Martin Wants 87 Million!

dont forget vince carter,

 

Kenyon Martin is going to have to put up Tim Duncan type numbers if he wants to earn the same paycheck.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting t-mac:</div><div class="quote_post">Kenyon Martin is going to have to put up Tim Duncan type numbers if he wants to earn the same paycheck.</div>

Duncan has just SIGNED a $105,480,000 contract, K-Mart is ASKING for a $87 million contract, that's a huge difference.
Please read Vintage's 1st post in this thread to learn more about this.

 

Actually duncan signed a 122 million contract..

 

hmm... that's not what I found... but I could be wrong..
It doesn't really matter anyway, K-mart's amount is not even close to what Duncan is getting, and that was my point.

 

u can't really put grant hill up in the top 25 players, because he isn't in there.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">And just to put it to rest here is the list:

First the obvious players, who are by far better than K-Mart: (*in no particular order)

Jason Kidd
Tracy McGrady
Ben Wallace
Paul Pierce
Antoine Walker
Allen Iverson
Baron Davis
Jamal Mashburn
Gilbert Arenas
Jerry Stackhouse
Jermaine O'neal
Ron Artest
Shareef Abdur Rahim
Eddie Curry
Jalen Rose
Donyell Marshall
Alan Houston
Antonio McDyess
Caron Butler
Brian Grant
Eddie Jones
Vince Carter
Grant Hill
Ricky Davis
Zydrunas Ilgauskas

Already there is 25, and this list has yet to include this year's rookie group. Lebron, Darko, etc.

And just for good measure, Richard Hamilton, Eric Snow, Glenn Robinson, Desmond Mason, Al Harrington, Jonathan Bender, Theo Ratliff, Jason Terry...</div>
that whole list could be debatable, but for the most part, i agree. :thumbsup:

 

Ofcourse we could go on and on about who's better and who's not, but that's subjective. I suggest we take a look at an objective source and compare these players by using the www.nba.com efficiency calculator (http://www.nba.com/statistics/efficiency.html) over the 2002/2003 season:

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">
Tracy McGrady 28.80
Jermaine O'neal 23.74
Paul Pierce 22.91
Ben Wallace 22.84
Jason Kidd 22.81
Shareef Abdur Rahim 21.44
Allen Iverson 20.85
Jamal Mashburn 19.88
Vince Carter 18.47
Jason Terry 18.26
Grant Hill 18.07
Gilbert Arenas 18.04
Eddie Jones 17.87
Kenyon Martin 17.86
Glenn Robinson 17.68
Donyell Marshall 17.59
Jerry Stackhouse 17.27
Zydrunas Ilgauskas 17.12
Ricky Davis 17.10
Antoine Walker 17.08
Brian Grant 16.94
Jalen Rose 16.62
Baron Davis 16.62
Eric Snow 16.55
Allan Houston 16.27
Ron Artest 16.09
Desmond Mason 14.83
Richard Hamilton 14.77
Theo Ratliff 14.67
Caron Butler 14.33
Al Harrington 12.30
Eddie Curry 10.32
Earl Boykins 8.62
Jonathan Bender 7.26
Antonio McDyess no games played in 2002/2003
</div>

Seeing this list, how are the players mentioned by shapecity 'far better' than K-mart?

 

That list by shape is a joke. Eddy Curry? Allan Houston? Donyell Marshall? Brian Grant? Vince "I can't stay healthy" Carter. Caron Butler? Antonio McDyess? How can McDyess and Carter be better when they haven't even produced for their teams the past couple seasons? For the good measure list....Theo Ratliff? Desmond Mason? Al Harrington? Jonathan Bender? This is a joke, right?

 

Youre judging players based on EFFICIANCY RANKINGS???? oh yea! thats a GREAT system! going by that system Shareef is the 6th best player in the East and Ben Wallace is the FOURTH!! rancked higher than Baron Davis Ricky Davis Jerry Stackhouse and Antoine Walker who are all rated lower than kenyon martin. thats a joke. if thats your system fofr deciding who the best players are than it makes me think u dont even know basketball. Ill post wjhat i said earlier again incase u missedd it though I dont expect u top respond because it kind of proves your side wrong that kenyon Martin is an elite power foraward or any kind of star east or west.

Lets start with a guy you say is obviously not nearly as good as Kmart and isnt getting 87 million dollars. Antoine Walker is a better player who does more different things for his team? how many tripple doubles does Kmart have? oh Im sorry thats too harsh. how many games does Kmart even get up to 5 assists? thats how many toine has averaged over teh last few years. And Im still waiting for someone to prove to me this great discrepancy in rebounding. u keep saying how much better kmart is of a rebounder than toine. He had himself a nice career year in rebounds this year. ooh lala. 8 rebounds a game. that many? all while getting a "whopping" 16 points a game as his teams main scoring option. well antoine this year had a flukey 7. 2 rebounds per game. why is it flukey? cause antoine has NEVER averaged under 8 rebounds a game. in fact, prior to this year, there was only ONE season in which Antoine averagde less rebounds than kmarts career high. But he has averaged over 10 rebounds in a season in which he also averagde 22 points a game. how many times has Kmart averagde a double double over a year? oh thats right NONE! last year Kmart averaged a whopping FIVE coutem FIVE.30 rebounds a game! oh yea, he's a 20-10 guy in the making. a real ssssssssssuperstar Antoines career average is 20.8 points per game. 4 points higher than Kmarts career high. and Kmart is his teams first scoring option. Toine makes his 20 a game contribution all while being the number two scorer to Paul Pierce (I'll bet magicfrankie thinks KMart is better than pierce to. hehe....we cant blame him for trying can we guys) All that in itself is sufficeint proof that Kmart isn't on the same level as Walker. but I haven't even mentioned the intabgibles that Walker brings to the table that Kmart couldnt even imagine putting his finger on. Antoine is a team leader on teh court and on the bench (many say he could be a coach in this league when hes done if he wants to). When he talks his teammates listen and he actually tells them things that help their game. Kmart preffers to leap around, pound his chest, and ask jason kidd what to do whne things are down (or start pouting and bithcing at his teammates). Antoine Walker was in the league leaders in 12 NBA categorys this year. Kmart was in 4.

Lets compare Kmart to some other real stars shall we?

Antawn Jamison. He's played on some really good rebounding teams in Golden State but still has managed to get comparable rebounds to the "great rebounding KMart". he has a better career high and a much better career low and a slightly better career average. And he's NEVER had less offensive rebounds in a season than kmart had in his best year. He's also more durable. In the last three seasons, Jamison has averaged 82 StARTS a year. Kenyon Martin has never even played in 80 games in a season. Kenyon certainly gets the nod over Antawn for defense. he has slightly more blocks and slightly more steals but thats where the closeness between them ends when you look at scoring. Antawn Jamisons career average is also 4 points higher than Kmarts career high. Jamison has averaged about 25 points a game (24.9 ppg) in a season (in which he played all 82 games) almost ten points higher than Kmarts career high. Antawn Jamison has hit 20-plus points 182 times, 30-plus 46 times, 40-plus five times and two 50- plus efforts (in back to back games) whats Kmarts career high? oh yea. 35 points. How many times has he even got over 30 points in a game? not a whole lot. Antawn was in the league leaders in 10 NBA categorys this year. Kmart was in 4.


Im not going to insult your intellegence be even bothering to compare Kmarts numbers to guys like Jermaine Oneal, Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowvitski, Chris Webber, and Tim Duncan although I'd be more than happy to if you wanna see what a real max contract worthy players numbers look like but is it really nessecary? all u have to do is whatch thosed guys play and u know theres no contest.

so lets try something easier on Kmart shall we? certainly everyone in the workd knows kmart blows non perrenial all star popwer forwards out of the water right? guys like say, Pau Gasol???.....wellllll not quite.

Gasols only been in the league for two years. He wasn't the number one pick in the draft like Kenyon Martin, but he was rookie of the year for his class. what did Kmart get for rebounds over his first two years? 7.4, and 5.3. Gasol had 8.9 rebounds last year and slipped allllll the way down to 8.8 this year. (boy hes on the way out huh?) and both years Gasol ot more offensive rebounds than Kmarts ever gotten. In college, Kmart was seen as the next great NBA shot blocker. He's averaged 1. 3 since he's been in the league. Pau Gasol averaged over 2 blocks a game his first year and 1.80 his second year, more than Kmart has ever gotten. Gasol also has more assists than Kmarrt but well ignore that for K's sake. Gasols career FG% is over .510%. Kmarts career high is .470% and yes Gasols career scoring average is 4 points higher than Kmarts. Gasol was in the league leaders (top 20) in 16 NBA categorys this year. Kmart was in 4.


well then CERTAINLY kenyon martin must be far and away better than a wasteoid like Shareef Abdur Rahim. whos only been selected to one all star team and has never even been in the playoffs right? ummmm.....


Shareed Abdur Rahims career scoring average is (why odes this feel like a pattern?) 4 points higher than Kenyon Martins career high. he has averaged 20+ points a game 5 times and has never averaged less than Kmarts career high and his career FG% is 4 points higher than Kmarts. only once has he averaged less assists than Kmarts career high and that was in his first season. Shareef also bested Kmarts career high in rebounds 4 times. He had over 10 a game in one season and over 9 a game in 2 others. He has played in 80+ games a season 5 times which Kmart has never done. This year Shareef was in teh league leaders in 13 NBA categorys. Kmart was in 4....


I know thats a long post. you see I have a lot of information proving that Kmart isnt better than a lot of the people he gets more credit than and I put a lot of it in there. I'm sure its gonna go over the heads of a few 4th grade reading level guys (cough cough, magicfrankie) but the folks who actually bother to read will be in agreement with me if they arent already. sorry Kmart fans but it had to be said.

 

Shaq
Duncan
Garnett
Bryant
McGrady
Davis
Francis
Payton
Webber
Nowitzki
O'Neal
Kidd
Iverson
Pierce
Walker
Wallace(
Wallace&reg;
Ilgauskas
Finley
Nash
Van Exel
Gasol
Stojakovic
Marion
Marbury
Malone
Allen&reg;
Brand


Debateable:
Jamison
Odom
Miller(
Ming
Stoudamire
Abdur-Rahim

Theres a list...........

Is Kmart top 25? Not yet. Will he be? Probably. Will he get paid like a top 25 player? Most likely.

And for this topic, thats all that matters. Since we are talking about his extension, it will be a wopper of one.....he will get paid.....NJ will keep him......

 

vintage, we need a list for just the east, not the whole nba.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">These players are all better than Kenyon Martin.

Eddy Curry, Al Harrington, Jonathan Bender, Desmond Mason, Caron Butler are all superior players to Martin. I see all these players getting even better in the next 2 years, but I don't see how Martin can improve his game. He simply does not have the shooting touch or fundamentals. Martin relies solely on his jumping and aggression, but his overall basketball skill is less than the above mentioned.

It's a joke you think he's better than Allan Houston, McDyess, and Vince Carter. Allan Houston is one of the best pure shooters in the game and can score anywhere on the court. Antonio McDyess & Vince Carter might be injured a lot, but they are still better players. This is not who would you rather have, these are a list of players who are simply better than Kenyon Martin from a basketball skill point of view.

Theo Ratliff, Brian Grant, and Donyell Marshall are all better than Martin. Their games are more polished on both ends of the court. Theo Ratliff might be a stretch, but he's a superior shot blocker and rebounder than Martin. Neither of them are threat on offense, so I give Ratliff the edge over him. Brian Grant is stronger and more tenacious than K-Mart. He gets double doubles consistently and does a lot of the dirty work for the Heat. I actually think K-Mart will end up being a similar player to Grant, but Kenyon doesn't have the consistent jumper Grant has. Brian Grant is a true power forward and has been playing out of position most of his career, and still does a great job. Both are Warriors, but Grant does what a power forward should do, rebound on both ends of the floor, set hard picks on guards, sacrifice his body against much larger players, and hit the occassional mid range jumper. Grant has learned to let the game come to him, but Martin still forces on offense leading to senseless turnovers and offensive fouls. Donyell Marshall is an underrated player, but this guy has all the skills. He can score, defend, and rebound better than Kenyon Martin. He can shoot the 3pt shot, and has a solid back to the basket post up game. Last year he averaged 13 & 9, as the 4th option on the Bulls. Martin on the otherhand scored more at 16ppg, but he is the 1st or 2nd option on the Nets, and he only had 8.3rpg.</div>


great points. a very well thought out and articulated post. I think thats the last we'll be hearing about Kenyon Martin being a top 25 player in the east (he wouldnt crack the top 30-35 in the west). He shouldnt get paid like hes better than he is untill he proves he can score his own shot consistantly and become more versatile and be an actual NBA force in any aspect of the game

 

If were going to be discussing how Brian friggin Grant is better than Kenyon then there's no point in trying to argue. This topic is done.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">Theo Ratliff, Brian Grant, and Donyell Marshall are all better than Martin. Their games are more polished on both ends of the court. Theo Ratliff might be a stretch, but he's a superior shot blocker and rebounder than Martin. Neither of them are threat on offense, so I give Ratliff the edge over him. Brian Grant is stronger and more tenacious than K-Mart. He gets double doubles consistently and does a lot of the dirty work for the Heat. I actually think K-Mart will end up being a similar player to Grant, but Kenyon doesn't have the consistent jumper Grant has. Brian Grant is a true power forward and has been playing out of position most of his career, and still does a great job. Both are Warriors, but Grant does what a power forward should do, rebound on both ends of the floor, set hard picks on guards, sacrifice his body against much larger players, and hit the occassional mid range jumper. Grant has learned to let the game come to him, but Martin still forces on offense leading to senseless turnovers and offensive fouls. Donyell Marshall is an underrated player, but this guy has all the skills. He can score, defend, and rebound better than Kenyon Martin. He can shoot the 3pt shot, and has a solid back to the basket post up game. Last year he averaged 13 & 9, as the 4th option on the Bulls. Martin on the otherhand scored more at 16ppg, but he is the 1st or 2nd option on the Nets, and he only had 8.3rpg.</div>
very well put. brian grant also scores without getting shots set up for him by the league's best point guard