Ant is what he is. I don't blame him or hold any ill will toward him. But he's not a part of our future. He has been given ample opportunity and shown that he's not good enough. If Sharpe and Scoot are given the same opportunity and aren't much better than Ant I'll want them moved as well. But make no mistake, keeping Ant has absolutely 100% stunted the development of both Sharpe and Scoot.
I guess I don't understand how the Blazers are "failing these guys".... Sharpe is averaging the second most shots on the team only 0.4 behind Ant. He is shooting 27% on threes. Guys like Wes Matthews, Dame, CJ, and Ant would never have shot so poorly in their early years regardless of their roles. Scoot has been one of the least effective players in the NBA. They have been handed ample minutes, opportunities, and shots. Y'all make it sound like the Blazers are holding back Scoot/Sharpe as Jermaine Oneal was here when he didnt get minutes after 4 years. Thats just not the case at all. A guy like Ryan Rupert has played better than either, is a superior defender, is the youngest, but hasn't got on the court. If anything Rupert is getting the Jermaine treatment - not Scoot or Sharpe. I'm all for moving on from Grant/Ant/Ayton/etc as it doesn't make sense to have so many vets like that here. It's frustrating to watch them and its frustrating we allocated resources to them in the last couple of offseasons instead of building long term assets with this team. But them being here or not being here has little to do with Scoot and Sharpe lack of effectiveness.
As frustrating as it is to watch them, imagine how frustrating it is to play with them. Now imagine being a rookie coming in and having to listen to those guys. Those guys are the "veterans" you're supposed to be learning from. It's a joke. It's how you build losing culture. Those guys are losers and they will turn your young players into losers as well, unless you're lucky enough to draft the next born superstar. But we're not going to draft a born superstar very often. We've probably done it two or three times in the history of our franchise.
Ant and Grant have always been held in high regards by their teammates. Dame, CJ, Melo, team USA guys, etc enjoyed playing with them. Yes they aren't star players and have faults in their games, but their really better than a replacement level NBA player. I just don't see their presence at all holding back Sharpe or Scoot. Yes Scoot or Sharpe may get the ball a bit more without those guys - but then their going to have defense keying in on them much more - so ultimately its probably close to a wash. Ayton I kind of agree with - he doesn't provide help offensively, his defense is horrible, and theres plenty of rumors about what a clown he is off the court. The thing is the player most impacted by him here in Clingan as you say is by far the most effective of our youth. So again - these vets being here just doesn't appear to be a factor at all in the lack of development or in Clingan case positive development.
Clingan has the benefit of two years on a championship level team in college. Clingan doesn't compete for shots with Ant and Grant. Look, if you're happy with the way this is going that's great. I'm simply saying I'm not. I was afraid that this exact scenario would play out when both of these guys were drafted if we didn't get Ant out of here. It has gone exactly the way that I thought it would. Maybe that's just "luck". I have no allegiance to Sharpe or Scoot. But I 100% believe forcing them to play with and behind Simons has stunted their development. I've seen it happen at all levels. It doesn't mean Simons is a bad person. It doesn't mean that older teammates wouldn't like him. That has nothing to do with this. Simons is simply the wrong kind of player at the wrong point in his career to have in this situation in Portland right now.
I really enjoyed watching the Spurs game - and I found the Suns game to be fine to watch considering we handily lost. I can't stand the big3 of Ant Ayton Grant. Glad that Ayton has been out the last two games and its made the team MUCH more enjoyable to watch. I'd prefer all these vets are gone - but mostly want one of them out ASAP. However Scoot and Sharpe lack of development just isn't correlated much to this. I wish it was the case that if we ship out Ant or Grant or both that then ScootSharpe would be on the path to becoming stars. Unfortunately their play on the floor has shown that isn't going to be the case. Even if Ant/Grant are here after the trade deadline I bet they'll sit out most of the games. So you will likely get your wish one way or the other for the last 3 months of the season.
No, I won't get my wish. The damage has been done for the last 2 years. That damage may not be able to be reversed. We've seen both Scoot and Sharpe play very well without Simons. And I'm sure they'll play well again when they get consistent time on the court without him. But that lost time is lost. Those doubts are now in their head. They are now in a much tougher situation. They may never become what they could have been. And that's really disappointing. It'll set this rebuild back a lot. Probably an extra few years. Here's hoping that's not the case and they've bounce back.
well yeah, if you're talking 'superstars', only 3: Walton-Clyde-Dame...and there are some Dame detractors here who'd probably argue he's not a superstar now, if you're talking guys Portland drafted who appeared in multiple all-star games: Wicks (2nd pick) Petrie (8th) Walton (1st) Jim Paxson (12th) Clyde (14th) Porter (24th) Aldridge (2nd) Roy (6th) Dame (6th) (Petrie-Paxson-Porter only appeared in 2 all-star games each) Mychal Thompson was a 1st pick and good Blazer player for several years, but never made it to an all-star game. See anything notable in his draft? ***************************************************** if you can't have a superstar + all-star at the same time, then having 2 or 3 all-stars will have to do teams just don't draft superstars that often. Arguably, Portland has drafted 3 and only has one championship to show for it. The Spurs have 5 championships and only drafted 2 superstars, Robinson & Duncan (Phoenix drafted Gervin and Wemby hasn't been around long enough). Bucks drafted Jabbar and Giannis and only have 2 championships from that. Denver has drafted 3: Kiki, Melo, Jokic and only has one championship. As far as I can tell, Miami drafted 1, DWade, but have 3 championships. Dallas has drafted 2, Dirk and Doncic the Lakers? yeah, fuck those guys. They managed to draft Elgin Baylor, Jerry West, Gail Goodrich, Magic, James Worthy, and Kobe
I think it would have to be superstars. But even that's probably not the right word. Guys who would come in and take over even though they're younger and less experienced than the current guys. I'd say Dame is one of those guys, Drexler probably isn't. It sounds like Roy was one of those guys... But I think management flat out told him he was good to do that. Management was clearly fed up with that crew. I kind of doubt Sharpe and Scoot have been told they could undermine the vets. And they probably wouldn't be good at it anyway. Once again, Brandon Roy had four years of competitive college basketball experience.
How guys are used matters. I'm not saying Scoot and Shae don't have some blame, but how they are being utilized is sickening. Imagine if the Pistons had Rip Hamilton working in ISOs instead of coming of pin downs and screens. Or perhaps you're too young to understand that reference. I'm not sure.
Agreed that a superstar is just too rare to set as a bar or rebuilding goal. Of course we would love to get one - but the plan shouldn't depend on that as it could be many decades until one comes along. The strategy should be to come out of a rebuild with two allstar level players, a good stockpile of picks, as well as a couple quality starters/role players. Then when those drafted allstars are finally realizing their potential and getting the team into the playoffs - trade away picks/prospects for the 3rd allstar to push the group into that next level and contend. Clingan, Camara and Deni might be good enough to fill the the quality starters/role player roles. I was hoping that one of Scoot/Sharpe would fill one or both of those drafted all star player holes. Unfortunately that hasn't been the case. 4 years into the tanking we appear to have zero potential allstars and only own a single pick from the Dame trade haul. Not the progress I would've hoped for when Olshey was let go. Here is what we probably need to have happen; 1. 2025 draft get an allstar - this is the next best opportunity, hopefully we can get a high enough pick and make the right choice here 2. 2026 draft or later get second allstar. Or Scoot/Sharpe/Rupert/Clingan/etc shock us and develop to that allstar (appears unlikely) 3. Trade for third allstar - Build up multiple picks and other assets to eventually use for that trade package. Ideally if we can get a pick or two from our vets in the next few months that could be a small portion of this. 4. Role Players - DONE - Acquire quality complementary players - appears Clingan, Camara, Deni, etc can fill this I have actually been in support of Cronins draft picks as I think he took swings at #1/#2 with Sharepe/Scoot and it just hasn't work out yet. The 2024 draft was crap and didn't have any possible allstar - so getting a role player locked up in Clingan was the next best move. We need more swings for getting those allstar to happen though. However #3 is the big problem this franchise has had since the day Olshey left. We're not aggressively building our assets to one day be able to get that 3rd allstar. Instead we've allocated cap space, playing time, roster spots, dual timeline strategies that focused on present wins. This has been a complete waste and is the difference that quality organizations have pursued in their rebuilds (OKC, Jazz, Spurs, Rockets, Nets, Magic, etc)
I am very skeptical Portland could start all 3. Way to offensively challenged and kind of redundant is skills. That front-court would require both stars to be guards. And the wheelhouse of NBA contention is to have an elite player at one of the forward positions. Portland needs to find a largish wing that's a 2-way star
But part of what helps people become superstars is the environment that they are brought into. The Lakers have been good at creating those kinds of environments. We didn't set the environment up well for their development, IMO.
Maybe Scoot, but not Shae. They are getting their opportunity. Once Shae improves his 3-point shooting his offense will open up. That is not Ant's fault. This is what he has shot from deep in the last 10 games. (Although I think it is more of a slump) 1-8 1-4 2-6 1-8 2-4 2-6 0-6 1-7 1-6 4-6
watching this clip you see how dynamic he can be when he has the ball in his hands. in Portland, we’ve sapped his confidence by making him play off ball (where he’s not a good enough shooter to play that way) or by taking it up and handing it off for Simon/grant/etc to run the action. in the rare occasions he gets to play make it turns out well, kick outs to open shooters, lobs to Clingan, etc.
I'm not at all worried about shooting for Sharpe. If we get serious coaching in here his three pointer will be on point. I definitely think Ant being here has stunted Sharpe's development.
I never said start all 3 - in fact that would be impossible with the plan I laid out. Eventually have 3 allstars paired with these guys. Then start one or two of Clingan/Camara/Deni and the others come off the bench.
