https://www.pewsocialtrends.org/essay/the-growing-partisan-divide-in-views-of-higher-education/ Right wingers are praised by their leaders for being uninformed. "I love the poorly educated." It's a badge of honor - my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge. Anything they disagree with is "Leftist political dogma" and people with any education after high school are "over-educated idiotic progressive bullies." And conservative leaders love it because their indoctrination garbage is now gospel. While they're publicly trashing higher education, they're sending their own kids to universities. Stated values vs. revealed values and all that jazz. Claiming the shrimp is terrible, as you shovel more onto your plate, just isn’t convincing.
Are you trying to convince us that far Right Republicans do not value an education? Gasp, why was this never thought of before? Does this explain Trump's popularity among those people? (answer-yes). Hey, you know what I noticed? There was a big change in that direction in about 2016. What happened in 2016?
Polls are polls. We all could probably substantiate our own beliefs depending on the poll we choose to use: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/07/26/most-americans-say-higher-ed-is-heading-in-wrong-direction-but-partisans-disagree-on-why/?utm_source=AdaptiveMailer&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=18-7-26 Higher ed press release&org=982&lvl=100&ite=2932&lea=651931&ctr=0&par=1&trk= As 10th grade high school dropout, I've sometimes wondered about the significance of a college education. I've always, though, come to the conclusion that I wished I'd completed high school and went on to get a degree. Interestingly, many of my colleagues, friends, and family don't have degrees related in any way to the profession they're in. I've wondered why that was the case. Never really asked, though. At any rate, I don't get too bent out of shape in terms of the "liberalism", etc., of our public upper learning institutions. It is what it is. Plus, there are many private choices, so, whatever.
I have my issues with colleges, and the “systems”, we have in place. However one way or another people need to find a way to educate themselves or it’s going to make life harder on them then it needs to be.
I will say this, we need to rethink the idea that every single person should go to college. We have been operating under that idea since I was a kid, and now we have a ton of people with useless degrees, tons of debt from college loans, and really a huge lack of people going into the trades. Our schools need to stop putting it into kids heads that they're a failure if they don't go to college.
On the subject - I think this is probably a less worrying specific than the overall trend of Republicans becoming extremely anti-intellectual - and not just anti-ivory-tower-intellectual. The current Republican party is anti-science, anti-education, anti-expert, anti-fact, and pretty much anti-reality. Probably after another couple of election cycles the Republican party will be run by a naked hairy guy named Trog who just grunts and hits people with a stick. And some of you will vote for Trog, because he trots out a strong game. barfo
Some kids aren't built for college, meaning they can't properly read or write. They don't even know if they're in Pleasure or Toledo. I don't think they can pound a square peg in a round hole even with a big hammer (their favorite tool).
This has a lot to do with colleges becoming very very very anti conservative. To the point where they won't allow conservative speakers on campus. My last year of college was back in 2015. I can attest that the environment was almost exclusively liberal. The professors spoke like everyone was liberal in class. I felt like I could never voice any kind of opposition and I know I wasn't the only one. If the conservatives are becoming more and more anti-intellectual, the liberals are becoming more and more anti-free thought.
this is simply false....if you don't use college or high school or tech schools to improve your life it's your own choice. Even in the Navy you test into different schools for your skillset. I've never heard of a teacher telling students that not going to college is failure....parents, yes...not schools....colleges lobby for business just like anyone else....I loved school....made the most of it..my father was way more successful financially than I ever was and he had an 8th grade education and was a farmer...very good head for money and very smart man.
All colleges are different I suppose, but PCC / PSU back 15 years ago when I was there was the most echo chamber-ish places I had ever been for liberal politics. Like if you didn't just take what they said and echo their beliefs they would literally fail you. So you just wrote down their opinions and got good grades. I didn't finish school at the time and conservatives have their own echo chambers and such and places thought control, but my experiences were similar.
My friend had a Math teacher who said, "If you aren't in calculus by the 11th grade you will be a failure". I had an AP Biology teacher in 10th grade, basically, echo the same thing and said, "Your school mates who can't get into AP classes will be pumping gas for a living".
some folks don't mind pumping gas....my dad made a lot of money cleaning out his dairy barns and spreading manure on the fields. If a teacher says those things....they should be called out on it...there are some really BAD teachers who only teach for a paycheck and a soapbox....they have no authority over anyone's choices
Sure, but the implication was definitely your friends life will suck if they aren't smart enough for AP classes.
I get that you have experience in teaching, and being in that world, but honestly, my experiences with School made me HATE school. I was in PPS from K-9th and I remember 2 good teachers, and many bad ones who literally did not care about their students AT ALL, I remember being in classrooms multiple times where the lesson of the day was tell your parents to vote for this ballot measure so we can make more money. I remember teachers saying to us as students, things like what I said above. I am not going to remove my own problems from the situation, I had my own issues but I really hated school. It wasn't until after I dropped out of college and found something I really enjoyed that I was like hey learning can be fun, and took off towards educating myself. I'm not saying all teachers are bad, I know there are good ones out there but my experience was pretty bad, and I had several friends who echoed similar sentiments as adults. I actually do find education really important. I'm not downplaying it, but sometimes the way you talk about teachers it's odd to me because my personal experience seems to be much different than yours.
@riverman don't take that too personally! I appreciate your perspective. It just seems so foreign to me when it comes to teachers and the education system. When the subject has come up, a lot of what you say about it doesn't seem to match what my personal experience with school was like.
I can't speak to your experience, because obviously I'm not you, and also because I went to college many decades ago. But how do you know that the situation has even changed as compared to some date in the past? Maybe colleges have always been the way you experienced them in 2015. barfo
There are a lot of people with worthless degrees out there who are balls deep in debt because of it, that’s for sure. It’s not our responsibility to bail them out of it either.
Wow, totally confused how there is a debate on this subject. Many jobs require a degree to be just considered to be hired or promoted. A degree shows a commitment to self improvement. I believe the real debate should be the value of a liberal arts degree vs a degree in science, tech, engineering, and math (STEM). STEM degrees pay more, and are more in demand than liberal arts degrees. STEM degrees are the future.
