All you have is pure speculation too... You have no idea if PA / NO were actually willing to use the TPE or if the goal all along was sell it as an asset but not use it because of cap reasons. How could you know their intentions? What was available, what wasn’t.
Based SOLELY on what I saw in Summer League (yeah, I know, Summer League, LOL), IMO two future second round picks and some of Paul Allen's loose change is definitely worth GT Jr. So, in some other hypothetical future, maybe not worth it, but in this case, yes. As for the rest of your post: I agree. I was one of those foolish souls who held out some hope (until about two weeks ago) that we'd be able to use the TPE to help acquire someone like Middleton or Butler. The joke's on me, haha (not laughing).
If you give up two 2nds and cash they player better be worth it! I'm not trying to argue that Trent himself isn't good, I'm simply saying that comparing $3.5 million for the 38th pick the year before to two 2nds and $1.5 million a year later isn't in the ballpark of comparable.
What possible reason could Olshey have had to state that the TPEs were in play if he knew, in fact, that they weren't going to be used? Does he get some sort of jollies out of being flamed as a liar? Does he enjoy the extra heat of a disappointed fanbase that had been hoping for a major deal based upon that statement? If they weren't going to be used and he knew it, he could simply have done the usual run-up to the draft and talked about looking trades to upgrade the roster. There's absolutely no percentage in it for him or the team in kiting up the value of the TPEs if there was no plan to use them if the right deal came along.
He gets to tell Dame hey we’re gonna be aggressive with it, then tell him hey we tried. He gets to tell us how hard he worked to try to use it to make us better, and then tell us well it didnt work out. There’s tons of ways to spin things...
I believe if we could have acquired something of value we would have. Im convinced we will make a significant trade that will better balance the starting line up. If this is the end goal then I can see where letting the TPE go makes since. And I also believe there will be no sacred cows and if a block buster is engineered then everyone is in play for the right return. Its end of July with plenty of time left to make a big splash that everyone is calling for. I think timing is everything and we have a shit load of assets to use very strategically.
I really don't get your concern about the two future second round picks and $1.5M. You agree that he shows the potential to be worth that kind of investment. You know that Paul Allen has never hesitated to buy 2nd round picks when needed to get a player he wants, so there's really no need for concern about the loss of future players. You're more than happy to spend vastly more money in luxury tax to get role players. What am I missing here?
My point is saying for a fact you know someone else’s intentions well you can’t, and it’s speculation...
I respect the heck out of you BNM, but you are picking and choosing what I am saying to support your side. I wasn't saying "AND cash" because I wanted to save Allen money. I'm comparing the value of trading the 38th pick for $3.5 million one year and then paying $1.5 million and 2 future 2nds the next year for pick 37. I've been consistent the whole time so don't try to paint it differently. The two 2nd rounders are worth more than $2 million in my eyes and that is the same reason I value future 2nds more than you. I'm not playing what ifs either. Just about every scenario that I've mentioned are ones that actually occurred in real life and I would have done any of them. To say that I'm just concocting scenarios after the fact really pisses me off because I've been talking about this for months (since the TPE was created actually but I wasn't a member of this site yet). For the last fucking time, I am not willing to pay a huge ass tax bill for a 2nd round pick. I believe a good GM would be able to creatively make moves until the desired outcome was reached. If not, at least they did everything in their power to try. Sure, it's a huge risk and one that might end up costing a ton of money but wouldn't the chance to do something greater be worth that risk sometimes? I've already explained too that moves could be made to lower the tax bill. Trade Evan Turner for Miles Plumlee and we save $5-6 million off our cap number which would significantly lower that $30 million tax bill. I know these are hypotheticals but there are literally hundreds of scenarios I could come up with to lower the tax bill if it came to that, most of which wouldn't involve getting an asset. If guys like Love or Griffin become available this year it's because their respective team realized they don't want to pay those guys when they are in their mid-30s. Drafting Simons and Trent was fine OR signing Stauskas and Curry. Adding four shooting guards without addressing any more pressing needs is crazy to me. I don't care that they got Trent, but then don't sign Stauskas or whatever.
Olshey said that the Blazers, if possible, wanted to use the TPE plus the No. 24 pick to get a veteran player rather than adding another rookie. That's not speculation; it's fact. Can I know for absolute certain that he wasn't blowing smoke? No, but what he said made sense relative to the team's needs, Paul Allen didn't speak up and say that he didn't agree with what his GM said, and I really can't see any valid reason for him to lie about this. It's a classic case for use of the Occam's Razor principle: When presented with competing hypotheses about a problem, one should select the solution with the fewest assumptions.
I've already stated many times, there is a difference between buying picks at the draft and having future picks to use in trades. I actually think 2nd rounders are valuable, that is why I am mad we gave up the 2021 Heat 2nd rounder. I've presented multiple scenarios in which we could've acquired a 2nd rounder to use in that trade instead of the Miami one. Obviously if I'm willing to take on salary for a 2nd rounder they have value to me. I'm fine with Trent! I'm confused why we then signed two more SG's and let Davis walk though. It doesn't make sense. The TPE was one way of using a cheat code of sorts to balance the roster. I just don't get what the goal is here. It's obviously not to give Dame a better team.
@BonesJones mentioned this in another thread. Offer to take one Miles Plumlee from the Hawks for the TPE for pick #34. The Blazers could have taken Trent at 34 and kept their two future 2nd rounders. What does it matter what the cost was if they get a good player, isn't that what you guys said? Plumlee can provide some depth at center for two seasons until his contract runs out. Or even better if we got the 30th pick then Trent wouldn't have needed to be signed using the tax-MLE. It's like the whole fucking off season was based on getting Cousins when it would have been near impossible to pull off and Olshey has a good enough relationship with his agent to know that it would become a conflict. I think the Cousins thing was the real reason they didn't pull a trade off at the draft because they knew if they used the TPE it would be impossible. Then after the Cousins trade fell through it was too late to go back and change anything or get anything good for it.
Just as there are people who will attack NO no matter he does, there are also people who seem to defend him no matter what he does. What I find interesting about this summer either NO is a liar and lied to us about what he wanted to do, or he is unable to pull off moves to make the Blazers better. Neither of those options seem great to me... Sure we can praise him for not doing anything, we can praise him for doing something great. We can tear him down for those same things too. Fact is he sold the asset of the TPE, he sold the we need to get veterans thing and so far has failed to do either.
that's not really fair...there are fans who understand what he does and take interest in the changes he's made...the people who don't like Olshey are much more willing to bash him no matter what he does for the team....to me...we're just better than last year...I say that because I believe the coaching staff makes 2nd and 3rd year players better pretty consistently. We have many anti Olshey threads around here....I've yet to see a thread praising him. You've got a lot of company...it's folks like me who don't have front office or ownership or coaching complaints that are clearly in the minority...
So the people that criticize/dislike him don’t understand what he’s doing? I was pretty neutral about Olshey until recently. I can give him props when he deserves it. The Nurkic trade for example. The problem is I had to go back almost two years to identify a basketball move he’s made that actually improved the team. If it’s financial, he should’ve been fired for putting Portland in the position of paying for decisions made over two years ago. If it’s not financial, then he should be fired for a complete inability to use the tools and assets he has had to balance out the roster.
I didn’t mention any particular posters. I give credit to NO for some of the good things he’s done. He did say they wanted to use the TPE - They couldn’t (not shocking), but he’s the guy who’s supposed to figure out how to use his assets to get better. He’s the guy who said he wanted to get more veteran experience to try to win in April, and hasn’t done that yet... I am not being sarcastic when I say I enjoy the optimism of posters like you and @Hoopguru . I appreciate it and I try to look at it from the perspective you bring. That doesn’t necessarily mean I agree with you. I know I lean towards being one of those that criticize NO no matter what he does, I do have to work on being fair about the things he’s done. I try to give him credit for things like remaking the Roster after LMA left, keeping Dame happy, getting Nurkic here, etc. I still stand by it though there will be people who will criticize him no matter what moves he makes and there will be people who will praise every move he makes. At this point I don’t really think the team got better this summer (at least short term), but I’m not yielding a judgement on that at the moment I can see an arguement that they could be better if Zach, Simons, Trent, Curry can become legit players this year.
Shit, I think every Olshey hater has praised a move before. Me and Gronk praised his draft (it took me a while to come around on Trent). Then there's some posters in here who I've never seen have a problem with anything Neil's done, then claim some "Olshey haters" will bash him no matter what. That's not fair.
