Wooden in college and had outstanding defensive fundamentals. He played so long, that I think most people remember him as this lanky, lumbering guy who trailed the rest of the players up the court and forget what a force he was, at both ends, earlier in his career. You are right, he wasn't as defensively dominant as Russel (no one was), nor as aggressive as Wilt, but he was still an excellent defender (at least for the first 12 or 13 years of his career).

BNM