Tanking vs Team/Player Growth and Development

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by BoBoBREWSKI, Apr 10, 2025.

  1. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    LOL at "14 game improvement"...people keep bringing that up; improvement over what? That 14 game improvement is context-free spin because the baseline is a deliberately tanked season. It's a phony gauge

    I'll ask again, how many games would last year's team have won if that team would have tried to win every game? 28? 30? 33?
     
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  2. julius

    julius I wonder if there's beer on the sun Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I don't know if you could say that last bit, and not have the same thing apply to this years team (it's also an easy cop out for any improvement the team makes any year).

    I think that the team got better as a whole, despite the fact that Grant played fewer # of games this year (47 this year, 54 last year), same with Ayton (40 this year and 55 last year). And Shaedon went from playing 32 games to playing 72 games, and his defense and overall game improved immensely (his three point shooting however...).

    Given all that, I don't think last years team would've been able to win as many games this year as the current team did, because of the improvement of Shaedon, Scoot and Toumani and the addition of Deni this year.

    Last years team had a train wreck of a rookie (Scoot) who improved a ton this year, and not to forget that Simons played in 24 more games this year than last year which helped them improve (or not, depending on if you think he helps). And it's not like Simons was "shut down", he missed like the 18 games to start the season after getting hurt in the 1st game. And it's not like they had a good record even when he was playing (11-35).

    The first 19 games he played in, they were 4-15. It's not like they were tanking from the get-go. Last years team was *bad* even when healthy.
     
  3. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    all of that is reasonable and I do think this year's team is better...for certain. I'm just saying the 14 win improvement is a bad gauge

    at the 41 game mark, this year's team was 13-28. Last year's team was 12-29. Only a 1 game difference; but that's about the point in time that last year's team started their swan dive
     
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  4. julius

    julius I wonder if there's beer on the sun Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Yeah and it was at that point this years team showed improvement and something clicked.
     
  5. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    right...because they continued to try and win. Last year's team did exactly the opposite, deliberately
     
  6. julius

    julius I wonder if there's beer on the sun Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Because they had better talent. Because the improvement of the team...
     
  7. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    again...if all that was true, the better talented team would have had a much better record at the halfway mark, but they didn't
     
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  8. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    14 game improvement put us in purgatory.

    High draft picks don’t guarantee shit, but it does give you the opportunity to get better quickly. Look at the 2018 draft. It’s not about who they drafted, it’s about who they could have drafted. The opportunity to draft Doncic, JJJ, SGA, Trae Young even, etc. Doncic or SGA completely turns that franchise around
     
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  9. julius

    julius I wonder if there's beer on the sun Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Sounds like maybe being a smart evaluator of talent is just as important as placement in the draft (esp if the draft is loaded). For example, SGA was the 11th pick in the draft, Mo Bamba was 6th. Kevin Knox was 9th.

    It also depends on whether or not you make stupid trades (trading Trae Young for Luka for example). And even SGA was traded on draft day for other picks and players that amounted to jack squat.

    And it's not like SGA was expected to be as good as he is.
     
  10. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    It’s all about the opportunity. That’s why higher draft picks matter. Honking once ended up bad, but we had the opportunity to honk twice when no one else did
     
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  11. Phatguysrule

    Phatguysrule Well-Known Member

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    Why not have both? The higher you draft (and the more assets you have) the more opportunity you have to take advantage of your expertise.
     
  12. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

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    Evaluating how much these young players will improve over time is obviously difficult. Otherwise, there would not be so many misses
     
  13. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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    Costco should take over the draft, they have a great return policy.
     
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  14. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    true, but a point guard at Costco is 7'11 and weighs 573 pounds
     
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  15. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    I had no idea The HCP was that tall…….or moonlighted at Costco
     
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  16. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    I said 7'11, not 4'11
     
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  17. julius

    julius I wonder if there's beer on the sun Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Because if you have one, you tend to not have or need the other
     
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  18. Phatguysrule

    Phatguysrule Well-Known Member

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  19. STOMP

    STOMP mere fan

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    why would any team give up anything for a 31 year old non-difference making forward making 34M per for the next 3 years? Its a pipe dream to think that there is a market for such a player... I don't get why posters here keep pretending

    yes your favorite Blazer podcast probably talks about moving him, but they have to come up with content and they're playing to fan hopes not reality. The milk is on the floor and there is no reversing the contract he signed... accept reality that he's likely to be a Blazer for a few more seasons as no one has a reason to add him. If he's moved for a 2nd, it will be attached to another massively overpriced piece that won't be expiring.

    STOMP
     
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  20. STOMP

    STOMP mere fan

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    the something was Deni went from the new guy blending in to fuck it I'm tip of the spear

    STOMP
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2025
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