Well</p> 87'= 18.488'= 18.2</p> 07'= 18.7</p> Deng had a higher PER last year than Worthy did in the two championship years I was referring to. We don't even have to bring potential into this even.</p> Deng is very similar to Worthy. That in itself is why there is that flawed logic imho that Deng can be the #1 option on the Bulls. It just isn't going to happen, he's the type of player imho, that is a 2nd option at best. Good thing for the Bulls they have their legit first option.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'>Thats a tall order to suggest that Tyrus future is comparable to the career that shaq had. It's not exactly "the future" for "now" since the manitude of each category is different, and subjective to each player. I'll take an old beat up shaq over a young Tyrus anyday. Tyrus, Deng, and Gordon is another matter.</div></p> You have a major failure of comprehension of what we're talking about.</p> No one is suggesting that Tyrus will be better than Shaq. I think almost every Bulls fan, and NBA fan will agree that Tyrus probably won't be better than Shaq.</p> But its the idea of trading a 21 year old, who could potentially be an allstar for the next decade, for a guy that you are just going to have for the next 3 years, but who (at least in the first year or two), should increase your chances immensely of winning an NBA championship. </p> </p> </div></p> And in an ironic twist, you read my post again and figure out what I was saying (of course if you don't, I guess I'll explain myself again below).</p> Because future Tyrus will probably not equal the level that shaq has achieved, you must be wary of getting fair value (like you would in any trade). My point is that its not a matter of a clean swap of "now" and "future," but rather "now" and "less-than future." Of course Shaq is better now, but I'm saying that the other team (Heat) should be careful of crippling their franchise by not getting a fair return. Whether its a shaq-level player now (which tyrus isn't) or a shaq-level player then (which you say won't happen) </p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> There's simply nobody else that's a good comparison</p></div> You don't think Ron Artest is a better comparison? Each person is a great player in this league and has similar skill sets. And there's not a huge discrepency.</p> Like I could say that Quincy Douby and Rip Hamilton are comparable because they're spot up shooters. That's also ridiculous.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'> Well</p> 87'= 18.4 88'= 18.2</p> 07'= 18.7</p> Deng had a higher PER last year than Worthy did in the two championship years I was referring to. We don't even have to bring potential into this even.</p> Deng is very similar to Worthy. That in itself is why there is that flawed logic imho that Deng can be the #1 option on the Bulls. It just isn't going to happen, he's the type of player imho, that is a 2nd option at best. Good thing for the Bulls they have their legit first option. </p> </div></p> Oh, great. Now you're going to try and aruge your point with a subjective stat made by a single idiot. Hey here's an idea: watch the game of basketball instead of this</p> </p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> There's simply nobody else that's a good comparison</p></div> You don't think Ron Artest is a better comparison? Each person is a great player in this league and has similar skill sets. And there's not a huge discrepency. </p> Like I could say that Quincy Douby and Rip Hamilton are comparable because they're spot up shooters. That's also ridiculous. </p> </div> No. Artest's game is nothing like Deng's. Douby's is nothing like Hamilton's.</p> DraftExpress is full of player comparisons (upside/downside) for all the potential draftees. So is S2's draftee profiles. Either you don't get it, or you're being obtuse.</p> </p>
<h2>Kevin Durant Draft Capsule</h2> VITALS: 6-9, 225, Texas </p> OVERVIEW: Quickly establishing himself as one of the top scoring threats in college basketball, Durant became the first freshman in NCAA history to receive both the coveted Naismith and Wooden Awards. Ranked fourth in the nation in scoring (25.8 ppg). Led the Big 12 Conference in scoring, rebounding (11.1 rpg) and blocks (1.9 bpg). Named the Big 12 Player of the Year and earned all-conference first-team and All-Defensive Team honors. Set school record and Big 12 record for most points in a season with 903. Also set school single-season mark in rebounds with 390. Averaged 28.9 points and 12.5 rebounds in conference play, both Big 12 single-season records. Scored a career-high 37 points on four different occasions, including a game against Texas Tech when he also had a career-best 23 rebounds. Became first player on a losing team to be named the Big 12 Tournament MVP, after scoring 37 points, grabbing 10 rebounds and setting career highs in both assists (6) and blocks (6) vs. Kansas. Set league tournament record with 92 total points scored. </p> LIKELY DRAFT POSITION: Second overall selection. </p> <font size="5"> COMPARATIVE UPSIDE: Rashard Lewis </font> </p> <font size="5"> COMPARATIVE DOWNSIDE: Jonathan Bender </font> </p> ROLE PROJECTION: Scoring small forward. </p> POSITIVES: Unlike most players who come into the NBA with certain spots from where they like to shoot, Durant seems to be able to make shots from anywhere on the court. He has a stable, consistent release and his shot looks the same whether he is shooting a 10-footer or a 20-footer. He has uncommon agility for his height and he is so rangy it appears he can get to the basket from anywhere over half-court in two dribbles. Durant is a confident ball-handler and can be very aggressive in taking the ball to the hoop. He is a terrific foul shooter and an excellent rebounder. </p> SHORTCOMINGS: It's been well-documented that Durant failed to bench press 185 pounds even once at the NBA Pre-Draft Camp. Considering he doesn't turn 19 years old until NBA training camps open in the fall, this isn't much of a concern. He'll add strength both naturally as his body matures and as a result of working with NBA strength and conditioning coaches. The only concern about Durant is that his NBA coach will want to play his developing body too many minutes right from the start, and he could break down over a long season. A judicious coach would play him about 28 minutes per game as a rookie.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'> Well</p> 87'= 18.488'= 18.2</p> 07'= 18.7</p> Deng had a higher PER last year than Worthy did in the two championship years I was referring to. We don't even have to bring potential into this even.</p> Deng is very similar to Worthy. That in itself is why there is that flawed logic imho that Deng can be the #1 option on the Bulls. It just isn't going to happen, he's the type of player imho, that is a 2nd option at best. Good thing for the Bulls they have their legit first option. </p> </div></p> Oh, great. Now you're going to try and aruge your point with a subjective stat made by a single idiot. Hey here's an idea: watch the game of basketball instead of this</p> </div></p> I do watch basketball, but I take it you've never watched Luol Deng play if you are comparing him to Ron Artest.</p> Yeah, Luol Deng isn't a carbon copy of James Worthy. They have their differences. But the way they move around the court, their skillset, its very similar, and their actual production has been pretty similar as well.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> There's simply nobody else that's a good comparison</p></div> You don't think Ron Artest is a better comparison? Each person is a great player in this league and has similar skill sets. And there's not a huge discrepency. </p> Like I could say that Quincy Douby and Rip Hamilton are comparable because they're spot up shooters. That's also ridiculous. </p> </div> No. Artest's game is nothing like Deng's. Douby's is nothing like Hamilton's.</p> DraftExpress is full of player comparisons (upside/downside) for all the potential draftees. So is S2's draftee profiles. Either you don't get it, or you're being obtuse.</p> </p> </div> When I said that I could compare Douby to Hamilton, you did see that I said that would be a ridiculous comparison to make right?</p> Artest is very similar to Deng! Both are good defenders who have a great midrange game.</p> Oh so if I don't agree with DraftExpress (although usually I do), or S2's draftee profile (Your draftee profile hm?) then I'm obtuse. Right. Somebody's got an NI complex over here</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'> I do watch basketball, but I take it you've never watched Luol Deng play if you are comparing him to Ron Artest.</p> Yeah, Luol Deng isn't a carbon copy of James Worthy. They have their differences. But the way they move around the court, their skillset, its very similar, and their actual production has been pretty similar as well. </p> </div></p> Well sure everybody's got their differences, but there is a difference between skill set and skill level (just like theres a distance between magnitude and direction, if you're a physics guy). The skill level between one of the game's all time greats and Deng is just too much to make comparisons. Were you not both level headed I would have just claimed this as a case of homerism and left it at that.</p> Defense and midrange game. I think deng and artest are very similar, but just as you mentioned above, not a carbon copy. I regard artest as the better defender. But I think that comparison is a lot more fair than him to worthy.</p> Nenad Krstic is a 7 footer who is a great shooter. Quite possbily, having the best mid range shot on the Nets. But you won't hear me say he's comparable to Dirk.</p> </p>
[quote name='GMJigga'][quote name='Denny Crane'][quote name='GMJigga'][quote name='Denny Crane'] There's simply nobody else that's a good comparison</p>[/QUOTE] You don't think Ron Artest is a better comparison? Each person is a great player in this league and has similar skill sets. And there's not a huge discrepency. </p> Like I could say that Quincy Douby and Rip Hamilton are comparable because they're spot up shooters. That's also ridiculous. </p> [/QUOTE] No. Artest's game is nothing like Deng's. Douby's is nothing like Hamilton's.</p> DraftExpress is full of player comparisons (upside/downside) for all the potential draftees. So is S2's draftee profiles. Either you don't get it, or you're being obtuse.</p> </p> [/QUOTE] When I said that I could compare Douby to Hamilton, you did see that I said that would be a ridiculous comparison to make right?</p> Artest is very similar to Deng! Both are good defenders who have a great midrange game.</p> Oh so if I don't agree with DraftExpress (although usually I do), or S2's draftee profile (Your draftee profile hm?) then I'm obtuse. Right. Somebody's got an NI complex over here </p> [/QUOTE]</p> You seem to take issue with players being compared to other players. To prove your point, and to be obtuse, you throw out comparisons that really are ridiculous.</p> A Deng/Artest comparison might be valid if Deng took charge of games, took a lot of 3 pointers, and was a much more physical player than he is. Or if Artest dunked a lot and finished around the rim like Deng does (and Worthy did) or ran the court like Deng or Worthy.</p> A fair comparison for Rip might be Reggie Miller. While Rip isn't quite the shooter and clutch scorer that Miller was, they both have similar builds and got their points on similar kinds of plays - moving without the ball to get open, off screens, and neither needed to manufacture their own shots all the time by having the ball for much of the shot clock.</p> Douby has been compared to Gordon, because of their similar stature and ability to shoot/score, more than anything else. Though Douby isn't getting much PT, so he doesn't have the confidence of his coach - or the ability.</p> </p> </p> </p>
I've come to realize to disagree with Bulls' fans ridiculous arguments is considered trolling and harassment.
Firstly, the Heat would never trade Shaq for Tyrus Thomas. It's ridiculous to even consider that they would, however if the Bulls were to snag Shaquille O'Neal I would be very scared as the Bulls would be nearly unstopabble on both ends of the floor. How do you expect to score in the post with Wallace and Shaq in not to mention Nocioni and Hinrich in the perimiter. The team already has terrific team defense, add Shaq and it's nearly impossible to score. On offense, the Bulls are accustomed to perimiter scoring and relying on Deng to slash, however with Shaq on the court it creates alot of easy looks for Gordon and other shooters.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> You seem to take issue with players being compared to other players. To prove your point, and to be obtuse, you throw out comparisons that really are ridiculous.</p> </p> </div></p> Jesus, no. I have an issue with poor comparisons. To demenstrate how poor a comparison it is to compare deng to worthy I offered an analogous example; one that was equally ridiculous in hopes that an example that didn't include a Bulls player would allow you to see how silly it was.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> You seem to take issue with players being compared to other players. To prove your point, and to be obtuse, you throw out comparisons that really are ridiculous.</p> </p> </div></p> Jesus, no. I have an issue with poor comparisons. To demenstrate how poor a comparison it is to compare deng to worthy I offered an analogous example; one that was equally ridiculous in hopes that an example that didn't include a Bulls player would allow you to see how silly it was. </p> </p> </div></p> You haven't demonstrated squat, other than your ability to make poor player comparisons. Congratulations!</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane)</div><div class='quotemain'> You seem to take issue with players being compared to other players. To prove your point, and to be obtuse, you throw out comparisons that really are ridiculous.</p> </p> </div></p> Jesus, no. I have an issue with poor comparisons. To demenstrate how poor a comparison it is to compare deng to worthy I offered an analogous example; one that was equally ridiculous in hopes that an example that didn't include a Bulls player would allow you to see how silly it was. </p> </p> </div></p> You haven't demonstrated squat, other than your ability to make poor player comparisons. Congratulations!</p> </p></div> An intentional poor comparison! That is correct! In the context of this thread, with respect to your above post, we are in the same boat. However one of us made it intentionally bad, and the other one doesn't have an excuse. </p>
[quote name='GMJigga'][quote name='Denny Crane'][quote name='GMJigga'][quote name='Denny Crane'] You seem to take issue with players being compared to other players. To prove your point, and to be obtuse, you throw out comparisons that really are ridiculous.</p> </p> [/QUOTE]</p> Jesus, no. I have an issue with poor comparisons. To demenstrate how poor a comparison it is to compare deng to worthy I offered an analogous example; one that was equally ridiculous in hopes that an example that didn't include a Bulls player would allow you to see how silly it was. </p> </p> [/QUOTE]</p> You haven't demonstrated squat, other than your ability to make poor player comparisons. Congratulations!</p> </p>[/QUOTE] An intentional poor comparison! That is correct! In the context of this thread, with respect to your above post, we are in the same boat. However one of us made it intentionally bad, and the other one doesn't have an excuse. </p> [/QUOTE]</p> Making an intentionally poor comparison doesn't make the awesomely correct one wrong.</p> LOL</p> Have you even seen either player play? I don't get the sense you have.</p> EDIT: And it has nothing to do with "homerism." I do not think that Deng is the best player in the league, or even the best SF.</p> </p> </p>
So Deng is not the best SF in the league, yet the best comparison you can make is one of the greatest players of all time. Ok just making sure.
