<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Jul 17 2007, 04:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Wow one or two blocks every 10 games! He isn't too good at steals either.</div>My point is he is bigger, and athletic, and can steal the ball very good.Yes he is good at steals man.It is stupid to start 2 guys under 6 feet are you kidding me do you relize how much more teams will score on us then if JR started even though he not good on D he not AWFUL. And atleast he is athletic, has size, and can steal.
JR CAN'T STEAL! I understand what you mean to put a bigger man on guards, but AI has always defended people bigger than him. It isn't like he can only defend people his size.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Jul 17 2007, 02:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>JR CAN'T STEAL! I understand what you mean to put a bigger man on guards, but AI has always defended people bigger than him. It isn't like he can only defend people his size.</div>Does not matter with 2 people under 6 feet it will be a mess why is this so hard to understand?And yes JR can steal if you don't think so watch more games. I saw that even if the less time I saw him after AI came here, and he was back from suspentions.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Serge @ Jul 17 2007, 08:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Does not matter with 2 people under 6 feet it will be a mess why is this so hard to understand?And yes JR can steal if you don't think so watch more games. I saw that even if the less time I saw him after AI came here, and he was back from suspentions.</div>What is so hard to understand about J.R. average 0.7 steals per game?Watch some more games? Are You honestly telling me that? You started watching the Nuggets halfway through the year and unless you have league pass never saw them play unless nationally televised. I missed maybe 10-15 of the 82 games. Wow. :no3:
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Jul 17 2007, 11:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What is so hard to understand about J.R. average 0.7 steals per game?Watch some more games? Are You honestly telling me that? You started watching the Nuggets halfway through the year and unless you have league pass never saw them play unless nationally televised. I missed maybe 10-15 of the 82 games. Wow. :no3:</div>Since Iverson came to Denver I did get league pass why else would I say this? I only missed maybe 1 or 2 games after AI became a Nugget.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Serge @ Jul 17 2007, 10:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Since Iverson came to Denver I did get league pass why else would I say this? I only missed maybe 1 or 2 games after AI became a Nugget.</div>Yeah... so I saw more games than you, so don't come out with this bullsh** that I need to watch more games. Want me to start watching practice and JR's pickup games so I can see he is good at stealing because he obviously hasn't impressed me with it in the NBA.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Jul 18 2007, 01:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Yeah... so I saw more games than you, so don't come out with this bullsh** that I need to watch more games. Want me to start watching practice and JR's pickup games so I can see he is good at stealing because he obviously hasn't impressed me with it in the NBA. </div>Since AI became a nugget I missed maybe 1 or 2 games I know what I am tlaking about I watched JR enough to know what I am saying. lol
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Serge @ Jul 18 2007, 12:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Since AI became a nugget I missed maybe 1 or 2 games I know what I am tlaking about I watched JR enough to know what I am saying. lol</div>So you think he can get 2 steals and maybe a few blocks a game? I beg to differ that you know what you are saying. JR isn't a good defender. Simple as that.Alright here is what proves he can't block or steal.SPG in his career: .07 per gameBPG in his career: .01 per gameThe only thing that went up last season was his SPG which movies up to .08!!!!!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Camby23Land @ Jul 18 2007, 02:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So you think he can get 2 steals and maybe a few blocks a game? I beg to differ that you know what you are saying. JR isn't a good defender. Simple as that.Alright here is what proves he can't block or steal.SPG in his career: .07 per gameBPG in his career: .01 per gameThe only thing that went up last season was his SPG which movies up to .08!!!!!</div>A few blocks a game no, but a few steals a game yes.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Serge @ Jul 17 2007, 03:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I am not saying he is good on D. But he is atheltic can come from behind maybe block a shot since he can jump good. But mostly he is very good at getting steals. Him, and AI out there would cause lot's of turnovers for other teams = fast break points for us.</div> That is the most corrupt defensive strategy I've ever heard. Firstly, Jr Smith is far from a shot blocker. He's a 6-6 shooting guard. Second of all, a player using his athletecism to come from behind and swat the ball away happens once every 10-20 games. If Smith can actually perfectly time his jump to block the shot from behind without fouling the guy it would be all over the high-light reels the next day. Things like this don't happen.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GArenas @ Jul 18 2007, 02:39 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>That is the most corrupt defensive strategy I've ever heard. Firstly, Jr Smith is far from a shot blocker. He's a 6-6 shooting guard. Second of all, a player using his athletecism to come from behind and swat the ball away happens once every 10-20 games. If Smith can actually perfectly time his jump to block the shot from behind without fouling the guy it would be all over the high-light reels the next day. Things like this don't happen. </div>I am not saying he a blocking machine, but he can get those kinda blocks more then some think. But mostly I am talking about his steals, and being athletic he can really jump.
His .07 steal average? That in no way means he is a good defender. Either you haven't watched a game or you are too focused on AI.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Serge @ Jul 18 2007, 02:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I am not saying he a blocking machine, but he can get those kinda blocks more then some think. But mostly I am talking about his steals, and being athletic he can really jump.</div> I've never seen a player add an aspect to their game where they wait for the man, whom they're supposed to be guarding, to pull up. Then after that they block the shot from behind. As I said, that would be a highlight if it somehow happens without a foul being called. Also, through JR's career he has been average at stealing the ball. I don't understand why you somehow believe he will have an outburst and start averaging 2+ SPG.
Last season when I watched he was more active with his hand, and got steals maybe not consistently but he got them. Now I don't care about before Nash was not the MVP or even good before later he became 2 time what some though should be 3 time MVP. And helping out, and coming from behind to block a shot is possible a lot not everytime, but you act like that is some great thing if he did it. Not like it is a impossible thing to do. I say he can get steals I don't care what others think.
SERGE, Maybe you should try reading... I never said "you said it was A.I.'s team" I meant in the playoffs he was playing like it. Try reading again... SERGE and IVERSONFAN268I agree with you during the regular season A.I. took a backseat to melo, that was the whole point of him coming.We wanted a Denver version of A.I. not the old 30pt leave it up to me Philly Iverson.We don't need him. Thats why during the regular season we had rythm to the offense, we had a clear pecking order so to speak. Melo was the number one option and A.I. was more of a scoring point guard and his team high 7assist confirmed that. But if you couldn't see that the game plan changed in the playoffs I don't know what to tell you. Whether it was Karl or A.I. I don't know (personally I blame karl).Somewhere along the line A.I. got placed with equal status or possibly a little higher then melo.The fact that he shot it 16 more times then melo in the series confirms that.When I say status I mean in context to this nuggets team not their careers. Yes A.I. was scoring 30 a game for philly in the playoffs,but he didn't have to contend with carmelo anthony for those points and melo shouldn't have to contend with the A.I. from philly.Thats excactly what happened vs the spurs and this really affected the rythm of our offense. The gameplan essentially became a 2man game with melo and A.I. taking turns going one on one. We are at our best when the denver A.I. is controling and distributing the ball and getting role players involed.A.I. is a double threat because he is our best distributor and a defender's nightmare. When he is thrown into that old philly role though we have a drop off in assist and lack of rythm because we already have a 30pt scorer. Serge you and I atleast seem to think A.I. is best in the point scoring role,I was just critizing the change made in the playoffs whereas you are coming from the standpoint of the regular season. I agree completely about the regular season which is what made the playoffs so frustrating.If A.I. had been avg30 a night since day 1 and him and melo forced one on one shots every play it would be different.But A.I. showed just how great of a player he really is during the regular season. Instead of sticking with what made us so successfull, karl or A.I. flipped the script and A.I. was taking more shots then melo.That affects chemistry and well as A.I. is distributing less. That is why I said it's not his team. I don't think melo and the philly A.I. can coincide but melo and A.I. from the regular season can be lethal. BIGMO 763 you said "That is some stupid reasoning right there... if you look at it that way, then Carmelo takes more shots than the player with the third highest PPG average in NBA history, and the highest active PPG in the playoffs. That should never happen... (if you can't tell, I'm being sarcastic because you're reasoning is idiotic)."If you don't see the logic in why it was wrong for A.I. to shoot more then melo then you're slow.You can't justify A.I. taking more shots then Melo based on him having the 3rd highest playoff average in history and the highest active and heres why. 1st Have you ever heard of team chemistry?Everyone questioned A.I. coming here for a reason because the old A.I. and melo won't work.Didn't A.I. say he was glad he didn't have to run the show?Didn't he take the backseat to melo and even lead the team in assist during the season?Didn't we have mid-late season success?It had alot to do with CHEMISTRY...Didn't you notice the LACK of it in the playoffs???We turned away from what made us successful an turned to the very system people doubted could work.And it didn't...The fact that melo was the 2nd leading scorer just means he is HEAVILY implanted in the offensive scheme.Why do you then complicate things by changing what you did all season?Besides these playoff numbers you are bringing up,keep in mind thats when philly's 2nd best player was prolly Aaron Mcee...Its a little different now he is playing with CARMELO.We can't possibly expect him to put up the same numbers so why try? By your reasoning its perfectly ok for A.I. to go to the Lakers and shoot it more then Kobe...I bet you can't find a retarded person to jump off the bridge with you on that one...
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bronco303 @ Jul 21 2007, 02:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>BIGMO 763 you said "That is some stupid reasoning right there... if you look at it that way, then Carmelo takes more shots than the player with the third highest PPG average in NBA history, and the highest active PPG in the playoffs. That should never happen... (if you can't tell, I'm being sarcastic because you're reasoning is idiotic)."If you don't see the logic in why it was wrong for A.I. to shoot more then melo then you're slow.You can't justify A.I. taking more shots then Melo based on him having the 3rd highest playoff average in history and the highest active and heres why. 1st Have you ever heard of team chemistry?Everyone questioned A.I. coming here for a reason because the old A.I. and melo won't work.Didn't A.I. say he was glad he didn't have to run the show?Didn't he take the backseat to melo and even lead the team in assist during the season?Didn't we have mid-late season success?It had alot to do with CHEMISTRY...Didn't you notice the LACK of it in the playoffs???We turned away from what made us successful an turned to the very system people doubted could work.And it didn't...The fact that melo was the 2nd leading scorer just means he is HEAVILY implanted in the offensive scheme.Why do you then complicate things by changing what you did all season?Besides these playoff numbers you are bringing up,keep in mind thats when philly's 2nd best player was prolly Aaron Mcee...Its a little different now he is playing with CARMELO.We can't possibly expect him to put up the same numbers so why try? By your reasoning its perfectly ok for A.I. to go to the Lakers and shoot it more then Kobe...I bet you can't find a retarded person to jump off the bridge with you on that one...</div> You do know how stupid you sound, right? If you didn't realize (and I even said it), I was being sarcastic... but I guess that is too big of a word for you to understand.If you don't understand that Iverson (or any second-option on any team in the league) has to shoot, then you are the retarded one. If Iverson doesn't shoot, the Spurs triple-team Carmelo Anthony even more. Iverson shot so much because he was left in single-coverage for most of that time, and during the stretches that Carmelo was on the bench in foul trouble, Iverson is the go-to guy on the court. Denver was unlucky in the fact that Iverson was off the entire series because of his elbow problems. If he shot at his normal percentage, then you obviously wouldn't be sitting here complaining about it, now would you?Allen Iverson is one of the most unstoppable offensive forces we've ever seen in this league, and when a player is a go-to player who has such a big offensive impact, then it isn't that easy to just sit back and play second fiddle. THE DENVER NUGGETS DID NOT BRING HIM IN TO BE A PLAYER WHO TAKES 10-15 SHOTS A GAME. They encouraged him to keep shooting, and I'm 100% sure so did Carmelo Anthony. I would much rather have a player shooting when he is left in single coverage, then have a guy shooting when he is in a double or triple-team, wouldn't you? Uh, obviously not...The Nuggets brought him in to take some of the offensive burden off of Anthony, right? Well, if he doesn't shoot, then you're basically paying a guy $20 million dollars for doing the same thing that you were paying Andre Miller to do at a cheaper contract. Have you ever heard of the phrase "keep the defense honest?" I'm guessing you haven't...One more thing... AI only shot more than Carmelo in two of the four losses:- In the Game 1 victory, Iverson shot 11-22, and 8-8 from the free throw line in 45 minutes of play. Carmelo Anthony shot 10-18, and 8-8 from the line in 40 minutes of play, so it's basically a wash.- In Game 2, Iverson shot 9-25, and failed to make it to the free throw line. Carmelo Anthony shot 8-21, and 8-9 from the free throw line (both played about 44 minutes). So, in case you didn't know... if a player gets fouled, then that shot attempt doesn't count (unless they make it)... therefore it is safe to assume that Anthony indeed was more of a factor on the offensive end than Iverson was... so you're complaint isn't valid in Game 2.- In Game 3, AI shot 7-20, and 6-9 from the line in 45 minutes of play. Anthony shot 10-21 and 6-11 from the line in 41 minutes of play. Again, AI wasn't the focus of the offense that night, was he? Worst case scenario is that they were basically even that night.- In Game 4, Iverson was 9-25, and 4-5 from the stripe in 45 minutes of play, whereas Anthony was 11-18, and 5-6 from the line in 38 minutes. So, 7 extra shots in 7 extra minutes for Iverson... wow, he was definitely a chucker that night! - In Game 5, AI was 6-22, and 7-9 from the stripe in 44 minutes, whereas Anthony was 8-20, and 4-5 from the stripe in 43 minutes. That is the ONLY game where I can see you have a point, but other than that you're basically complaining about sh*t you're pulling out of your ass. Not to mention AI averaged around 6 assists per game even though he was "selfish" in the playoffs.Oh, and that late season run had as much to do with the emergence of Nene, and an improved defense as it did with chemistry. The Spurs basically took Nene out of the offense except for maybe two games, and George Karl didn't help matters either by not instructing his players to feed the ball into Nene more often.Next time you complain about something, you might want to watch the games and make sure that the thing you're complaining about, actually happened. :happy0144:EDIT: And before you say that he should have stopped shooting because he shot poorly, go back to the whole "keeping the defense honest" paragraph I had... because you really have no point in bitching and moaning about this crap... unless your perfectly happy paying Iverson $20 million a year to do exactly what Andre Miller did.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BigMo763 @ Jul 21 2007, 09:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>You do know how stupid you sound, right? If you didn't realize (and I even said it), I was being sarcastic... but I guess that is too big of a word for you to understand.If you don't understand that Iverson (or any second-option on any team in the league) has to shoot, then you are the retarded one. If Iverson doesn't shoot, the Spurs triple-team Carmelo Anthony even more. Iverson shot so much because he was left in single-coverage for most of that time, and during the stretches that Carmelo was on the bench in foul trouble, Iverson is the go-to guy on the court. Denver was unlucky in the fact that Iverson was off the entire series because of his elbow problems. If he shot at his normal percentage, then you obviously wouldn't be sitting here complaining about it, now would you?Allen Iverson is one of the most unstoppable offensive forces we've ever seen in this league, and when a player is a go-to player who has such a big offensive impact, then it isn't that easy to just sit back and play second fiddle. THE DENVER NUGGETS DID NOT BRING HIM IN TO BE A PLAYER WHO TAKES 10-15 SHOTS A GAME. They encouraged him to keep shooting, and I'm 100% sure so did Carmelo Anthony. I would much rather have a player shooting when he is left in single coverage, then have a guy shooting when he is in a double or triple-team, wouldn't you? Uh, obviously not...The Nuggets brought him in to take some of the offensive burden off of Anthony, right? Well, if he doesn't shoot, then you're basically paying a guy $20 million dollars for doing the same thing that you were paying Andre Miller to do at a cheaper contract. Have you ever heard of the phrase "keep the defense honest?" I'm guessing you haven't...One more thing... AI only shot more than Carmelo in two of the four losses:- In the Game 1 victory, Iverson shot 11-22, and 8-8 from the free throw line in 45 minutes of play. Carmelo Anthony shot 10-18, and 8-8 from the line in 40 minutes of play, so it's basically a wash.- In Game 2, Iverson shot 9-25, and failed to make it to the free throw line. Carmelo Anthony shot 8-21, and 8-9 from the free throw line (both played about 44 minutes). So, in case you didn't know... if a player gets fouled, then that shot attempt doesn't count (unless they make it)... therefore it is safe to assume that Anthony indeed was more of a factor on the offensive end than Iverson was... so you're complaint isn't valid in Game 2.- In Game 3, AI shot 7-20, and 6-9 from the line in 45 minutes of play. Anthony shot 10-21 and 6-11 from the line in 41 minutes of play. Again, AI wasn't the focus of the offense that night, was he? Worst case scenario is that they were basically even that night.- In Game 4, Iverson was 9-25, and 4-5 from the stripe in 45 minutes of play, whereas Anthony was 11-18, and 5-6 from the line in 38 minutes. So, 7 extra shots in 7 extra minutes for Iverson... wow, he was definitely a chucker that night! - In Game 5, AI was 6-22, and 7-9 from the stripe in 44 minutes, whereas Anthony was 8-20, and 4-5 from the stripe in 43 minutes. That is the ONLY game where I can see you have a point, but other than that you're basically complaining about sh*t you're pulling out of your ass. Not to mention AI averaged around 6 assists per game even though he was "selfish" in the playoffs.Oh, and that late season run had as much to do with the emergence of Nene, and an improved defense as it did with chemistry. The Spurs basically took Nene out of the offense except for maybe two games, and George Karl didn't help matters either by not instructing his players to feed the ball into Nene more often.Next time you complain about something, you might want to watch the games and make sure that the thing you're complaining about, actually happened. :happy0144:EDIT: And before you say that he should have stopped shooting because he shot poorly, go back to the whole "keeping the defense honest" paragraph I had... because you really have no point in bitching and moaning about this crap... unless your perfectly happy paying Iverson $20 million a year to do exactly what Andre Miller did.</div>:worthy: :worthy: :worthy: :worthy: :worthy: :worthy: Niiiiice Bigmo.
AI can score 30 and still give the 30 assists got damn he did nothing diff he was just having a hard time was not in his zone that is all. And he was trying to shoot him self out of that bad zone he was in that is why he shot a little more though then reguler season nothing wrong with that.
