[quote name='GotSkillz52' post='43730' date='Apr 27 2006, 03:50 PM'][quote name='Jon_Vilma' post='43553' date='Apr 26 2006, 08:56 PM'][quote name='GotSkillz52' post='43535' date='Apr 26 2006, 05:17 PM']Marion was his only weapon. The other candidates have a lot more around them then Nash does. Marion is def top 5. I agree he's versatile but he doesnt exceed them like the top 5 players do.[/quote]Name 5 other players with a higher average ranking in 4 different catagories in the NBA.[quote name='ThaFranchize' post='43547' date='Apr 26 2006, 05:44 PM']^ I can't believe you said the other players have more around them... Kobe has nobody...[/quote]And I'm sure Nash had TONS to do with Diaws blocked shots and rebounds. Which is what his biggest contribution was.[/quote]O yes Boris Diaw, the nobody who I believed was traded from the Hawks. Nash didnt improve him right. So how do you explain 4.8 ppg to 13.3? Almost every statistical category improved when he went to the suns[/quote]Hmm, perhaps his minutes going from 18.2 per game to 35.5 per game had something to do with that. Which is why Diaw was pretty terrible when Amare was playing, his minutes were down, and his stats were down. Can't get the stats if you don't get the minutes.
No, my argument is that Kidd and Marbury were passers back in the day and Marion is just feeding off of another PG now with Nash. They might not be at Nash's level but they still averaged 8+ assists.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chang @ Apr 27 2006, 08:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>No, my argument is that Kidd and Marbury were passers back in the day and Marion is just feeding off of another PG now with Nash. They might not be at Nash's level but they still averaged 8+ assists.</div>I've already said in this thread that Phoenix's offensive system requires a PG to operate. But it's not like the Suns were a horrible team until Nash came along. Starbury and Kidd had them in the playoffs too. The mainstay is Marion. Marion is a top 5 player, maybe the best in the NBA. He does feed off of a PG because that's the system, but Nash didn't make Dirk the greatest player in the league. In fact, Dirk has actually gotten better since Nash left. Is Jason Terry better than Steve Nash? No, it's just all about the system. Nash found a system that is PG required, and left a system that is PG optional.
[quote name='Jon_Vilma' post='43829' date='Apr 27 2006, 11:17 PM'][quote name='GotSkillz52' post='43730' date='Apr 27 2006, 03:50 PM'][quote name='Jon_Vilma' post='43553' date='Apr 26 2006, 08:56 PM'][quote name='GotSkillz52' post='43535' date='Apr 26 2006, 05:17 PM']Marion was his only weapon. The other candidates have a lot more around them then Nash does. Marion is def top 5. I agree he's versatile but he doesnt exceed them like the top 5 players do.[/quote]Name 5 other players with a higher average ranking in 4 different catagories in the NBA.[quote name='ThaFranchize' post='43547' date='Apr 26 2006, 05:44 PM']^ I can't believe you said the other players have more around them... Kobe has nobody...[/quote]And I'm sure Nash had TONS to do with Diaws blocked shots and rebounds. Which is what his biggest contribution was.[/quote]O yes Boris Diaw, the nobody who I believed was traded from the Hawks. Nash didnt improve him right. So how do you explain 4.8 ppg to 13.3? Almost every statistical category improved when he went to the suns[/quote]Hmm, perhaps his minutes going from 18.2 per game to 35.5 per game had something to do with that. Which is why Diaw was pretty terrible when Amare was playing, his minutes were down, and his stats were down. Can't get the stats if you don't get the minutes.[/quote]You know why he didnt play as much? BECAUSE HE SUCKED
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chang @ Apr 27 2006, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Marion had the benefit of Kidd in the beginning of his career and Stephon Marbury in the middle of his career. Those were years that Kidd averaged 9.5+ assists and Marbury 8+ assists.He's had dishers all his life in the NBA...</div>Then maybe it's Marion who is the one who truly makes his teammates better. Cause Nash wasn't even in this discussion till he got to the Suns..and the Mavs only got better without him.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Combs @ Apr 28 2006, 06:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chang @ Apr 27 2006, 06:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Marion had the benefit of Kidd in the beginning of his career and Stephon Marbury in the middle of his career. Those were years that Kidd averaged 9.5+ assists and Marbury 8+ assists.He's had dishers all his life in the NBA...</div>Then maybe it's Marion who is the one who truly makes his teammates better. Cause Nash wasn't even in this discussion till he got to the Suns..and the Mavs only got better without him.</div>What I'm saying. Dirk and the Mavs got better when they went from Nash to Terry, Kidd and Starbury got worse when they left the Suns.... so Marion makes PG's look good.
Kidd is getting worse but only with age. He had the most apg when Marion was a rookie. However, every season after that, he had a at least 8.5+.Marbury only this season got worse. He has been consistant with his 20 ppg and 8 apg his entire career.The Mavericks only got better after Avery Johnson became the coach. he stressed defense with standout defenders like Josh Howard, Marquis Daniels, and Dampier. Don Nelson had a score points and defend later approach. They also have experience and depth. Jerry Stackhouse, Keith Van Horn, Devin Harris, and Darrell Armstrong.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (chang @ Apr 29 2006, 06:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Kidd is getting worse but only with age. He had the most apg when Marion was a rookie. However, every season after that, he had a at least 8.5+.Marbury only this season got worse. He has been consistant with his 20 ppg and 8 apg his entire career.The Mavericks only got better after Avery Johnson became the coach. he stressed defense with standout defenders like Josh Howard, Marquis Daniels, and Dampier. Don Nelson had a score points and defend later approach. They also have experience and depth. Jerry Stackhouse, Keith Van Horn, Devin Harris, and Darrell Armstrong.</div>Wow, really stretching for it now huh?
After his shitty performance in Gm. 4 vs. LAL, I don't think he's even close to deserving. Damn, he just kept running the corner.
Nash is the MVP. He deserves it. He is what makes the Suns engine run. Just plug players into the run-n-gun offense with Nash running it. He's what makes the entire thing go
Steve's 4 assists tonight I'm sure were why Diaw dominated and tag teamed with Shawn Marion to beat the Lakers.Funny that Nash was a ghost besides the occasional shot in the victory, but when Nash has the rock trying to win the game Kobe kicks the crap out of him.
