Frank Thomas is by no way a one-dimensonal player. He got 2 MVPs, should have gotten a 3rd, he played 1st base until injuries made it hard for him to play the field. Frank Thomas is a good hitter. He has good plate discipline, good swing, hits for power. The most important thing at the plate is not making an out. Speed is overrated. Defense is not a big part of the game.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DevinHester23 @ Jul 4 2007, 09:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Speed is overrated. Defense is not a big part of the game.</div>Neither of those are true. Otherwise it was a good post. First of all, How can speed be overrated when the Average Fan doesn't think a whole lot about Speed to begin with? Secondly, Speed is definately a very good trait to have and not 'overrated'. A player with speed can not only Steal Bases, but they can Bunt for a Single, Stretch a Single into a Double, Stretch a Double into a Triple, Advance from First to Third on a Single, Make the opposing team rush throws leading to Errors, Have better Range on Defense, or in a player like Jose Reyes's case, even cause balks from Opposing Pitchers. Speed is a great weapon to have on your team as it has so many positive uses that can help you at the plate, on the bases, and in the Field.And Defense is very important as well....maybe not as important as Offense or Pitching are, but a Good Defensive Team can take numerous runs off the scoreboard. Good Defense takes away hits (Either from Great Range or the Highlight Reel type), Good Defense minimizes the number of Errors you cause, Good Defense can turn a higher percentage of Double Plays, Throw out Runners from the Outfield, Catch Opposing Players Stealing, Ect. It makes such a significant impact on the game that Statheads come up with stats like Fielding Independant Pitching to attempt to measure what a Pitchers ERA would be independant of Fielding.
Actually, after reading Moneyball, they show defense is only 5% of the game. I would rather have Jeter (a sucky fielder) over Izturis (a good fielder), b/c Jeter has a way better bat. And about speed, let's compare Big Donkey with Alfonso Soriano. Adam Dunn has a better OBP than Soriano. Soriano is the guy with better speed. Dunn avoids making outs more than Soriano. I want Dunn even though he is slow. I don't care for speed or defense. If a guy has it, great, but it's not a top priority. I'm not shoving it aside, but it's valued more than it should be
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DevinHester23 @ Jul 4 2007, 10:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Actually, after reading Moneyball, they show defense is only 5% of the game. I would rather have Jeter (a sucky fielder) over Izturis (a good fielder), b/c Jeter has a way better bat. And about speed, let's compare Big Donkey with Alfonso Soriano. Adam Dunn has a better OBP than Soriano. Soriano is the guy with better speed. Dunn avoids making outs more than Soriano. I want Dunn even though he is slow. I don't care for speed or defense. If a guy has it, great, but it's not a top priority. I'm not shoving it aside, but it's valued more than it should be</div>Moneyball is nothing more then an Opinion. It is in no way fact, and I would argue that Defense is much more then just 5% of the game. And if you notice, in the part of Moneyball where they talk about how the league is 'adjusting to Billy Beane' and he has to evolve in order to stay ahead of the Curve, that they directly say that Oakland begins looking for other undervalued Skills, such as Defensive Capabilties. Hence why Oakland is Top 10 in both Errors (8th Least) and Fielding Percentage (8th Most). So clearly he doesn't think as little of it as you imply he does. As for your compairsons, yeah, I would take Jeter over Izturis as well....but that's because Jeter is a much, much better player to the point where that the compairison is simply not fair. Now if you wanted a fair comparison then try your Average Fielder in Derek Jeter to a Good Fielder like Jose Reyes all of a sudden you have a real debate on your hands. Personally, I would take Reyes as his Speed and Defense more then make up for the marginal difference in their hitting.For the Second Comparision. I think you're overestimating Adam Dunn. His On Base Percentage this season is .350, compaired to the .351 OBP of Alfonso Soriano. Granted, the Career OBP Averages of Dunn is signifcantly higher then Soriano, but Soriano has been much more patient over the last 2 years and Dunn has seen is On Base Percentage drop mainly due to his Home Run or Bust Philosophy. I also think you're neglecting the impact that Soriano's speed has when he is on the Bases. Like I already said, Speed can not only Steal Bases, but they can Bunt for a Single, Stretch a Single into a Double, Stretch a Double into a Triple, Advance from First to Third on a Single, Make the opposing team rush throws leading to Errors, and even cause Opposing Pitchers to Balk. A player with Speed like Soriano is much more likely to Come Around the Bases and Score a Run then a player like Adam Dunn is, and it's all about putting Runs on the Board, right?
Yes, it's all about scoring, but I would like to avoid making outs more. Getting a runner home from 2nd is not the top priority. Over the course of a season, I want the higher OBP guy. I can worry about that run with the next hitter. Over the course of the season, not making outs will create more scoring chances
Scoring and scoring chances are completely different things. A chance just means there is a possiblity that you have a runner to score. Soriano can score from 1st on a single sometimes, where Dunn may not even make it to 3rd. That's more of a help than giving an opportunity for the team. If Soriano scores, that doesn't put an out on the board does it?
I think that when all is said and done, the team with the most runs on the board will win the game.*feels proud of self for making such a profound statement*
